News: GOTM 20 Pre-Game Discussion

ainwood

ainwood

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GOTM 20: Cyrus

[img=right]http://www.civfanatics.com/civ4/info/leaders/leaders0004.jpg[/img]

Immortals on immortal level!

This game MUST be played in patch version 1.61. We will NOT accept any games played under any other patch versions, and you can't play it in warlords!

Further, it MUST be played using HOF mod version 1.61.011.
Mac players can download their version of the 1.61.011 mod from this thread.



Game settings:
Civilization: Persia (Leader: Cyrus; Traits: Creative, Expansive)
Rivals: 5
Difficulty: Immortal
Map: Fractal
Mapsize: Small
Climate: Tropical
Water level: High
Starting Era: Ancient
Speed: Normal
Options: <none>
Victory Conditions: all enabled

Cyrus:
Cyrus is Creative and Expansive; starting with agriculture and hunting. Creative allows +2 culture per city, as well as double production speed of Theatres and Colosseums. Expansive allows +3 health per city, as well as double production speed of harbors and granaries.

Unique unit: Immortal:
No, its not a swordsman! The Civ4 immortal replaces the standard chariot. With strength of 4, movement of 2 and a cost of 25 hammers, it is identical to the standard chariot. The difference is in an extra 10&#37; withdrawal chance (meaning it withdraws from combat 30% of the time) and a 50% bonus against archery units.


The starting screenshot is here (click for a bigger version!)


Adventurer Class bonuses:
  1. Player starts with a worker (same square as the settler).
  2. Player starts with two arches (one on plot with settler, one on plot with scout)
  3. Player starts with mining & the wheel.


Challenger Class Equalisers:
  1. Gold visible in the starting screenshot is removed.
  2. Start without knowledge of agriculture.
 
Haven't we just had Cyrus on Immortal in WOTM?

Btw, the start just asks for 1N capital.
 
Lexad said:
Btw, the start just asks for 1N capital.
Click to expand...
The same thing i thought at first, but 1W can let the rice for a second city, and in addiction you got a FP in FC and you don't lost 1 turn.
 
Lexad said:
Haven't we just had Cyrus on Immortal in WOTM?

Btw, the start just asks for 1N capital.
Click to expand...

We did indeed, in WOTM 7. This time we have the "luxury" of no bonus against axes (Vanilla Civ) and aggressive AI.

I got the ambulance award in WOTM 7 so avoiding an early death is my numero uno priority.

The only problem I can see with settling one north is perhaps the lack of production from only a couple of hills and some forests. But I think you can save the floodplain for another city just as you could save the rice.
 
BLubmuz said:
The same thing i thought at first, but 1W can let the rice for a second city, and in addiction you got a FP in FC and you don't lost 1 turn.
Click to expand...

And you'll need ironworking before you can acces the rice anyway, so leaving it shouldn't be that bad. And you'll also have 4 plains hills to work, so enough production.
 
I remember Balbes's amazing immortal strategy in WOTM7. It involved a complicated hit and run harrying of every opponent at once using fast moving immortals to continually cut off resources. It was spectacular and may be my preferred strategy for this one. It'll look terrible if not executed well, but I'm doomed at immortal level anyway, so I have nothing to lose.

Critical of course is finding horses quickly.
 
spacemanmf said:
Hmm, does 1 NW get everything? Rice, gold, wheat, floodplain, 5 hills, on a river, plus anything to the west of the gold....
Click to expand...

I was going to say that.

I plan to settle 1NW if I am going for Culture or Spaceship.
I plan to settle 1N if I am going for Domination or Conquest.
Anyway, I will move the Scout first.
 
1NW is a good position either, but more long-run oriented. In the short run (kill all 5 on the small map with immortals before Iron) extra hammer from base tile is worth much. Your happiness in the beginning will limit you to 4 tiles - corn, gold, hill and something, and it would take time for you after initial expansion to grow to these 4. Extra protection from hill as an extra bonus at Immortal with barbs on and Aggressive AI could provide useful. Still, 1NW good spot too.
 
if u settle 1N, you'll in 10 turns have (3+2)*8 + (3+2+1) = 46 hammer+food
If u settle 1NW, you'll in 10 turns have (2+1)*5+(3+1)*4 + (3+1+1) = 36 hammer+food

//corrected
 
Yes, NW gives everything, but we have to plan our 2nd city.
I'm wondering where horses are (i'm sure that at this level they will be at hand) and i wish to use them for their yield, too. Settle in a plain can reveal you settle on the horses. doubts, doubts... the scout will help (SW-W), but not much, i think.
if u settle 1N, you'll in 10 turns have (3+2)*9 = 45 hammer+food
Click to expand...
It's a desert hill, so it doesn't give you the +2 hammers (only plain hills or hills with some resource do this), just 1.

BTW fractal does not always means pangea or land that can be reached by galley.
 
If you want to maximise horses' probability, 1NW is the way - 1N you get 3 lake tiles (no horsies), wood (no horsies either) and darkened spot which could have them. 1NW gives you 3 tiles where horses could be (assuming they're not put on a jungle hill or flood plains). Using the same logic, don't worry horses are at the starting spot as it's wooded.

Aborigen, please correct your calculations it's rather like (3+2)*9 vs (3+1)*10

Ahh, High water level fractal - it can require Astronomy.
 
Settling 1N, building: warrior, worker, warrior, settler...
researching: AH, mining, archery (mostly against barbs), wheels, writing, alpha, BW, IW...
The second city MUST have horses. The scout is at very high price to loose him to the first bear or barbs.
The map is small but fractal. If we'll destroy all the neighbours on the continent, we can get into the trap with astronomy. Only tech trade can guarantee to get it earlier than AI behind the ocean will know gunpowder.
 
BLubmuz said:
Yes, NW gives everything, but we have to plan our 2nd city.
It's a desert hill, so it doesn't give you the +2 hammers (only plain hills or hills with some resource do this), just 1.
Click to expand...
No, it is plain hill (caz it have 2 hammers)

Lexad said:
Aborigen, please correct your calculations it's rather like (3+2)*9 vs (3+1)*10
Click to expand...
I was wrong. We should take into account clutural borders, and city grow. First 10 turns give us:
1NW: (2+1)*5+(3+1)*4 + (3+1+1) = 36
1N: (3+2)*8 + (3+2+1) = 46
So, despite you loose 1 turn. 1N variant still gives you benefit in food, and hammers.
 
Aborigen said:
So, despite you loose 1 turn. 1N variant still gives you benefit in food, and hammers.
Click to expand...


Agreed, 1N is better short term. But if you carry on your calculations not till turn 10 but till turn 300, you will find that 1NW gives more food, more hammers and more commerce.

The question is, how long will this game last?
 
Aborigen said:
1NW: (2+1)*5+(3+1)*4 + (3+1+1) = 36
1N: (3+2)*8 + (3+2+1) = 46
Click to expand...
Still, when you settle 1NW, you get immediate access to wooded plains or wooded plains hill, meaning either (0/4) or (1/3). Settling 1N gives you access to corn or same hill, therefore (3/2) or (0/5). Please, correct.

Also, as we're creative, border expansion takes place after turn 3, not 5.
 
As these maps are set-up by the GOTM staff is it more likely that settle in place city will have horses in BFC? (In the last GOTM settle in place had copper.) If this is the case, horses in BFC, does it affect your decision as to where to settle? as the gold is so good. eg. If you knew that horses were 2s1e would you settle in place?
 
As you do not know where the horses are, you can only guess. They can't be on other resources, in the sea (at least workable horses), and unless ainwood has caught up something evil from Gyathaar - in woods and jungles and flood plains. Therefore, as I said, 1NW would give you greater probability of getting them in BFC than 1N. However, due to cultural trait your second border expasnion is in 25 turns from founding the city, so you might not even have to build a settler to hook them up.
 
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