Archer Rush

I've only seen it done once: In the Stalin Role-Playing Challenge by a player whose name I can't now remember. But how doable is it? I just started a game as Stalin and tried it out, wiping out the only 2 Egyptian cities around 2500 BC.

It was a monarch hemispheres game. Stalin starts with hunting. I immediately researched archery while growing my capital and building a barracks. I ran Moscow at size three working unimproved tiles (didn't want to use more time building a worker). I built four archers with the Combat I improvement and moved them towards Thebes (which was a short distance away). The archers reached the Egyptian border as soon as the first Egyptian settler appeared. I declared war and moved in. The capital was a double holy city, so it had some cultural defense, but it was only garrisoned with one archer. I had to sacrifice three archers to take the city-- the first archer did no damage, the following two weakened, and my last took the city. While all this was happening, I had built two more archers in Moscow that I used (along with the remaining one from the siege on Thebes) to take Memphis.

I can definitely see this being used on lower levels where the AI doesn't start with archery and an archer. But for higher levels, is this just luck, or is it actually feasible?

See Beelining Archery for recent thread about archer rush.

Pure luck.

There's a one thing I think you might have missed. If the Egyptian leader was Hatty, she gets +2 culture, which coupled with the palace base (+2), gets the captial's borders to pop in as few as 25 turns to 40% cultural defence, and other cities in 5 (+20%) and 50 (+40%).

Lots of luck involved. If the AI had 2 Archers in Thebes, or Archer+Warrior, you'd have no play.

That was me archer-rushing gandhi in that role-playing challenge. There were a lot of factors in favor of an archer rush in that game and it worked really well.

Babylon with Hammurabi has the Bowmen and is Aggressive.

Both of those abilities would make for a good archer rush.

Detektyw said:

There's a one thing I think you might have missed. If the Egyptian leader was Hatty, she gets +2 culture, which coupled with the palace base (+2), gets the captial's borders to pop in as few as 25 turns to 40% cultural defence, and other cities in 5 (+20%) and 50 (+40%).

Click to expand...

Yes, it was Hatshepsut. She did indeed have 40% defense, but the city still fell.

I do realize that I got very lucky using only four archers, but what if I had taken the time to build six or seven? Would they put up a fight against two or three archers in defense? Probably two. Three is doubtful. What if the capital were only at 20% defense?

Let's say you build six archers and send them toward the enemy. There are two archers garrisoned in the enemy capital. I feel safe saying three archers should defeat one defending enemy archer. But hey, luck is against you and your last archer dies trying to defeat the enemy's last archer. By this time, you've been able to build at least two more. Is the enemy going to respond by stacking more archers in it's capital (because it's in war) or will you be able to take the city with a second wave?

troytheface said:

Babylon with Hammurabi has the Bowmen and is Aggressive.

Both of those abilities would make for a good archer rush.

Click to expand...

While Bowmen are great for the idea, the aggressive trait doesn't affect archery units.

2 More archers aren't going to beat a promoted archer(after killing 3 units you would get some experience(which would also heal)). Also the AI now build alot of troops if in war even whipping defenders so yeah it is pretty much dead. And agressive help by giving half cost barracks.

ah i see. first strike and early barrack building are their two points of strength.

I played them and it takes two techs to get to archery.
This being the case i now refer to the following strategy as tactic #46
"Babylonian hell bow attack"

The key here is to build that barracks first thing off. Then build bowmen. Since u start with wheel you road to your target. The UB replaces the Colloseum which is about the worst building to replace. Build lots of these Gardens (construction ). Later, upgrade all those bow into uber pink death longbowmen.

If you took more time to build more archers, how likely is it that the enemy would have three (or more) archers in its capital?

I assume that other cities can't be expected to build archers until they've been around for awhile, correct?

I tested ol Babylon out (Prince/Fractal/Standard) using that hairbrained strategy and just creamed Asoka into the ground. Way to easy.

My new theory is that Bowmen, Preatorians, and Phanlx are the only real multi dimensional units. (I like to try to build only Jaguars when i play Montezuma but they fail to axe)

I think it's a horrible strategy. That being said, I reccomend Mansa Musa if you want to go through with it. No combination of traits and starting techs can top power 4 archers for this endeavor.

Churchil as mali? CQ win with archers XD.

^^Or Toku of the mali.... cheap barracks to add one extra promo to the Pro package ( Drill II for attack and CG II for defense )

Carismatic gives more promos if you plan to conquer the world with the archers though. drill1 cover skirms are pretty good at whacking cities in the ancient area. Drill 4 cover skirms are obviously better..

Sitting Bull. It would be easy enough to whip some monuments or have one city rush Stonehenge.

Mali does the archer rush alright. But if we're honestly going into UU's and rushing, the Quecha is king.

The archer rush can work, but its benefits rarely outweigh its shortcomings.

HC is my main man. Great civics, great UU, and the building rocks. Opening civics are good too, lets me grab an early religion and get a jump on culture and cash. I don't Quecha Rush often, but it's a great option to have when the map is crowded (particularly on higher levels when the AI starts with Archers).