For those who say it is too hard to win with Warmonger/Domination/Autocracy

Hi there,

I have been reading a lot of post's regarding BNW and how it is impossible to win by being a war monger or winning a domination style victory. I do agree it can be a challenge, the main obstacle is keeping your happiness as high up as possible.

I play mostly on Immortal and Deity and I can win pretty much any game via domination victory. You can use really any civ, however Germany and Poland are very good.
------------------------------------------------Okay here we go !

In the early game you want to focus on culture growth and production you dont need to go too wide, its better to go tall with a few good cities with good resources. ONE VERY IMPORTANT THING make sure your capitol city is on a coast and if possible have your other cities on the coastline as well.( ill explain why later)

I recommend basically ignoring technology early as you are going to be able to steal so many techs that its pointless to be one of the technology leaders. Culture and gaining policies is the key, go for tradition and complete it.

Next up, you may be tempted to go to war early however I would just go with a minimal defensive army for the earlier turns to try boost your culture/production/growth. Around four archers and a spearman should be more then enough d for awhile. (If you know how to cycle back and fight properly)

One very important thing is to avoid getting writing, dont bother grabbing it until one of the very last early techs, focus on others first.

Now you need to start planning ahead, seek out the other war mongering factions that are likely to go Autocracy and start an early friendship with them. In my experience egypt, japan, mongolia and some of the native or war like civs go Autocracy more often then others. Get your trade routes up and I would not bother with too many early wonders as they get picked up fast, I do notice that you can get the Collosus before the AI usually and its amazing if used properly.

Once the tradition tree is done, It will depend on what I go next, ill usually grab the opener in commerce for +25% gold in the capitol. The extremely important tree to get is honor though. You cant win without completing the honor tree for its bonuses in combat and the amazing gold per unit killed which will keep your war machine moving later.

Even on Deity somehow I am usually one of the first to adopt and idealogy, as typically I have three tall cities and I fast buy the factories right away. If you are pretty far behind on tech, grab the tech stealer, if not grab the happiness polices first. One other must do is to grab exploration and the first policy it has for increased happiness for every lighthouse,harbor and seaport, THAT POLICY IS AMAZING !.

Even if you sitting at 15-20+ happiness keep on grabbing the + happiness policies and buildings/wonders/religion or pantheon bonuses if possible. I usually bank up until I am at 60+ happiness to start my blitzkreig as you will be doing a lot of razing and puppetting later. Blitzing one or two civs and taking over their main cities pretty much locks up the game. Sometimes if you have a really tough civ to deal with try to get the atom bomb before he gets bomb shelters and lay waste to his lands before you move in the meat grinder.


Anyways as for a few key points since this is kind of a jumbled mess...I have to get going soon but will post back later and maybe edit this.

-Go tall, get tradition first.

-Ignore technology, focus on culture/production/growth and commerce in that order.


-Build your capitol on a coast line, also build your other cities on the coast if possible as the exploration happiness policy is pretty much a must have and usually wins games.

-Finish the honor tree before you start your big war, as you wont win without the bonuses even if some of the policies suck.

-Go Autocracy and focus on the happiness boosting policies first. Also, make sure to build the PRORA first, as you cant win domination without it.

-Keep stealing techs, as it doesnt matter too much to have a high science your spies will be getting you techs so fast, especially with the policy for 50% increase.

-Mass up and blitzkrieg who looks to be the easiest target raze everything but their capitol unless it has a resource you need.

I hope some of these hints prove to be helpful!

I don't think much of anyone is saying that domination is too hard now? The main argument is that the gold-starved beginning of the game makes early warmongering far more difficult than its ever been in Civ V, which tips the balance of power away from civs that benefit from early UU's like the Huns or Celts. Based on what you've listed in your strategy here it seems you would agree with that point.

I quite like a bit of early war, but you have to be sure you pick the right opponent. Right now I am smashing America with English longbows, and not getting much of a diplo hit. He was planting cities way to close, and anyway I was looking for a reason to check out longbows.

I agree with the Tradition start, and tend to go for exploration too. I must admit, whenever I have filled out Honour, which I pretty much always do once I've got a few already, I have loved the gold. I think I may make that choice more often, as the upgrade costs can be high and I like to keep well-trained units.

I also have kept my trade routes internal, growing with food, then later making for workshops to get the extra hammers. I only have two cities, so they feed each other and another route plies the CS's. As for the cities, they are puppets. I will be razing the remaining ones when I go for WW2/3/4....

Longbows aren't really an early war. I'm thinking more of an Ancient/Classical rush.

Would be nice to see some screenshots, when you get the time. 60+ happiness is science fiction to me. I take it you play on islands/continents, mostly?

I agree that mid to late game warmongering is a good way to do it, and i disagree with almost everything else ..

What i like to do is: roll over cannons with land ships, artilleries and bombers. And for that, my friend, I need rationalism. And, if early culture is good, i am definitely getting myself some consulates.

While honor may work on deity, and can be fun too, it isn't optimal.

You will have 150 science at turn 150, while i will have 300 and close (in tech tree) to some real strong units. They will be so strong against AI i won't even need honor.

What is the point of honored cavalry if i can run you over with military academy landships?

And lastly, on deity, you don't choose ideologies. Ideologies choose you .

I disagree with the OP here, i would like to know what times he is winning his domination Victories.

I've only played one full domination game so far out of 24 completed games ( immortal standard settings Pangaea as Poland, I'm not a warmonger but a builder ) Which i sat with 2 nice cities(next to mountain) for the first 180 turns or so until i had the arty(didn't rush arty) + quick teching to bomber + rocket artillery then its just clean up after that. Ended up with a T246 Domination victory. Got a lot of the wonders along the way, and Big Ben + mercantilism + autocracy 33% meant dirt cheap rocket arty + bomber spam. After conquering the world i was still in positive happiness.

I disagree with ignoring science, i still feel early national college is to good to pass up. ( sub turn 70 ) I tend to use spies to steal a couple of medieval/Renaissance techs like gunpowder while i beeline science related stuff. I went autocracy and because i was Poland and had 2 cities i could grab all the good stuff in the policy trees after tradition/rationalism. And just spammed powered up RA's all game long until i went on my conquering spree. Game was cake. I was tech lead by Renaissance and no one came close once i was spamming RA's + had scholasticism as a bonus. Ally with Culture states first up, that brings in much culture.

Arachnofiend said:

Longbows aren't really an early war. I'm thinking more of an Ancient/Classical rush.

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For that I would choose Assyria, and do the same. It's actually less fun because it's too easy, I reckon!

early war is possible if you know how to play the game. In my current game, i took out the Sioux with horsemen and catapults. I dipped into -12 happiness while razing a couple of cities, but am back up in the positives with 5 cities, and 1 puppet (Tradition/Honor start). No external trade routes, and still positive GPT. Playing on Emperor though, using the Songhai. Lots of gold from taking 3 of Sioux cities.

Some tips to get this to work:
- You definitely need the land to support a warmonger build (lots of unique luxuries and gold producing tiles).
- Don't neglect markets. Tech for it, and build them in your cities early.
- Honor is ok to get as a secondary policy tree (work on the right side of the tree). Military Caste is a great policiy for grabbing early policy. Tradition works best when paired with Honor.
- Don't neglect the National College. You can focus on building it while your other cities start to build up an army. Get NC up and running so that you don't fall behind while warmongering.

From what I've observed in my domination attempts so far, there doesn't seem to be much of a diplomatic hit for accepting cities in peace deals, especially compared to what happens if you're conquering cities. With this in mind, while an ancient/classical warmongering rush to take a capital may be unfeasible, picking a fight with a neighbor can still be a good way to exercise your army and impede a rival. Smash his army, steal his workers, pillage his improvements, but wait to claim territory until the peace talks. This lets you make some in-roads without causing everyone on the continent to hate you.

Arachnofiend said:

Longbows aren't really an early war. I'm thinking more of an Ancient/Classical rush.

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Quote is spot-on:

Crossbow rush is still viable; composite-bow rush is now far more difficult to make work without some luck (gold ruin huts, lots of different types of luxes to trade in starting area, etc.). Composites run into the problem of simply not having an economy that can fund everything that early, and this problem is doubled when one realizes that your closest neighbor (and likely, your best civ to target and attack first) is now, since BNW, one of the few ways to get early gold via trade-routes. Even if you aren't trading with that close neighbor/preferred target, the issue is they may raid trade-routes you make with other civs.

Hence, now I rarely rush anyone in the early game unless they have a pitiful army (more common than in G&K), or I have a practically invulnerable source of gold (such as a trade-partner who is on the opposite side of me from the victim, and who has just DoF-ed me recently).

Moriarte said:

Would be nice to see some screenshots, when you get the time. 60+ happiness is science fiction to me. I take it you play on islands/continents, mostly?

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You'd be surprised, but I got my +100 happy achie after over 200h of playing by a wide+domination win (when I'm going for tall+science/diplo win 90% of time) on Fractal/Immortal/Large. Order happy policies + liberty + some sacked wonders + 6 per lux + lighthouse etc. kept me at 70+ happiness before finishing last 2 capitals. Although it popped before taking pop penalty, on screen to choose puppet/annex, but that's details .

Playing Tall I'm usually very low on till Ideologies boom, then staying ~10-20+ depending if I care to trade for all luxes remaining on map.