Goz8 - Silence is Golden

gozpel · Dec 5, 2004

I just as well throw in my third and last whacky idea at this stage, only because I had a few weeks of busy times before and now I'm ready to play a lot again.

This is a semi-defiant game on Deity (of course).

We can NEVER open up the other civs diplo screens, not even to peak. I trust you guys there. We won't give in to demands, (we basically don't know what that blabbling is about, it's not our language) So we say NO!

If another civ wants to trade something for our gold, then you can sort out the deal to our favor.

If another civ establish embassy with us, then we can talk at any time. But we can decide if we want to say Yes or No in negotiations/demands as we understand what their interpreters are saying. We can't establish embassies, ever.

I chosed Sumeria, so we might stand a chance early with Enkidu warriors, very cheap at 10 shields and I haven't really played them much. We will have an early GA though, but will that stop us?

Maps and stuff we better decide as a team, but I'm for either archie or continents on small map = 5 opponents. 60% archipelago sounds interesting

Please be VERY comfy on Deity and some kinda AW, as we might wind up in a lot of trouble.

ThERat · Dec 5, 2004

sounds very interesting, but I guess the VERY comfy on Deity disqualifies me, a pity though, cos I like your style of play.
anyway in case you can't fill your roster...

gozpel · Dec 5, 2004

Thanks Rat for your interest, this time it will be a slugfest (possibly or more likely probably) and I know you're comfy on Emperor and such. This might be a bit over your head though, but if people doesn't show up, you have a place reserved

To explain it further, we "might" end up in an AW situation. On deity! No one as far as I know won or even got close to that before. So I need the best of the best for this game, or the craziest like me :lol:

I tried AW quite a few times myself on Deity and I have my strategies to deal with it, but this has to be a team effort where we listen and execute. (I yet have to win a game on AW-Deity)

Only comfy Deity players apply then, since they have been through the roughest and toughest times imaginable.

And sometimes they made it

Ankka · Dec 5, 2004

lurker's comment: AFAIK Zwingli did win an AWD... let me find a link for you.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=55545

And it appears a RBC player Urugharakh won it too...

Good luck, anyway.

grahamiam · Dec 5, 2004

comfy on diety but AW is creaky. did handys' XAWM tiny (handy9) but that was a walk-in-the-park due to the skill of the other players. never did AW higher than that. however, i'm sure that defiant can be done @ diety with a lot of pain, so sign me up!

small, continents sounds good. i couldn't commit the time to a bigger game atm.

sorry, but i need some more 'plaining on these points

If another civ wants to trade something for our gold, then you can sort out the deal to our favor.

I understand this to mean that if a civ contacts us on the IBT, say "wanna swap TM's?", we can go on and haggle for something completely different. is this right?

If another civ establish embassy with us, then we can talk at any time

so, if civA establishes an embassy, then we can trade as normal with civA, right?

But we can decide if we want to say Yes or No in negotiations/demands as we understand what their interpreters are saying.

huh?

TimBentley · Dec 5, 2004

It might be good not to use MapStat or CivAssist so you can't see the other civs' techs, etc.

LKendter · Dec 5, 2004

What about troops inside our borders? That is often part of defiance.

Sir Bugsy · Dec 5, 2004

Sign me up.........

gozpel · Dec 5, 2004

Ah yes, I forgot those classics, so I'm not so inventive as I thought. Thanks Ankka.

I understand this to mean that if a civ contacts us on the IBT, say "wanna swap TM's?", we can go on and haggle for something completely different. is this right?

Exactly! But I guess we will get demands instead of trading chances

so, if civA establishes an embassy, then we can trade as normal with civA, right?

That is also a longshot, the AI almost never establish embassy with me on higher levels. I'm not sur about this rule though, we can always exclude it if it's too cheesy?

The answer to Huh, grahamiam, is a mystery to me to.

I did some quick notes in notepad last night and bungled up the copy/paste. I think I meant that we can choose to give in to demands to an "embassy-civ" if they come and want our gold, which could be good if we want to continue a trade with them. Or something. :lol:

What about troops inside our borders? That is often part of defiance.

Good point, Lee. We can decide when that comes in to effect, like a certain year/tech or right away. I think it will become nasty if we choose it from start, but if the team wants that, who am I to disagree. But we certainly want that in some shape.

And as TimBentley said, no Mapstat or CivAssist. :thumbsup:

Roster:

grahamiam
Sir Bugsy
LKendter?
?
gozpel

LKendter · Dec 5, 2004

Before I decide about the question mark after my name I want to see the final ruleset.

If another civ establish embassy with us, then we can talk at any time

I still don't understand this one, can you try it again?

Sir Bugsy · Dec 5, 2004

I don't think we should be able to start a conversation... ever.

gozpel · Dec 5, 2004

Ok, we set it in stone. We never start discussions, ever.

Why would I call it Silence is Golden otherwise? :confused:

I think I went cheesy for a moment there, thanks for steering me in the right direction.

So no embassies, no talking and the last thing we still need to discuss further...

When do we do the total defiance part? Right away? We have those impressive Enkidu's and I believe I picked them for exactly that reason. So I suggest, from the start.

Remember we can't research as fast as the AI for a very long time, if ever. And I never wanted this to be a true AW, I was hoping for some chance to gain a tech or two now and again. This means, we can get some in peace-deals and so on.

I still want the part of AI's contacting us on friendly terms and want to give us something for our gold (like Wheel for 430g or whatever) and we can haggle then.

The thing I wanted with embassies, was the right to sign alliances with Civ's that had embassy with us. But if we want to be in deeper trouble, I leave that out too.

Does that sound alright?

hotrod0823 · Dec 6, 2004

So if you can't talk to the others then you can't kick them out.

Am I right?

That won't be a true defiant game.

Also, the only way to declare war would be by attacking, (or getting caught stealing and the like). Good luck avoiding the dogpiles (or maybe that is what you want :hammer:

). Sounds like a AWD game in disguise for sure.

Hotrod

grahamiam · Dec 7, 2004

ok, i have an idea. let's try to frame the rules via Arathorn's ruleset as follows:

Tactless: You may never initiate diplomacy. If the AI initiates diplomacy ~~you must either reject or accept their offer. No haggling.~~ then you may haggle.

Defiant: You must never give in to a demand from an opponent, that is, you always reject demands for tribute. You may never ally, sign a Right of Passage, MPP, or embargo with another civilization. You may never pay for peace (a peace treaty must either be straight-up or the opponent gives a concession to you. A deal where a tech costs 20 gpt normally and you pay 10 gpt for that tech as part of a peace treaty is fine). Any troops on your soil must be given a boot order every turn. ~~No capturing foreign cities or demanding them in diplomacy. No foreign workers merged into existing cities. If an AI razes one of your cities, that civ must be eliminated.~~ Defient rules kick in immediately or at turn 50 or whatever we can agree on.

i think this gets us a little closer to goz's intention, while giving us a clear rule set to follow. how does everyone feel about this?

Sir Bugsy · Dec 9, 2004

I like G-man's rule set.

gozpel · Dec 10, 2004

Thanks grahamiam!

That's what we go for then, if we can get enough players for a team

Trespassing -> You may never initiate diplomacy. This means we can't kick them out, so I guess we have to block to keep them out? Or do we ignore this?

grahamiam · Dec 10, 2004

tresspassing is what we really need to figure out. i say we just don't talk to them. if they cruise thru, so be it. I can just cross out that line too.

Sir Bugsy · Dec 10, 2004

How about we ignor the AI until they get a unit within striking distance of one of our cities, then demand them to leave.

ThERat · Dec 11, 2004

if you can't find another player, Gozpel, you can judge maybe from the turns i play in those other SG's whether I would be ok
your idea is quite whacky, sounds fun

Kaiser_Berger · Dec 11, 2004

I'll also toss my name out there if you need a player, but since I'm already in your other two active games you can give preference to a different player if you wish. Whatever works best.

Goz8 - Silence is Golden

Couch-potato (fortified)

Deity

Couch-potato (fortified)

Deity

In debt to Mr. Geisel

Deity

Exterminate, exterminate, exterminate!!!

Civ.D.

Couch-potato (fortified)

Exterminate, exterminate, exterminate!!!

Civ.D.

Couch-potato (fortified)

Deity

In debt to Mr. Geisel

Civ.D.

Couch-potato (fortified)

In debt to Mr. Geisel

Civ.D.

Deity

Terran Emporer

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