The New Sea Cities

After a bit of experimenting, several computers dieing on me and some work, I've finally finished reworking the Sea Cities mod.
Unless you accidentally downloaded my old PTW version that had a few bugs in (from the old thread) you won't notice much difference.

There are two files. One for Vanilla (Just in case anyone still uses it) and one for PTW, which should be compatible with C3C and has the extras like PediaIcons (Nicked from the Transport) and a short 'pedia entry.
Both use Transport graphics, since I don't have a special set of animations for either Sea Worker or Settler. If you're up for it, go ahead and make them, my own graphics skills aren't exactly any good for unit creation...

WHAT YOU CAN DO:
Build all tile improvements at sea
Build Cities at sea

WHAT YOU CANNOT DO:
Plant/Clear Forest doesn't work.*
Clear Pollution isn't available. This is because I never had pollution at sea no matter what I tried.

*In my experiements, it was possible to generate grasslands with them, but the map and AI refused to admit they had been changed.

NOTES ON THE AI
The AI does NOT know how to use the units, even though they are enabled in the scenarios for everyone. It will, however, treat a Sea City as a one-tile island on attacking, and will usually be able to treat it the same if it has one.
So far though, they won't attack the cities, so the only way to give them one is to pre-place it.
Sometimes - though not often - the AI will bombard terrain improvements at sea.

And now, without any further waffle... you may download, comment, post ideas, tell me I'm and idiot, etc.
Not necessarily in that order.
And preferably, none of the idiot bit please...

uh. about the mod

I have many many issues

Without cleaning up pollution, how are we suppose to manage our cities on land in the industrial era and above.

Wouldnt be a definite victory for my team if we can use water but the AI cant, we could have 200 cities above all of the AI.

Sorry it isnt really worth it, youve made a good attempt, but it just doesnt work with civ3.

oh yes. do you really play on Sid cuz its pretty hard to believe ?

EDIT & PS: i will actually be testing it today so i will give you an update.

CEO Daedalus said:

uh. about the mod

I have many many issues

Without cleaning up pollution, how are we suppose to manage our cities on land in the industrial era and above.

Wouldnt be a definite victory for my team if we can use water but the AI cant, we could have 200 cities above all of the AI.

Sorry it isnt really worth it, youve made a good attempt, but it just doesnt work with civ3.

oh yes. do you really play on Sid cuz its pretty hard to believe ?

Click to expand...

Ok, here we go.
Pollution isn't changed at all. Water tiles can't get polluted, hence the reason the sea workers don't have clear pollution. Maybe I should have made that a little more clear.
The AI usually treats them like one tile islands - if you set all units with the Offense AI tag to amphibious, it'll attack it - quite often actually, and even more often if you factor in a great wonder or two.
And yes, I do play on Sid - I just don't complete many games. I will beat it though - some day.

OK. i see that it works to my civ.

but if we find the Sea worker in Education, why is it asking for oil ?

ANYWAY its a nice idea that im sure 1000s have thought of this, but thanks to Civ3's AI, it just will make them unbalanced.

I think that was a mistake on my part.
And I'm working on a hack similar to the all LM terrain one that might allow the AI to use the terraform and settle flags at sea, though I'm not making much progress there.

I like it. It's completely unbalanced, because the AI can't follow suit, but I'm a cheater by nature. It's at least a neat idea.

One suggestion to counter the balance problem: you could create a single civilization that builds only sea cities (make sea worker and settler unique to them, don't let them build normal settler and worker), whereas the rest can build only land cities. With some tweaking the advantages of space with the disadvantages of having no luxury or strategic resources could just about cancel out.

Generality said:

I like it. It's completely unbalanced, because the AI can't follow suit, but I'm a cheater by nature. It's at least a neat idea.

One suggestion to counter the balance problem: you could create a single civilization that builds only sea cities (make sea worker and settler unique to them, don't let them build normal settler and worker), whereas the rest can build only land cities. With some tweaking the advantages of space with the disadvantages of having no luxury or strategic resources could just about cancel out.

Click to expand...

making a civ build sea cities only is impossible.

All civs start out on land.

The idea is crazy, bizarre, weird, and I like it. I have both Mac and Windows versions of C3C, and will see how it runs on both types of computers. As for luxuries, Logictech's resource modpack has some possibilities, and strategic resources might be worked in as well. Have you tried using any of the resource modpacks with it? The Captain Nemo part lurking inside of me is turning underwater cartwheels for joy. Death to the land dwelling AI!!!!!!!

CEO Daedalus said:

making a civ build sea cities only is impossible.

All civs start out on land.

Click to expand...

Yes, that is a hurdle.
You could get around it with a custom map (put one start location on the water and set it to that specific civ), but I can't think of any other means to make it workable.

One suggestion to counter the balance problem: you could create a single civilization that builds only sea cities (make sea worker and settler unique to them, don't let them build normal settler and worker), whereas the rest can build only land cities. With some tweaking the advantages of space with the disadvantages of having no luxury or strategic resources could just about cancel out.

Click to expand...

Like Atlantis? I'd love to play that.

Hmm... it's been a while since I saw activity here.
But we'll see what I can do.
I left it with random map settings on because it's just the rules modded so it's possible. you could import a map, tweak a few things here and there and you have your own mod with sea cities.
I left the Sea Engineer available to everyone because the AI doesn't have the faintest idea how to use it, as you can't use the Settle flag on sea units. Which seems a bit strange, since CCTP and SMAC both had sea cities.
Resources, you could add in as you want. I just provided the basics here. But on my own mod, I have experimented a little, and the prices I charge them for some of the resources only available at sea drives them nuts... not that it's hard to tell anyway, they're usually nuts anyway.

I was working on an Atlantis mod some time ago, but it got put on hold because I just didn't have enough time... if you want to use this to make an Atlantis scenario of your own, be my guest.

I started doing some work on a map that I generated that had some good locations for cities, and was going to add logictech's resource pack to it for added sea resources, but got sidetracked. I will try to get back to it in the near future. Keep looking at various ways of better representing the Sea Engineer, Sea Settler, and Sea Worker. I was thinking about using the Gilgamesh figure for the Settler, as in the Gilgamesh Epic, he was supposed to have swam to the bottom of the sea looking for the Water of Eternal Life. At least there are animations for the figure. Have to determine how to tap them, as I am still learning the editor.

Something like that might be good for a scenario set in the early years. I was trying for something along the lines of technology becoming available to do it.

Either way, graphics are not my best point.