R & T T3 D2 - Trade Options for 280AD

Rik has asked me to start this discussion. It's the middle of the night for him; it's 4:39pm for me.

Below is a list of trades for us to consider. I have left out monarchy trades as we don't need that technology. Please discuss any trades that you like!

As of the latest turnchat, we have 1843g and are making 62gpt.

The Netherlands
They Give: Peace, The Republic, Feudalism
We Give: Peace, 17g

They Give: Peace, The Republic, Monotheism, 28g, 1gpt
We Give: Peace

They Give: Peace, Feudalism, Monotheism
We Give: Peace, 41g

The Republic
Portugal Gives: The Republic
We Give: Construction, Currency, Gold
(Gold = 73g or 5gpt)

Beaucoup $$$
The republic and monotheism each cost about or over 1000g from the Mayans, China, Persia, and Spain.

Selling Techs
We can sell currency to Japan for 67g

I've just posted A SIMILAR THREAD HERE.

Actually I recommend we take Feudalism and Monotheism from the Dutch in exchange for 41 gold and peace; and then trade with Portugal or another civ to obtain The Republic.

I like the first Netherland's deal, but is there anyway we can get Monotheism as well by adding in some money? Then we can sell it to some nations that don't have it.

Alternatively the Dutch will give:

Peace, Fuedalism and Monotheism for 41 gold

I suggest we should sell the currency to Japan and use that gold and a little extra to buy republic from Portugal. That way we can get Feudalism and Monotheism from the Dutch in exchange for peace. I think that is best, IMHO.

No. I disagree. Sorry. the 1000g is part of a war chest for knights. We must keep it and build on it.

Get Mono and Feudalism from the Dutch.
Then we need to see which is the best deal for Republic. We need a single turn session to get Mon and Feud first.

Furiey said:

Alternatively the Dutch will give:

Peace, Fuedalism and Monotheism for 41 gold

Click to expand...

I am all in favor of this. After that, republic can be obtained from Portugal, Maya or China for techs (Portugal will sell it for construction, currency and 73 gold). If Maya want to trade republic for feudalism, then that might be best. They have a monopoly on engineering and can trade for feudalism at any time. We can also acquire Monarchy, just for completeness.
Don't make per turn deals with China please . Everything else should be fine.

Furiey said:

Alternatively the Dutch will give:

Peace, Fuedalism and Monotheism for 41 gold

Click to expand...

I edited that into the first post. I like that deal... Thanks for bringing it up!

The External Consulate of course is responsible for negotiating a peace treaty, and and a poll is up HERE to poll the External Consulate's recommendation for peace.

That recommendation is: we take from the Dutch Monotheism and Feudalism, and in exchange give them 41 gold pieces.

The one-turn chat idea is interesting and probably a good idea; but that's a different poll. Also, how to acquire the Republic is another interesting discussion, but in the opinion of the External Consulate the subject for a separate trade after we negotiate peace.

The Peace deal being voted on is Fuedalism and Monotheism for 41 gold. So looking at deals in addition to this:

There are only 3 civs we can get Republic (without just paying in gold) from:
In comparison the Persians (the only ones with Feudalism we're not at War with) want 25gpt and 1630 gold for it! Selling Feudalism or Monotheism once we have them for Republic would be far less than it's worth!

The Portugal deal costs only 73 gold and some old techs and we could then revolt IF we want to revolt immediately that is.

We can see this now, the precise numbers will be known after the peace is made, but with flexibilty in the instructions...

Similarly Japan has Monarchy and wants 847 gold for it - I'm sure he would accept Currency and Republic (currency knocks approx 400 gold off the price) he may even go for Republic on it's own.

There are issues with a special session that I have posted in the Peace deal thread, so if we can see these deals now can we not do them, revolt if that is what we want and then stop, or continue until we do wish to revolt?

just remember: the second we get Feudalism, rush Isaac over to Regentham and get Sunny Ts built ASAP.

Furiey said:

The Peace deal being voted on is Fuedalism and Monotheism for 41 gold. So looking at deals in addition to this:

There are only 3 civs we can get Republic (without just paying in gold) from:

Maya for Feudalism (they currently want 981 gold to compare prices)
China for Feudalism (947 gold to compare prices)
Portugal for Construction + Currency + 73 gold (981 gold to compare prices)​

In comparison the Persians (the only ones with Feudalism we're not at War with) want 25gpt and 1630 gold for it! Selling Feudalism or Monotheism once we have them for Republic would be far less than it's worth!

The Portugal deal costs only 73 gold and some old techs and we could then revolt IF we want to revolt immediately that is.

We can see this now, the precise numbers will be known after the peace is made, but with flexibilty in the instructions...

Similarly Japan has Monarchy and wants 847 gold for it - I'm sure he would accept Currency and Republic (currency knocks approx 400 gold off the price) he may even go for Republic on it's own.

There are issues with a special session that I have posted in the Peace deal thread, so if we can see these deals now can we not do them, revolt if that is what we want and then stop, or continue until we do wish to revolt?

Click to expand...

So how about:
1. Do the Dutch deal for Feud+Mono.
2. Buy Monarchy from Japan for 847 gold.
3. Sell Monarchy + Currency to Portugal for Republic. Portugal currently charges less than Currency+600 for Republic.
4. Sell Republic (+ Currency if needed) to Japan to get our gold back.

This way, we will not pay gold except 41 to the Dutch, and only help some backward civs. We keep Construction out of Portugese hands for now, so they cannot get aqueducts.

That's a lot of gold though; we need 120 gold per knight upgrade.

zyxy said:

So how about:
1. Do the Dutch deal for Feud+Mono.
2. Buy Monarchy from Japan for 847 gold.
3. Sell Monarchy + Currency to Portugal for Republic. Portugal currently charges less than Currency+600 for Republic.
4. Sell Republic (+ Currency if needed) to Japan to get our gold back.

Click to expand...

Call that Option 1

Option 2 is:

1. Do the Dutch deal for Feud+Mono.
2. Buy Republic from Portugal for Construction + Currency + 87 gold.
3. Sell Republic (+ Currency if needed) to Japan for Monarchy.

In terms of gold cost (excluding the Dutch deal 41 gold) the 2 options compare as follows:
Option 2 will cost us 87 gold
Option 1 will initally cost us 847 gold which we will hopefully get back in step 4 giving us a net cost of 0 gold

I propose to obtain The Republic from Portugal for the obsolete techs + lump gold. They'll soon get them anyway, so why not be the ones to benefit from it ?

After that we make peace with the Dutch for -especially- Feudalism + what else they want to give. Maya have a monopoly on Engineering, but lack Feudalism. If we can obtain Engineering through trade with them (which includes Feudalism from our side) we can use it to obtain Monotheism. (For instance, China lacks both Engineering and Feudalism.)
We then have all 1st line Mediavel techs and can then see what civs have techs beyond that. If they have something interesting -thus interesting trades- we can re-discuss how to profit from them the most.

If we do the Portugal trade first to get Republic and want to get Monotheism through trade later, the best deal we can get from the Dutch is

Fuedalism, Monarchy, 28gold, 1gpt.

That's all they have. taking the 1gpt as 20gold that makes 48 gold they give us. For Fuedalism and Monotheism we pay 41 gold, therefore for a cost of only 89 Gold we get Monotheism rather than Monarchy.

Engineering is currently a Monopoly tech. To get Engineering (which we are 10 turns from researching) we would then have to trade Feudalism which is far from a monopoly tech. I'm pretty sure this would be expensive - very!

We then do the China deal to get Monotheism, with Fuedalism and Engineering I'm sure we could do that, but China only has 7 gold and will not pay 1gpt for even 1000 gold. We would not recoup our costs of buying Engineering as a Monopoly there.

I would therefore prefer to get Monotheism and Fuedalism frrom the Dutch for 41 gold and peace and either Option 1 or 2 from then on. If we then wished to look at buying Engineering that deal would still be there, but I'm not inclined to buy it at monopoly prices when we will complete it ourselves in 10 turns.

Option two gets us all of the techs that we need without much cost. I'd choose that one.