Time for your tribute! Refusal means war!

Stylesjl

Stylesjl

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When you have demanded proper payment from your sniveling vassal for not wiping him off the face of the earth have they ever refused to cough up the goods and go to war?

Every time i have demanded tribute they always accept even when i once demanded Oil (a highly valuable resource that AIs usually ask exboriant prices for)

I wonder if the reason they have never refused is because i am always powerful enough to crush their sniveling hides.
 
Vassals will usually give you anything, no matter how outrageous the demand might be (I once extort 60 gpt for some measly sheep). Occasionally though they can be big-headed and refuse, but only if they think they might have a chance to survive against your military.
 
I've had vassals with one city left refuse to give me tribute. I had the most powerful military and had already taken all their other cities. The game didn't give me the option of declaring war if the tribute was refused.
 
I havent had any vassals refuse resource.. I MAY even have had one initiate a gift but it could have been a perm. ally, I dont remember exactly. Vassals constantly refuse tech though.. even tech trades.
Also I had a capitulated catherine sending spies over to destroy my aluminum. Over and over. I lost the space race cause of her KGB, and though I would catch her in the act, I couldnt declare war on her. All I could do was double/triple guard aluminum. I tried to influence a war by demanding stuff, but she either simply refused (no war) or handed it over.
 
weasel77066 said:
I havent had any vassals refuse resource.. I MAY even have had one initiate a gift but it could have been a perm. ally, I dont remember exactly. Vassals constantly refuse tech though.. even tech trades.
Also I had a capitulated catherine sending spies over to destroy my aluminum. Over and over. I lost the space race cause of her KGB, and though I would catch her in the act, I couldnt declare war on her. All I could do was double/triple guard aluminum. I tried to influence a war by demanding stuff, but she either simply refused (no war) or handed it over.
Click to expand...

Exactly. I hope they patch it so that Masters can end vassal relationships.
 
If you demand a resource, then they can't refuse to give it without a war declaration. They won't give you tech. So get used to it.

I once had a 1 city vassal refuse his yearly tribute (spices or something), thereby causing war between us. Needless to say, it was a short war.
 
That's how it's supposed to be, and once a vassal did declare war rather than give up a resource. But I and others have also had them refuse to give resources or cash without a war or option to start one.
 
So what's the point in being able to direct a vassal's research if you can't demand it once they've discovered it?!? I had Elizabeth research compass and then refuse to trade it.
 
a4phantom said:
That's how it's supposed to be, and once a vassal did declare war rather than give up a resource. But I and others have also had them refuse to give resources or cash without a war or option to start one.
Click to expand...

I think it's something like you are only allowed to demand 1 resource at a time, any more than that (or you demand something else, like tech/cash) and it counts as a regular demand - IE, they can refuse, with no repercussions.

That's how it's supposed to be, they aren't supposed to be your techfarms.
 
cymru_man said:
I think it's something like you are only allowed to demand 1 resource at a time, any more than that (or you demand something else, like tech/cash) and it counts as a regular demand - IE, they can refuse, with no repercussions.

That's how it's supposed to be, they aren't supposed to be your techfarms.
Click to expand...

Yes, The "pay tribute or war option" only aplies for ONE resourse at a time from your vassal. Although, on one occations i got refusal without war on the only resourse i demanded. Probably a bug of some sort.

Kublai once refused to pay oil to me in tribute an thereby starting a war between us. Needless to say i got that oil as my own eventually. It tok some time though....
 
a4phantom said:
I've had vassals with one city left refuse to give me tribute. I had the most powerful military and had already taken all their other cities. The game didn't give me the option of declaring war if the tribute was refused.
Click to expand...
Indeed, that is also my problem now. Do we have other options to declare war on our vassal?

Ulysse
 
I had my vassal research astronomy for me while I built up my grenadiers/cavalry/trebuchets(are they better at city attack than cannons?) and researched the rest of the tree. I was WAY ahead in tech, and the only reason little Brennus could research astronomy was that I gifted him about six pre-requisites. He didn't even have maces yet. what a loser, anyways, that Irish looking bastard refused to trade it!(I was apparently his worst enemy) I had to spend three whole turns to research it myself, which really surprised me because only Brennus and frickin' Mansa Musa(I hate him) had it...
 
Indeed, that is also my problem now. Do we have other options to declare war on our vassal?
Click to expand...

That would be a broken feature.

Vassals introduce a new strategic element to foreign policy. When beating someone badly you essentially get 2 choices:

1) Vassalise them.
2) Don't vassalise them, continue fighting and risk having someone else vasslaise them.

If you were able to declare war on a vassal it would essentially allow you to conquer other civs at your leisure making the game ridiculously easy. Vassals take a while to get used to and the vassal flipping can be confusing.

If you don't like vassals switch them off in the custom game menu.
 
Thedrin said:
If you were able to declare war on a vassal it would essentially allow you to conquer other civs at your leisure making the game ridiculously easy.
Click to expand...

I disagree. If it was that way for the player it would also be true for the AI, thus making the AI tougher, relatively speaking. Plus, typically speaking by the time they're willing to capitulate you've already irretrievably broken their civ. It becomes a question of time & effort vs. reward. Eitherway they tend to be easy pickings later on (assuming your civ doesn't suffer ruin in the intervening years).
 
wioneo said:
trebuchets(are they better at city attack than cannons?)...
Click to expand...
Essentially, no. They may come stock with +100% city attack, but that's on a STR of 4! Even if they have a CR promo, that's still only STR 8.8 going into a city. Cannons have a base strength of 12, add in a CR1 and you're at STR 14.4. Since a few cannons are usually upgraded trebuchet with good promos, I usually have Cannons with CR1/CR2/CR3 (STR 20) attacking a city!

EDIT: However, keep those unpromoted trebuchet around because they are MUCH MUCH better at bombarding cultural defense.
 
However, keep those unpromoted trebuchet around because they are MUCH MUCH better at bombarding cultural defense.
Click to expand...
25%vs20% is MUCH MUCH better, its only 1 cannon needed to bombard.
 
I disagree. If it was that way for the player it would also be true for the AI, thus making the AI tougher, relatively speaking.
Click to expand...

The AI didn't have the ability to know when it was okay to back stab in CivIII. Why would it be different in CivIV?
 
CivDude86 said:
25%vs20% is MUCH MUCH better, its only 1 cannon needed to bombard.
Click to expand...
I never pay attention to numbers, bro. Honestly... 3 trebuchet took down a 60% cultural defense and it took 6 cannons to do the same. Don't know the numbers, but experience triumphs that anyway. Maybe it's a glitch in my game, but the trebuchet ALWAYS reduce defense much more quickly. I always keep them around until Artillery.
 
Don't cannons bypass wall defenses, though? I had a stack of grenadiers and trebuchets and when I selected my trebs to bombard, the defense bonus jumped from 60% to 100%.
 
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