Ethanol: the golden calf of energy policy

Neomega

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This is an interesting article,
but from the article:
http://money.cnn.com/2007/03/08/real_estate/ethanol_fuels_rural_renaissance/index.htm

"I wish ethanol production was a boon to the nation and the environment; it is not," he says. Even if every grain of corn went into ethanol production, it would still not make the United States oil independent, he notes.

"Look at it on a per-gallon basis," says Pimentel. "Our latest study indicates it takes 40 percent more fossil fuel energy to produce ethanol than it creates." Fossil fuels run farm and factory machinery, provide heat for the factories and transport ethanol to distant markets.

Pimentel says that corn, the No. 1 ethanol crop in the United States, requires more herbicides and insecticides to grow, needs large amounts of fertilizer and is responsible for more soil erosion than any other U.S. crop.

Furthermore, many of the areas benefiting most from ethanol production face water shortages; it takes 1,700 gallons of water to produce a gallon of ethanol, according to Pimentel.

I think ethanol should be denounced, not praised.
 
The other side effect of the ethanol policy that its supporters are being VERY careful not to mention is that it will drive up the price of corn significantly (already has driven it up some). Anyone care to guess which grain is the primary feed grain for meat animals?
 
Be sure to note that it's corn-based ethanol that's the problem. As well, you guys have a huge lobby group (corn!) who's going to obfuscate the issue. Corn's a problem because it's decently inefficient, and it has other uses (like shoving down cow gullets). With the aquifer stresses, it's not the logical choice.

Jim Nokas is one of the lead researchers on the project. He sees the willow shrub as much more commercially viable than corn-based production.

“The best calculations we have for every unit of energy put into this process you get anywhere from 11 to 15 units of energy out. Compared to the best data available for corn, for every unit of energy put in, one would obtain 1.67 units of energy out.”

In other words, producing ethanol from willow is about ten times more efficient than using corn.

http://www.glrc.org/transcript.php3?story_id=3054

There's also a research group trying to modify the genes of the Poplar tree to make it put more lignin in its roots and more cellulose in its branches. That way, the roots sequester more CO2 than normal (they're denser) and the branches are easier to digest.
 
It sounds on the surface like a good solution, but there are some real issues with it. Such as deforestation because of the sheer amount of land needed to grow corn etc, and the cost.

http://environment.newscientist.com...00-forests-paying-the-price-for-biofuels.html

Forests paying the price for biofuels

THE drive for "green energy" in the developed world is having the perverse effect of encouraging the destruction of tropical rainforests. From the orang-utan reserves of Borneo to the Brazilian Amazon, virgin forest is being razed to grow palm oil and soybeans to fuel cars and power stations in Europe and North America. And surging prices are likely to accelerate the destruction

The rush to make energy from vegetable oils is being driven in part by European Union laws requiring conventional fuels to be blended with biofuels, and by subsidies equivalent to 20 pence a litre. Last week, the British government announced a target for biofuels to make up 5 per cent of transport fuels by 2010. The aim is to help meet Kyoto protocol targets for reducing greenhouse-gas emissions.

Rising demand for green energy has led to a surge in the international price of palm oil, with potentially damaging consequences. "The expansion of palm oil production is one of the leading causes of rainforest destruction in south-east Asia. It is one of the most environmentally damaging commodities on the planet," says Simon Counsell, director of the UK-based Rainforest Foundation. "Once again it appears we are trying to solve our environmental problems by dumping them in developing countries, where they have devastating effects on local people."

The main alternative to palm oil is soybean oil. But soya is the largest single cause of rainforest destruction in the Brazilian Amazon. Supporters of biofuels argue that they can be "carbon neutral" because the CO2 released from burning them is taken up again by the next crop. Interest is greatest for diesel engines, which can run unmodified on vegetable oil, and in Germany bio-diesel production has doubled since 2003. There are also plans for burning palm oil in power stations.
"Once again we are trying to solve our environmental problems by dumping them on developing countries"

Until recently, Europe's small market in biofuels was dominated by home-grown rapeseed (canola) oil. But surging demand from the food market has raised the price of rapeseed oil too. This has led fuel manufacturers to opt for palm and soya oil instead. Palm oil prices jumped 10 per cent in September alone, and are predicted to rise 20 per cent next year, while global demand for biofuels is now rising at 25 per cent a year.

Roger Higman, of Friends of the Earth UK, which backs biofuels, says: "We need to ensure that the crops used to make the fuel have been grown in a sustainable way or we will have rainforests cleared for palm oil plantations to make bio-diesel."

Another cautionary article from the independent.

http://news.independent.co.uk/environment/climate_change/article2328821.ece
 
Yup, Some of the farmers I know love it because the price of corn is so high now but the Dairy Farmers around here are not pleased that the price of feed is jumping. I don't like the idea at all. It is inefficient.
 
Interesting... is this another of those 'give farmers a load of cash' typr programmes?

It's a series of subsidies:
- pay them for unsold grain
- give them cash when there's drought*
- discount the price of fuel
- etc.

*For cripes sake, most places are overtaxing their aquifers. If you continue to buy out droughts, then you're going to be setting yourself up for more and more payouts.
 
I think ethanol should be denounced, not praised.

Or drunk... :lol:

Butanol is cheaper to transport. I opened a thread about biobutanol some time ago, but nobody cared much about it.

Nice post Shide, see what I mean when I say that the remedy can be worse than the actual disease when I talk about global warming?
 
Urederra: please keep mentioning biobutanol. People keep on forgetting about it, but it deserves to be remembered.
 
I'm surprised that there isn't louder opposition to all these "lobby" groups that run your country.

The lobby to end lobby groups isn't very influential.
 
The other side effect of the ethanol policy that its supporters are being VERY careful not to mention is that it will drive up the price of corn significantly (already has driven it up some). Anyone care to guess which grain is the primary feed grain for meat animals?


The cost of land too, supposedly. Farmland in Iowa (from whence I just returned a couple days ago) has increased in value 73% since 2000 and it's being attributed to increased demand for ethanol which of course requires vast tracts of land.
 
And, of course, when all else is said and done, there's this problem: instead of OPEC, it will be a corn cartel running the planet. :)

Same situations, just different faces.....
 
If ethanol were being used as a stopgap whilst hydrogren development
was pushed forward, I wouldn't mind it so much. But that doesn't seem to be
the case, at least in the US.
 
If true, the free market will sacrifice it surely?

Not necessarily. Markets do occasionally just ignore such things, typically from a misguided outside intervention.

If ethanol were being used as a stopgap whilst hydrogren development
was pushed forward, I wouldn't mind it so much. But that doesn't seem to be
the case, at least in the US.

Hydrogen is not the next power source, electricity is. The technology is around right now, and you can make a very good car out of it, particularly for urban driving. Most people in North America and Europe drive less than 40 km a day. And it is very possible to build a travelworthy electic.

On top of that, the engines are very clean and easy to maintain, and you gain a lot of space by getting rid of all those moving parts.
 
If this is true then explain the welsh vegie oil sting. An ASDA in south wales noiced it was selling abserd quantities of vegie oil. People were mixing it with a splash of ethanol and running desiel motors on it, because it was cheaper than the price at the pumps. Since this meant they were not paying any duty the police clamped down by stopping cars across the region and sniffing their exaust.

The UK duty on desiel isnt as high as on petrol, and it is cheaper now to go to a big out of town supermarket and buy the bits to make desiel than to go to the petrol station.

Not to say that it wont have negative impact on the environment, but since all farming and transport engines are desiel they would be the first to use bio-desiel.
 
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