Watch Pete2006 beat an Emporer game

I saw elf's emporer thread and though I would make my own thread. I play Emporer games pretty often and can usually win. I wrote a strategy guide pre patch that had a minor following.



I used to prefer Catherine and chopping was a major part of my strategy. I would commonly win small/standard games around 1100-1300 AD with grenadiers/cossacks. Also in the majority of games I played without a state religion. I skipped all wonders in favor of science/commerce buildings and military.

Now that chopping has been nerfed, I've changed strategies. I usually play the Incans. I try to found buddhism and use religion for the +happy and culture. It's pretty easy to get it to spread to my other cities and in some games it becomes the dominant religion on my continent.

People think to think quechas suck but it just isn't true. They are great worker stealers and city raiders. Also, since barbs start attacking around 2500 BC, you need early defense. Quechas are cheap and kick archer ass. They do expire early but they allow you to skip archery and postpone bronze working - if you are in to that sort of thing.

I've been taking some pictures of my current game and am about ready to start my first offensive. Have a look:



It's a standard fractal map. I prefer to play marathon because I like the slower pace.



Here's my starting location. The gold is nice but I would prefer to switch the pigs for some wheat or corn since HC starts with Agriculture. AH is a rather expensive tech and this will force me to research it early.

Since I start with Agriculture and Mysticism there's no point in building a worker first (nothing to work!), so I build a settler. I'm also going to research meditation to found buddhism and get some culture going. The yellow religion fits well with HC's colors. It also allows me to build monasteries and opens a path to priesthood (Oracle + temples).



Got it. Hopefully it'll spread to one or two neighbors. Sometimes it'll spread everywhere. When that happens it really screws up the game. Same religion = less conflict. Less conflict = AI spending their hammers on commerce/tech instead of war. It also doesn't help when warring within the faith results in a lot of negative "you attacked our friend" modifiers.



Second city location. Looks like I'm in a corner. Is this game over already? Gold + Corner is a recipe for success. Looking around my corner and I find out that the gold is my only pre-calender/monarchy happiness. Good thing I have a religion. I build some quechas to fight off the barbs and a worker to build some roads to spread my religion and hook up my resources.



Third city location. So far all locations look pretty sweet. Lots of food and hills with a bit of river action. Cuzco + Tiwakinu are going to be manufacturing powehouses. I like to run beaurocracry and build the heroic epic in the capital in the middle of the game to really pump out units.



Oracle. Free tech! I'll take Metal Casting. Thanks! With only three cities and room for two more. I don't need courthouses yet. I can research those when I begin my first war. Let's get some early forges in my cities and possibly the collossus. Early forges will probably get me in the top 2 for production even if I'm last in land/pop.



Fourth and fifth cities go up. So far I've met Bismark who shares a border with me and Alex who has Bismark's back. Alex loves to backstab. Seeing as buddhism spreads to Alex and Bismark is Jewish, he'll backstab Bismark. Hopefully he'll wait until I'm ready.



#1 GNP. Average/Last in everything else. Pretty normal. I expect to lose the GNP lead to 1 or 2 AIs. Since every AI on emporer pays very little in maintenance per city, they can afford to settle as much land as they can. By the time they get Calender they can work the 50 Calender resources in their border and take a commanding pop/gnp lead. It's inevitable. I do expect to go up in production when I finish my forges.



Haha. Sucker.

As you can see, I'm going to Monarchy early as I have one grape vine to work and I really need the hereditary rule happiness boost.



How about that! I couldn't build it in my capital since Cuzco isn't on the sea. That's good and bad. It won't pollute my Priest GP points which will guarantee me the Mahabadoobe but it also means slower Great People generation. Nothing I can do about that. 4 commerce sea tiles will be nice while they last. The game wil probably end around 1550 AD so that's a major portion of the game.

I'm researching Alphabet in anticiaption of making a couple trades. I skipped over Iron/Sailing and would like to trade Metal Casting/alphabet for those as well as Math/Calender/Currency.



Met a couple more AI. Louis and GW are warring - Thank god. GW left alone is a terror. Religion is varied. Excellent. Lots of fighting.

Looks like Berlin holds the Pyramids. Bah, who cares about the pyramids. I'm already running hereditary rule.



Here's where things stand now. After I got Alphabet it looks like Alex is the one with the GNP lead. It could be GW though. As my cities grow and begin to work those 4 commerce water tiles, I'll be making bank.



Just noticed those previous images were kinda small. Here's a better size.

70% science with 5 cities. #1/2 in production. #2 in GNP. Researching CoL. Yep, I'm ready for war.

Bismark is a douche. This should be a cakewalk. I'm already planning my next victim - Alex. Toku has had his border closed the entire game and has no religion. Another moron.

OK planning my first war. I'm planning on building 10 axes/swords and 2 spears. I'd prefer to build mostly swords (7.2 str is much better than 5.5 and Bismark is mostly defending with archers and spears. Unfortunately I just traded Alex for Iron and I haven't finished mining it so it'll be mostly an axe invasion.

10-12 should be enough to take Dortmond and Frankfurt. Then I can regroup and take Berlin. The question is whether I should raze and rebuild or take them as is. Personally I think Frankfurt overlaps too much with Berlin. AI really pisses me off with their city builds. They always overlap too much.

What do you guys think? If I did raze I would move Frankfurt two squares south and move Dortmond one square southeast.

Pete,

please take this feedback seriously. what made aelf's thread such a success were the screenshots, the pace of play, and the discussion of strategy between sessions. I have yet to follow the links from your thread, but I am interested in seeing any emporer level player work through a game. best of luck to you and hopefully this feedback will improve your relations to those following your thread

NaZ

Why did you choose Inca? You never used the quechua! The strategy with Inca is to build only quechua (and barracks) and go steal workers and take an AI capital or two with quechuas only.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=158823

I sort of agree with both comments thusfar:

1) There's not much we can contribute to a thread if your first post takes you already to mid-classical, and you've made all your decisions. All we can really say is *clap-clap* good job so far, keep it up.

2) It's nice to see someone leveraging everything about a civ. Founding a religion takes advantage of starting with mysticism, definitely. Then I would've said that going anhusb next to work the herdable would've taken advantage of starting with agriculture. Then I would've said that starting with a barracks and worker stealing would've taken advantage of being aggressive in combination with quechas, which takes advantage of the civ's UU. Finally, I would've agreed that building the colossus nicely takes advantage of financial: four commerce coastal tiles early is really nice.

playshogi said:

Why did you choose Inca? You never used the quechua! The strategy with Inca is to build only quechua (and barracks) and go steal workers and take an AI capital or two with quechuas only.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=158823

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I know that is one of the main quecha qualities but I just didn't get around to it. I probably could have taken Berlin already with 4-5 quechas but it was a too far away.

futurehermit said:

I sort of agree with both comments thusfar:

1) There's not much we can contribute to a thread if your first post takes you already to mid-classical, and you've made all your decisions. All we can really say is *clap-clap* good job so far, keep it up.

2) It's nice to see someone leveraging everything about a civ. Founding a religion takes advantage of starting with mysticism, definitely. Then I would've said that going anhusb next to work the herdable would've taken advantage of starting with agriculture. Then I would've said that starting with a barracks and worker stealing would've taken advantage of being aggressive in combination with quechas, which takes advantage of the civ's UU. Finally, I would've agreed that building the colossus nicely takes advantage of financial: four commerce coastal tiles early is really nice.

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1. It's hard for me to play at a snail's pace but I could try to slow down. I really would like some feedback regarding my first attack. Raze and rebuild or just them as is?

2. Personally, I think it is almost mandatory to found a religion if you start with Mysticism. Even if you don't convert for the +happy/religious civics, it'll give you early culture which is very important.

I didn't go with the worker steal. In retrospect I probably should have but I had a lot of room to build and I was more focused on getting my cities up, barb attack - I did have 3-4 archers invade me - and building the Oracle. I could have taken Berlin as well but my early economy would have been killed.

Colossus was a no brainer as I was the first to Metal Casting and had copper. Berlin was a little far from my capital

I've been able to get to hinduism on Monarch pretty easily without starting with mystisism which has kinda shocked me

I've been able to get to hinduism on Monarch pretty easily without starting with mystisism which has kinda shocked me

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You can't guarantee it, but it's certainly possible (unless isabella is in the game...)

1. It's hard for me to play at a snail's pace but I could try to slow down. I really would like some feedback regarding my first attack. Raze and rebuild or just them as is?

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Depends on what your plan is. Conquest? Raze. Domination? Keep.

2. Personally, I think it is almost mandatory to found a religion if you start with Mysticism. Even if you don't convert for the +happy/religious civics, it'll give you early culture which is very important.

I didn't go with the worker steal. In retrospect I probably should have but I had a lot of room to build and I was more focused on getting my cities up, barb attack - I did have 3-4 archers invade me - and building the Oracle. I could have taken Berlin as well but my early economy would have been killed.

Colossus was a no brainer as I was the first to Metal Casting and had copper. Berlin was a little far from my capital

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your decisions so far have been fine, i think, it's just less entertaining for your audience when you play so many turns at a time...

Small update. I'll play a little more tonight.



When we last left off I was mulling whether to raze Bismark's cities or to just take them. Before I finished building my army, I started get demands from the other AI. First was from Louis. I rejected him. No one likes him and I'm guessing he's pretty far away from me an likely doesn't have open borders with enough AI to get to me.




GW up and cancels our open borders agreement. No big deal there. No trade routes anyway. Bad part is he doesn't want to trade tech either. That makes Louis, Tokugawa and GW who won't trade techs with me. Bad news. I'm about to kick German butt and then Greek butt and they are my only trading partners.



Alex declares on Bismark. Punk! I guess I'm going to war a bit early. He better not take Berlin before me!







I take Dortmund and raze it. I didn't get much feedback on this so I went with my first instinct.



Bismark had 2 archers and 2 spears along with walls. I only had 6 axes. Luckily Alex took out 2 of them and then I razed the city.



I would have liked to have gotten a tech out of the deal but alas, he had a galley heading for my nets and I haven't built any yet. Remind me to build a couple to fend off Alex's galleys when I attack Greece.



Rebuilding work. I finished up CoL and started building Courthouses. Should bump up my tech rate. Once I finish the Courthouses. It's going to be 100% military buildout. Also I really need to get Alex's land scouted and Construction.



Trade Alex Courthouses for Currency. I'm usually the first to Currency but Alex seems to be researching very quickly. Weird. He's usually last but not this game. Alex is my tech nemesis! He and I have all the other AI out-teched so far. I guesss Louis really pulled a number on GW. There is one AI I haven't met yet so I'm going to guess that I have a big continent with 6 of us and a smaller landmass that we'll meet in another thousand years. That means I can forego the circumnavigation race.



Fat chance Toku. Give you 1/2 price courthouses free? Research it yourself you bum. It looks like I have what remains of Germany separating us so I'm not worried about an attack.



Stats as of 120 AD. I'm firmly in the lead in GNP and manufacturing. Weak in everything else but that should change soon after my Greek invasion.



Another trade for some gold. What's he going to do with this tech anyway? Build the Oracle?



Bismark forgave me and I trade for some techs I skipped. Puts me one tech closer to Monotheism. After I take Alex's land, I'll run Org Religion to rebuild quickly.



Opens border too. Nice. We're BFF until Alex is gone.

Trading with Toku. Health isn't an issue at all for me. I'll take the gold. Notice he doesn't have Iron? He's no threat until Samurai.



Current landmap. Looking back, I probably should have skipped Calender and gone straight for Construction. That's ok. A majority of my army will my Sword/Axe with a little Catapult backup.



Unless they all declare on me at the same time, this should be a winner. Being on par/ahead of all the AI at this point of the game is a very good sign. My pop/land should only increase from here on out.


Not many replies here. Is anyone interested? If not, I'll stop posting. It's a lot of work uploading all the pics and writing the summary.

Here's my Greek pre-invasion post:



Here's a shot of Alex going into Bismark's northern territory (I think he only has 2 cities left). A nice shot of Corinth as well. Looks like Bismark pillaged his gem mines. I bet those mines are a reason why he's researching so well.



Why do they even bother? No thanks.



Chopping the last of the Courthouses. Also, notice Alex has a bunch of galleys sailing around my coast? Makes me nervous. I'm building 4 galleys to protect my nets and hopefully prevent a rear invasion.



Mahabadoobe in 330 AD. First GP as well. One thing I do poorly is get GPP. That was all Oracle GPP. I could have built a temple and assigned a priest but I'd rather work the mines in Cuzco for military production.



Mapping out Alex's land as he founds Taoism and converts. At this point it doesn't matter as I'm preparing my invasion force. He moves from Friendly to Pleased which in Greek speak means "Gimme an opening to backstab you."



Ouch Toku! I thought we were friends?! You can't really see in this screenshot but he has a city in the SW corner and sends a galley my way.



He pillages my fish net and drops 2 chariots and scurries away. My spears take care of them and get upgraded. Thanks Toku.



Now I though Toku was too far away to attack and I was wrong but I'm pretty sure Louis isn't getting involved anytime soon.



Toku sends in an axe and catapult. Fighting agressive civs early sucks. I'd much rather have a tech lead when I war with them. Oh well, can't pick your neighbors.



After I kill his units he buys peace. We'll meet again soon enough.



20 units enough to start a war with Alex? Yeah, I think so. I left a couple behind just in case my galleys can't protect me. Finishing up Machinery and will start on Civil Service right afterwards. I still only have 4-5 workers so I hope to capture 3-4 more else I'll need to build some. I already know I have several windmills to build.

My projected path will be to take Berlin first. Then I'll hold that position and let Alex throw a bunch of unit my way while I'm fortified. After he spends all his free units, I'll move on to Sparta and the Thermopylae.

4 things that suck here: 1. Toku has a city just south of that wheat (I saw a red border when I went through Alex's land). I'm not sure yet how to handle that. I don't want to leave my back open to an agressive civ that already attacked but I also would like to eliminate Alex completely before moving on to Toku.

2. Alex is #2 in GNP after me so it's likely he'll be the first to Feudalism and upgrade his archers to longbows. I can overcome that by using a bunch of sacrificial catapults but I don't like to waste units if I don't have to.

3. Take a look at Alex's land. Other than the gems and Spice on his northern borders, there are no new happiness resources. That means I'll have to build temples and extra units so my cities will continue growing. Right now they're capped at 8/9/10 with one unit.

4. Toku is #3 in GNP and it's likely that when I'm ready to finally attack him, he'll have samurai and they'll be highly upgraded from his war with Bismark.

Pete2006 said:

Not many replies here. Is anyone interested? If not, I'll stop posting. It's a lot of work uploading all the pics and writing the summary.

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Keep 'em coming Something like this is useful for many players, and will be a good resource to point folks to.

I'm #1 in all the important categories: GNP, production, population. After my war with Alex, I should be #1 in everything but military. It's actually surprising I'm #1 in GNP at this point. Perhaps the undiscovered civ is giving Louis and GW some trouble and stunting their growth. I'm going to guess the last civ is Monty or Khan.



Units costs are running 25 gpt/turn. So I'm in pretty damn good shape right now. Once I declare, I'll lose all my trade routes with Alex. I'll go to war tomorrow and if anyone is interested, I'll post the results.

armstrong said:

Keep 'em coming Something like this is useful for many players, and will be a good resource to point folks to.

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OK I'll post a bit more.



My cities are starting to surpass their happiness limits. Going to crack the whip here.







Making some gold trades to finance my war.



The war begins. I lose zero units in the attack. Unfortunately, a horse and cat slip by me to pillage. I lose a unit taking them out. Also, Berlin is immediately slammed by at least a dozen units. I had several spears for the horses but Alex just had too many. I lose 5 units in Berlin defending.



City is freaking empty. It would be nice to find something there so I wouldn't have to start from scratch.



No peace yet bucko. It is nice to see him begging early. I hate AIs who ignore you for too long. I'll be able to sell him peace when I'm ready.



Sparta's defenses are weak. However, my stack has been hit at least five times by horses, swords and cats on my way. I'll stop to heal a bit before I take the city.



#3 in GNP now. War is expensive. I also haven't had time to build a market in my capital. I will once I switch to beaurocracy.



Alex keeps sending units in for the attack! They all seem to be coming from Thermopylae. I guess that is his manufacturing base. I'll have to take that city next.



I take Sparta with no losses. My cities are now getting +2 war unhappiness.



Another empty city!! Can't catch a break. That's the city where Alex founded Taoism. He switches back to Buddhism.

I accept his peace offering. My units are badly injured and need to heal. I'm also short on spears and horses seem to be Alex's favorite unit so I need some more.



I meet the last AI. Have no idea where he is though. He doesn't like me much. He's buddies with Toku though. Ouch. When I attack Toku it may turn into a 2 on 1.



Looks like Bismark is down to one city. I guess he forgot I razed two of his cities because he seems to like me. Idiot. I trade him an outdated tech. I'll need this for Knights/Cavs later.



Sparta has come out of revolt. No culture there so I'll need to send in a missionary. Need to crack the whip as well. What do you guys think I should whip? My first instinct is a granery and walls. When I declare on Alex in 5-10 turns, he's going to slam this city with units. I need some protection.

Finished a major portion of the Greek war. Let's recap!



Just finished up Civil Service. Time to upgrade a couple swords to maces. Don't have much gold so it'll be a limited upgrade. I don't have time to collect gold so I'll attack with what I have. My units are highly upgraded so they should be fine.

Also, forgot to take a screenshot, but I switched civics and went for Bureaucracy and Org Relion.



This army should be big enough to finish Alex off. We'll see!



State of my civ pre-war. Post war, I should fall a bit behind in GNP but my pop/production/land should all rise dramatically. Then after I build courthouses and lighthouses I should be back in the top spot.



As expected, after I declare Alex attacks Sparta. I popped a granary but didn't have enough pop for the walls. Didn't have time to build them either. Didn't lose any units anyway so it didn't matter.



Alex has feudalism. It's nearly 900 AD. He should have gotten longbows a LONG time ago. Well, since he only builds units and no infrastructure that's the way it goes.

I would rather have attacked a Saladin type who gets Feudalism in 400 AD but builds 1/4 of the units though. Regardless...



Piss off Louis.



Knocked down the defenses and took it with the maces. No losses.





It would be nice to find a courthouse or granary in one of these cities.



Toku still missing two Samurai ingrediants.

Delphi looks like it is there just to occupy space.



A shot of Alex's northern borders. Somehow he and Toku have an open borders arrangement but I guess Alex doesn't trust him so he has a bunch of horses up there.



Not yet begger.





No losses. On to Athens! As a side note, I'm getting +2/3 war unhappiness that is preventing me from running my mines. Production/GNP is way down in my core cities. I still can't get my cities above 10 as I haven't any new happiness resources.



How is he running his civ with no infrastructure?



Cheap tribute demand. OK I'll cave. he could declare and then ask Toku to gang up on me. I don't need that hassle right now.



Athens pops a great scientist just before my attack. I pause a turn to let him use it.







Thanks for using that Philosophical trait to my advantage!



Offering a city for peace? Let's check out that city first.



I'll pass on that one. I'll probably end up razing it later.

Took Literature instead. Guess he was desperate.



GW begging me for a tech I research a couple thousand years ago. Weird game.



Attack the one civ I have open borders with? I don't think so. I hope Bismark survives, I some profitable trade going on with him.



My economy got killed but I added some good land. Time to reorganize and plan my next attack. I'm researching Engineering, not for pikes or castles, but for the extra troop movement and to trade it for Feudalism (if I can). Feudalism - Guilds - Banks is my path after this. Then I'll choose between Military Tradition or Chemistry depending on the state of my military.

The move to a possibility insurmountable lead.



Alex agrees to open borders. He just can't get enough of that beatdown action I suppose.





I end up trading for Feudalism as planned. That'll save me some research turns. Won't help him much either. Pikes won't stand up to my maces at all.



GW continues his demands. I refuse again.



Planning out the attack. Take Corinth. Raze Hanmburg (too much overlap). Take Munich and Pharsalos and then sue for peace. let's see if that works out.

meh I guess playing the best civ(inca) on marathon(also easier), on a single uber continent(simpler), even at emperor doesn't hold ppl's imaginations like it use to.

how about frederick on normal speed w/ continents or archipelago? and that slow ur game down thing too probably.

Well I for one found it very interesting. I barely scrape through on prince so this was impressive. How do you build your military while still improving your infrastructure? I always want to build libraries, forges etc as well as units which leads to building nothing at all really. That is to say, I'm a bit random in my building choices. I always seem to fall behind in some aspect early on but I guess that is to be expected.

it's no fun for the reader when first off you play a ton of turns at a time, don't ask for any input (when you do, you just end up playing a bunch of turns so any feedback is obselete), and also when we have to click a ton of links at a time to see the screenshots instead of having them easily visible in the thread like some others do.

and, as yavoon said, it would be more interesting to see normal speed since we all understand using marathon to exploit the ai's pathetic war abilities.

Also normal screenshots instead of opening all those links would help a lot. I love to read these kind of threads but without the proper screenies or having to wait 10 secs before the screenie is loaded is a bit of a pain. So I agree with Naz. Look at the ALC's or AELF threads please, because it is damn interesting to see how people manage.

Hey, he did say "watch pete2006 beat an Emperor game", not help me with it. Seriously now, Pete, take into account what the others wrote if you want to have even a modest amount of feedback on your game.