SGOTM7 - Team Bede

SGOTM7 - Team Bede

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Map Parameters
Playable Civ - Ottomans
World size - 80 wide by 80 high. (Small)
Difficulty - Deity
Landform - Archepelago
Barbarians - Roaming

The map is handbuilt, and therefore may not have a standard configuration.

Please visit the following links to ensure that you are adequately prepared for this game. The SGOTM Reference thread contains all the files and links you need to install the small mod for PTW/C3C and rather larger mod for vanilla. There are test saves too so you can check your installation.

The GOTM Reference Thread.
SGOTM Reference Thread.
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Download Save from Server


This Months' sponsored variant is Always War Deity (AWD) the rules for which are as follows.

1. You must declare war on each Civilisation by the end of the turn you make that contact.
2. You must remain at war with each Civilisation until the end of the game, or until that Civilisation is destroyed.
3. You may trade with a Civilisation on the turn you make contact and before declaring war, but you may not establish any embassies.
4. No turn based (gpt) deals are permitted.
5. You must win by Domination.

Note: PTW and Vanilla players are not permitted to leader rush Great Wonders Before the year 1000BC for this game.

Checking in.

Clambering aboard...

Ironically, I almost signed up for Bede in the signup thread, and now MB places me here. Let's kick butt!

Howdy guys!

AdmK and soul will show up soon I hope.

Looking forward to the acquisition of some territory. :rock on:

@eldar, can you play the first twenty (after suitable discussion of course)? With all those HoF games you're playing you should have those down cold.

checking in

Okay, first 20, once we have the save. Must-remember-we-are-not-Argicultural (I played 3 QSCs as the Maya yesterday...)

[Edit]
What we researching first? Alpha? Alpha-Writing-Lit/Phil+Lit (I'd only go for Phil first with no Com or Sea civs in the game) with a GLib pre-build in our first city would be my choice of line.

as usual im checking i, last but not least.
settle on the spot, worker to BG?
go for phil then lit?
GLib in 1st or 2nd city? will have to see more to know for sure.

ps-what are those quiggley things in the sea? fish?

Settling on spot, worker to Sheep (exactly the same as Cows), those things in the sea are Oysters (+2f, +1g), I have a sequence that pops 2 Warriors and a Settler by 3350BC.

Contrarian opinions highly encouraged.

Thoughts on the Starting location:

Settle in place, those sheep are just cows on plains, so first move is to irrigate em both. By the time thats done, move to the BG I suppose, but that may be in the middle of a fight with our first opponent so worker needs to be covered. The oyster is a just like a FISH in the normal game according to the gotm resources page. An eventual forest chop can be used SW looks like, but that would be around turn 25 if we do the above I think. Forest chop to be used for help on the rax?

Build thoughts: If we settle at the start, a warrior can be built at 3800. Alternatively we can go spear first, ready at (3650?). I like spear first. If we see any enemies that quick, it could be changed to a warrior if needed. Spear first allows us to get to a barracks quicker (assuming spear-spear-walls-barracks rather than warrior-spear-spear-walls-barracks). At some point thereafter we need to scout out our landmass, probably with curraghs and vet pillaging spear-scouts for the interior of the island. A w-w-settler start is a bit risky for my taste; though it makes me think we should skip the walls in the above build order for the settler. I would concur that the second or third settler would be our GL prebuild city.

I think we'll have 1-2 civs on our landmass.

Research: In regards to our first tech, an argument can be made for doing just about any of the first tier (+Iron working) with the exception of CB. I personally like WC for some archers, with alphabet a close second for some curraghs, and the Wheel would be very nice to acquire somehow. I think by the time we get those curraghs out, we can actively seek out our enemies, put them on war buildup, and hurt their research early, rather than avoid contact. By the time they get map making, ASSUMING they have a coastal passage to land on our landmass, we should be able to repel whatever they throw at us, even hoplites. A thought also is to intentionally not meet someone and allow ourselves a later tech trade.

Alphabet-writing-(philo)-Lit after that? I think we can pull monarchy out of the Library in the 500-1000 BC range, but I really dont know how fast everyone will research on an archi map like this, thats just a random guess.

We should trade away Masonry asap so our island sharers will hopefully build the Pyramids for us. Great Library+ captured Pyramids+ random other wonder (Lighthouse would be very very nice, IF we could take our people off troop buildup long enough, and not likely to happen w/ the AI build rates). Golden Age would be best the earlier the better once we get monarchy; waiting for Sipahi would not help us as much. In fact, I dont think we should even get to Sipahi if we play well, i.e. get the Lighthouse (no Astronomy needed), turn off research after chivalry (well it was never on with the GL boost I guess but figuratively speaking), and bang out knights and such. 3 move Sipahis will be less effective on islands. Of course, if the AI takes us to friggin metallurgy/chemistry before getting education, then we can toast em with our UU.

Gameplan:

Expand and take control of our starting island ASAP. Take a hopefully nearby statue of zeus. Raise and replace quite a bit but keep ToA on whatever island its found on. Buildup a 20% sword-20% defender-50% horse-10% cat army. Get knights and win the game. This may be optimistic, but M-B has said this game plays like an Emperor game, so I expect some breaks.

If no island opponents, we should get pottery and expand like crazy.

Ottos start with bronze. we will need lots of spears early. with luck we can trade for WC (which we need for rax right?). Iron, horses, math and the wheel are also important. We will need to do lots of self research. I wouldn't start a Glib prebuild before city 3 or 4. My research pref is IW then alpha.

I like killer's "spear-spear-walls-barracks" but "spear-spear-settler" is good too. Warriors are pretty useless as defenders and since it is AWD we can expect lots of AI warriors coming our way, if we have local neighbors, and we wnat to protect our improvements and workers and while AI warriors may not attack a warrior in a town they will attack a warrior in the open.

Minimize exploration to a quick circuit of the immediate neighborhood (first ring of fog)as at Deity we will meet the neighbors soon enough.

A single dinghy to scout for close by sea lanes and involve the other islands in warfare will be nice too.

Run research at max towards Literature as we can probably get WC from the neighbors in the intro trade before we tell them we are going to use their guts for garters.

'kay. So pointy sticks good, dumb ol' bare-chests bad. I'll put the math in the grinder, er spreadsheet, and see what comes out, but we can certainly get a spear quick - those cows-disguised-as-sheep are powerful tiles in Despotism.

I'm just gonna throw out some points I thought about beforehand .

- If we explore much more than our immediate area early (very early), we may have to face the AI's starting unit stack (bad). I wouldn't explore more than the first ring, but this is debateable.

- If we are on an island, and if there are no viking, we can be 100% safe until Marines by lining the island with warrior and even leaving no units in cities. This is big if there is vikings.

- 3 major AA units are spear/catapult/horses (if resource available). Upgrade these throughout the game.

- I have 2 shot-in-the-dark guesses about landmass (which are probably wrong). 1. an island hopping archiapalego, lots of little islands. 2. us near 1-2 civs, with the others far (suicide galley) away.

- 2 wonders which may be invaluable are Great Library and Great Lighthouse. Definitely need to try for one of them. Hopefully a high production location nearby.

- definitely start on alphabet as philosophy,literature,map making, and republic will be huge. The wheel would be really nice though (hopefully get it in a trade).

- I think I agree to build 2 spear before settler. this will raise the production/size of capitol.

- Feel free to stop if you feel something should be discussed.

- It seems that the most important thing is whether or not someone is on our homeland. It's rex (expansion) vs. military in this case.

- other most important thing - have fun .

A lot of the points I agree and disagree with will really depend on the opening factors. Surrounding land, nearby enemies, etc. All my opinions are subject to change .

As are my opinions. Hopefully if we have a couple AIs on our island we can keep our left flank secure and make them attack across that river.

Hmm. Can we have Beorn-eL-Feared come along and support us, or something?! He just got 3 MGLs in one 10-turn set in eldar04. Now if the RNG is that kind to us....

Like spear, spear, settler. MB said this plays like emperor, so we should have time to get city 2 up.

Spear, spear, settler gets us our 2nd city in 3000BC.
We will have 14 shields towards either walls, rax, or another spear by 3000BC as well.
If we wanted, we could've researched pottery by then as well.

eldar said:

Spear, spear, settler gets us our 2nd city in 3000BC.
We will have 14 shields towards either walls, rax, or another spear by 3000BC as well.
If we wanted, we could've researched pottery by then as well.

Click to expand...

builds seem good.
i also think some minor exploration will be needed (1st ring only) as we wont want any nasty surprises.
wonders - \g\lib and\or GLight would be great, but if i must choose (and its very hard to choose) i would go for the Great Light, as we can research ourselves if we must, and the lighter will prove very effective blocking and controling the AI.

eldar said:

Hmm. Can we have Beorn-eL-Feared come along and support us, or something?! He just got 3 MGLs in one 10-turn set in eldar04. Now if the RNG is that kind to us....

Click to expand...

and as i played before Bjorn and didnt land any MGL's....
im off to the temple. the RNG Gods require a fat sheep be sacrificed.

Spear Numero Uno will be for exploring, and will head back to base ASAP. If he meets anyone, he will say hi, rob them of all of their technology and gold, spit in their face, and do whatever seems appropriate. Probably run right back home.

Spear Numero Duo will of course escort our brave settler.