Is there a guide to what techs reduce research times for other techs?

And by how much?

Or could anyone explain it quickly?

Thanks

well if u run your techs at 100% itll carry over to the next tech but to get better research and faster techs try the route to alphabet first to hurry libraries this is what i usually do then backtrack and get smaller worker techs..

doing some research now....

This is done on standard map, with 0 opponents, noble difficulty.

Animal Husbandry: 87 beakers default
With nothing: 87 beakers
With hunting OR Agriculture: 80 beakers
With hunting AND agriculture:
1 turn at 62 per turn = 62 beakers
7 turns at 10 per turn = 70 beakers
11 turns at 6 per turn = 66 beakers
13 turns at 5 per turn = 65 beakers
18 turns at 4 per turn = 72 beakers
22 turns at 3 per turn = 66 beakers
44 turns at 2 per turn = 87 beakers (FULL COST)


It appears the smallest possible cost is 65, however, it appears the bonuses apply fully, or nearly fully, at 3 beakers per turn... meaning the bonus is approximately 66/87 - though 62/87,


Or 75%-71% research cost instead of 100% research cost. Pretty significant.

I'll do some more testing.

When I added ALL techs, Animal Husbandry stayed at 62, so so far it seems that only prerequisites have an effect on a techs research time.

You get a greater discount on a tech the more techs you've discovered that enables you to research that tech.
So Writing will have one cost if you know Pottery, a lower cost if you know Pottery and AH and a yet lower cost if you know Pottery, AH and Priesthood.
You also get a discount on a tech for every other civ that you have encountered that already knows the tech.
This discount is removed for a civ if you kill that civ.
So, knowing an AI that already has Writing will make it cheaper, knowing two will make it even cheaper etc. Killing of AIs that knows Writing will mean a lesser discount on researching Writing.

Pottery: 69 default
With wheel and (fishing OR agriculture): 58 beakers or 84%
With wheel and agriculture and fishing: 50 beakers or 72%
With just wheel: 69 beakers.

Writing: 104 default

With any 1(Priesthood, AH, or Pottery): 88 or 84%
With any 2: 75 or 72%
With Priesthood, AH, and pottery: 65 or 62%

What's interesting to note in these is even with one prerequisite you get a discount, so by necessity you always get a discount on techs which have any prerequisite. But that appears to be "path prerequisite" only, as wheel is a different sort of prerequisite(not connected on by path), but it gave no benefits to research.

I always assumed it was a multiplier to the beakers you put toward the tech, not a reduction in cost.

e: Yes, anything with a arrow hitting the tech on F6 will give the discount/multiplier.

a multiplier to the beakers and a reduction in cost would essentially be the same thing, no?

There is a reduced cost in beakers because your beakers count for more.



Although... if it was a multiplier to beakers, the reduction in cost would be reduced the less significant the bonus would be as you had more research buildings... a bigger hit in significance than just not getting the bonus as many turns due to quicker research.

I don't think so.

Your previous experiment with AH:

Animal Husbandry: 87 beakers default
With nothing: 87 beakers
With hunting OR Agriculture: 80 beakers
With hunting AND agriculture:
1 turn at 62 per turn = 62 beakers
7 turns at 10 per turn = 70 beakers
11 turns at 6 per turn = 66 beakers
13 turns at 5 per turn = 65 beakers
18 turns at 4 per turn = 72 beakers
22 turns at 3 per turn = 66 beakers
44 turns at 2 per turn = 87 beakers (FULL COST)

Click to expand...

Shows that the cost was different depending on how many bpt you were producing, which leads me to think that it multiplies your bpt for knowing extra prereqs. If the cost was reduced it would be roughly the same, seeing as you don't account for overflow- confirm/deny?

well yes, it is a beaker multiplier. I agree completely.

But the beaker multiplier would be synonymous with a research discount, if the beaker multiplier applied equally no matter what buildings you had.

Beakers multiplied by 2, is the same as research being doubled, or the cost of the tech being 50% as costly. It costs half as many beakers, or in these cases, 84%, 72%, or 62% as many (non multiplied)beakers.


Beaker multiplication is the means by which it creates that tech cost reduction. Tech cost reduction just seems a more revealing way to put it, and it was easier to calculate for me... although the beaker multiplier would be the more accurate way to describe it.

I'm going to test with libraries and other buildings now though, to see if it is simply a beaker multiplier to your base beakers, like a library, or works differently, working off the library bonuses also.

Quotey said:

I always assumed it was a multiplier to the beakers you put toward the tech, not a reduction in cost.

Click to expand...

This is exactly how it is. I just examined the game's code, and found out just how the research modifier is calculated. The relevant function is CvPlayer::calculateResearchModifier(TechTypes eTech) in CvPlayer.cpp.

The research modifier starts at 100%. This can be increased up to 150% if you have all the prerequisites, and if every rival civ in the game knows the tech and also has contact with you.

Up to 30% bonus comes from rival civs: start with the number of civs who have both the tech and contact with you, multiply by 30, and then divide by the number of civs left in the game. The other 20% bonus comes from prerequisites. As has already been mentioned, only the line-arrow prerequisites count. ("OR" techs, in the code, as opposed to "AND" techs. Consider Divine Right requiring both Theology AND Monarchy.) Take the number of prereqs you have, multiply by 20, and divide by the number of possible prereqs to get your bonus from prereqs. Then, just add your bonuses together.

Using Writing as an example: I've met two civs who already know Writing, and there are three more civs that I haven't met out there in the fog. 2 civs, times 30%, divided by 6 civs in the game, gives 10% bonus from rival civs. The only prerequisite I know is Animal Husbandry. 1 tech, times 20%, divided by 3 possible prereqs, gives 6.66% bonus from prerequisites. Thus, I'll be researching Writing at 116.66% normal speed.

Or to put it another way, I get 16.66% more beakers for Writing.

Writing: 104 default

With any 1(Priesthood, AH, or Pottery): 88 or 84%
With any 2: 75 or 72%
With Priesthood, AH, and pottery: 65 or 62%

WITH OXFORD

Just writing: 52 base beakers (104 total)
With any 1: 43 base beakers (86 total)
With any 2: 37 base beakers (74 total)
With any 3: 32 beakers (64 total)

So it appears with the 100% oxford bonus, the same amount of total beakers produced is still required.
What this means, is this research bonus is NOT some sort of percentage bonus that works like a library or university.
It is a multiplier that applies both to base beakers and +% bonuses equally, which means it would perhaps be better described as a tech reduction cost... but I think it could be described accurately either way?

My mistake then, a multiplier not cost reduction. Hmm that's obvious if you think about it, the principles are roughly the same however.

But is a multiplier off of total research, not a beaker multiplier, like libraries and other buildings.

Levgre said:

it would perhaps be better described as a tech reduction cost... but I think it could be described accurately either way?

Click to expand...

If it was a true cost reduction then you could research a tech until right before completion, then research another (optional) prereq, step over the threshold for the first tech and complete it automatically. Which does not happen so one can not actually speak of a cost reduction.

Does it apply to lightbulbing techs?