Civ request: Afrikaners

Greetings Civilians

Im a stout civ supporter, but at this time I don’t have the expertise to design a civ. I there is some one out there who can assist me to design an Afrikaner civilization, I will gladly assist in any way.

Regards

What do you reckon of for leaders - two out of Retief, Kruger and Smuts almost certainly, but which two?

And commandos of course. It's hard to imagine a civ with a more obvious UU

Thank you for the interest.

Good question. All three are significant.

Retief was definitely a leader made a large contribution to the identity of the Afrikaners, although overshadowed by death and Bloedrivier. A true Christian Afrikaner Pioneer.

Paul Kruger had a major impact on the Republics and the Anglo-Boer War, together contributing to Afrikaner identity as an Christian Afrikaner statesman. Some say that he shared in the popularity then with that of Mr Nelson Mandela has today.

Jan Smuts was one of the great driving forces of the League of Nations that became the United Nations. Played a great role in South Africa during the Anglo-Boer War and both World Wars. Although not criticised for not being an Afrikaner Nationalist he was definitely a man before his time. An Afrikaner General and Christian Statesman.

Retief being a my favourite and an example of an Afrikaner Christian, he did not make an significant international contribution in comparison with Kruger and Smuts.

The difference between a Politician and a statesman is that a politician thinks of the next election, whilst a statesman thinks of the next generation.

If I would name the 5 greatest statesmen coming from South Africa, they would be as follows:
Nelson Mandela
Mahatma Gandhi
Paul Kruger
Jan Smuts
PW Botha (Maybe)

But as Afrikaner leaders for CIV4 I would nominate Kruger and Smuts.

Regarding the UU, it seems that you are well informed. The commando actually started during the 'Groottrek'. Militia on horseback, later revered to by the English during the Anglo-Boer War as Mounted Cavalry (Kommando). I also know that its written that the Mounted Cavalry (Kommando) was the best mounted cavalry the English have ever fought against and used guerrilla tactics which was name by the Boers(Afrikaners) as Blits (Blitz) that was studied by the Germans before the WW2.

The Elite Special forces that dominated special forces during the 70' and 80's was known as the Recces(Recce) and were significant for defeating communism in Angola. My opinion is that the culture from the Mounted Cavalry (Kommando) was just brought over to the Recces.

In conclusion:
Paul Kruger
Jan Smuts
Kommando (Mounted Cavalry) as UU.

Please let me know were I can assist.

Regards

I very much like the idea of the Afrikaner being one of the civilisations included, as they had an icredible impact on the world then and now. I also like Smuts as a great leader, but wonder what you would say about Andries Pretorious? He is remembered by most for the battle of Blood River, but he was instrumental at the formation of both the brief Republic of Natalia(?) and the Transvaal or Zuid Afrikaanse Republiek.

He was an established diplomat with regular contact with both British and local African tribes.

But the impact of the Afrikaner is undeniable.

Great day!

You might find some people who can help you in the "Creation & Cusomizations" section. There would be people in that area who could help you with the development side of it, if it interests them.

There is a "New Civilizations" sub section there, but I think that might only be for finished civ mods. Have a look and see (if you haven't allready).

Thank you for the support.

Yes, Andreis Pretorius was a great Afrikaner Commandant-General and no Afrikaner can dispute his greatness. Thael described him as "the ablest leader and most perfect representative of the Emigrant Farmers.

The question is how he compares with Kruger and Smuts? Yes he was a influential and diplomatic in the negotiations with both natives and British, but Kruger and Smuts had a greater International contribution. Both the latter made significant contributions towards the Afrikaners ever struggle for recognition - which I believe Pretorius did as well - but reading history and comparing them, one get the a clear picture that Pretorius is shadowed a bit by Kruger and Smuts.

Cobus, what is your opinion regarding the UU?

Abrie JF Kilian said:

Mahatma Gandhi

Click to expand...

Woohoo man, he was Indian

Maybe will try it... But later... Now here's a lot of work to do.

AndyTerry said:

Woohoo man, he was Indian

Click to expand...

That is what I like about this forum, an opportunity to share info and the opportunity to learn.

My referral was statesmen from South Africa. Gandhi's development as a statesman started in South Africa from 1893–1914. He moved to Natal when he was 24 year old which up to today is sometimes revered to as little India. With the largest Indian community outside of India living in Durban. He continually suffered from stage fright when acting as a barrister.

South Africa changed him dramatically, as he faced the discrimination that was commonly directed at blacks and Indians in that country. One day in court in the city of Durban, the magistrate asked him to remove his turban. Gandhi refused to do so, and stormed out of the courtroom. In another incident, he was thrown off a train at Pietermaritzburg, after refusing to move from the first class coach to a third class compartment, normally used by colour peoples, while holding a valid first class ticket. Later, travelling further on by stagecoach, he was beaten by a driver for refusing to travel on the footboard to make room for a European passenger. He suffered other hardships on the journey as well, including being barred from many hotels on account of his race. This incident has been acknowledged by several biographers as a turning point in his life that would serve as the catalyst for his activism later in life. It was through witnessing first-hand the racism, prejudice and injustice against Indians in South Africa that Gandhi started to question his people's status, and his own place in society.

But let us return our focus to the Afrikaners.

Aren't Afrikaaners just Dutch people opressing blacks in South Africa?

Let's not start the flaming and trolling.

Abrie JF Kilian said:

But let us return our focus to the Afrikaners.

Click to expand...

Well, let's see what is needed.

Graphics (I'm not a graphic maker):
-cavalry reskin for the UU (I think a reskinned cavalry would to do the job)
-cavalry button reskin
-Flagdecal
-Civbutton
-Pictures of the Leaders
-Buttons for the Leaders

Xml:
-list of cities
-civipedia for UU
-civipedia for the Leaders
-civipedia for the Civ itself
-some xml to make it work

Chamaedrys

I have started with some of the steps mentioned in 'setup of a civ' by Charcoal, but I’m having some difficulty. My email address is abriek@acdp.fsl.gov.za. Email me then I will send you what I have thus far. I will help as far as possible.

I got as far as the buttons. But I don’t get the development of the buttons that clearly. Maybe some1 can do that for us?

Maybe we can run this as project, with everyone chipping in. I make myself available to assist with future projects similar to this one.

Abrie JF Kilian said:

South Africa changed him dramatically, as he faced the discrimination that was commonly directed at blacks and Indians in that country. One day in court in the city of Durban, the magistrate asked him to remove his turban. Gandhi refused to do so, and stormed out of the courtroom. In another incident, he was thrown off a train at Pietermaritzburg, after refusing to move from the first class coach to a third class compartment, normally used by colour peoples, while holding a valid first class ticket. Later, travelling further on by stagecoach, he was beaten by a driver for refusing to travel on the footboard to make room for a European passenger. He suffered other hardships on the journey as well, including being barred from many hotels on account of his race. This incident has been acknowledged by several biographers as a turning point in his life that would serve as the catalyst for his activism later in life. It was through witnessing first-hand the racism, prejudice and injustice against Indians in South Africa that Gandhi started to question his people's status, and his own place in society.

Click to expand...

He also indulged in a bit of it himself.

http://www.trinicenter.com/oops/gandhi.html

Turner, thanks for putting the discussion back on the right track.

It seems that there is no dispute as to the uu. Either everybody is very informed, or not informed enough to make a suggestion... I like the first reason! Mr. Kilian has the right idea with the cavalry unit, but I think a better choice for a name might be "ruiter" or rider. The ruiter is the unit to whom so much is attributed including evolving gorilla warfare, being incredible scouts, firing accuratly while riding or dismounting and ending the British use of cavalry equiped with a lance. "Kommando" refers to the collective of ruiters forming a 'squad'.

You also made a good suggestion with the "recce". They deffinetly were the best followed by the rest. Reading up on some of their exploits amazes. But now we have to look at the impact they had. Even though they dominated covert opperations in the 60's, 70's and 80's not much is known internationally about what they did. Not that fame should be a guideline (Pretorius) but how much evolved, changed and developed from their actions. So much can be attributed to the ruiters, but can you think of something lasting that the recce's can be credited for?

So can we expect the Afrikaner to be completed and ready to be included in the expantion?

I have an import question: Which Flag should the Afrikaaners use? I played a bit with my dds editor and created the blue-white-orange tricolor. Did you think this represented the Afrikaaners well?

Definetly not! The orange, white and blue represents something that was not originally Afrikaner. That flag was adopted for the whole country including the British influance. No offense meant, but that takes away from as accurate portrayal as possible for the Afrikaner. The two options would be the "Vierkleur" or Four Colour of the ZAR (Zuid Afrikaanse Republiek) or the flag of the Republic of the Orange Free State. Give me a minute to produce them for you...

I hope I did the attaching correctly... These are the flags to consider.

OKay. I think the first flag would look better on the game stag poles.

Thanks for all the assistance.

Although we have respect for both republics and both flags, the 'Vierkleur' is a bit more senior than the flag of the Republiek van de Oranje Vrijstaat. We could add both, but that will just look like a circus.

To concede, I would suggest the 'vierkleur' for the simple fact that most Afrikaners still primary identify with the Vierkleur and secondary with the Oranje Vrystaat.

The UU naming is between the

1. Boere Kommando (Collectively)
2. Ruiter (Singular)

Both are recognized. I probably depend on you graphic settings! Hehehe! The question that I believe needs to be answered is: Does a Civ unit represent a group of the same unit or a single (3) unit?