Immortal Cookbook I: Roosevelt

tycoonist

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Following some discussion about the cakewalks achieved on the monarchist cookbook, a separate voting system was started to try and encourage monarch level players and to prevent complete walkovers due to superior saves from players of higher levels, which quickly made the game too easy. so they decided to switch to a trash format, where an average save is chosen. this was not entirely met with satisfaction, so in order to keep the challenge, i decided to start this game with original rules, but on a higher level:

This game is going to be based around the format set out in the original monarchist cookbook, i.e. everyone who wants to plays a round from the starting save and posts a (spoilered) report and save of their turnset. after a week, we have a vote:

rules concerning voting:
1. to vote you must have posted a round yourself.
2. you may not vote for your own save.
3. you have three votes, for first, second and third saves. first gets 3 points, second 2 and third 1 point.
4. votes may either be posted in the thread or PMed to me if you wish.

i will then tally the votes and the next round will start after that from the save which received the most votes.

ok, hopefully that is all clear. for this first game, we will have no player restrictions (i.e. anyone is welcome to post a save) and the level will be immortal. if this game turns out too simple, then maybe next time we try deity for a real challenge.


on to the game then ;)

these were the settings:

Civ4ScreenShot0000-3.jpg


it's not visible in the screenie, but huts and events are turned off.

i had to reload a couple of times to prevent any starts with powerful leaders or gold, but eventually i found this one:

Civ4ScreenShot0001-5.jpg


the leader is Roosevelt (Ind/Org) of the Americans.

the first round will be played from 4000BC up until 1500BC, and closing time for submitting is Friday, midnight.

IMPORTANT: all reports must be spoilered, as should any strategy discussion (do not open spoilers unless you have played your turnset.) no strategy discussion before round 1 please.

any suggestions/queries please ask, this is still in formation...

good luck! :)
 

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My least favorite US leader, but interesting. Best ball saves always = eassauce wins lol. This will actually be a bit more interesting to me.
 
I am a Monarch level player who is looking to take a shot at Emperor next week, so I assume I am the type of player who you are trying to encourage to take a shot? :confused:

Slightly :mad: that the leader is one I used two games ago (I always select random) but I will deal with it.

Got the save. Will post my round shortly. Best of luck to everyone.

P.S - If you are a less skilled player you only have a short window before the worst round is posted. If you hurry you may be able to claim the 'honour' of the worst round played, if only for a short while. :sad:
 
An interesting concept, I like that there's an exact time-limit on the rounds, makes for easy comparison. I might try my hand on this, so many games going on right now though..we'll see.

Edit: One question, which mods if any are used? Do you use Solver's patch? BUG? Perhaps we should have version numbers as well if you do.
 
Here is my round as promised. I wrote the report as I played and without deleting much so at each 'important' event I have tried to add comments etc. Hope it is not too long and boring.

On my strategy:
Spoiler :

I will try to hook up early copper or horses and survive the 100 turns. Hopefully be able to grab a few good city sites and gear up for a Rex/classical era war.

This is my first attempt at Immortal, and my first try at posting a round for public consumption.

Please provide constructive criticism for anything I do during the round, especially in micromanaging builds/tiles/queues – I am only posting my rounds to try to learn and compare myself to the better players, in order to become competitive at this level.


Report:
Spoiler :

Turn 0: All forest in the BFC so far. outside, expecting to find myself with almost all land tiles and maybe 1-2 food resources. Move Warrior 1SE onto the hill, reveals more plains and hills, no resources.

Haven't seen anything worth risking a move for, so decide to settle in place. Here is a shot of my capital:

Washington-Turn0.jpg


Unfortunately, Gold is spotted just outside the NW border of the capitals BFC, as well as grasslands. A second city up there may be able to keep early research competitive.

Given the number of forests and 2 food resources, decide to tech AH -> Mining -> BW. Plan to improve the cow tile first. Also want to find Horses or Copper within reach of the gold.

I don't like sending my first scouting unit back through my own territory, so I will build another Warrior shortly. Use the Warrior to explore my own lands south/south west for a bit.

Turn 6: Meet Ragnar's scout. He must be close. In my experience, getting along with him is possible, but difficult. Perhaps a 2-3 city axe rush might be necessary.

MeetRagnar-Turn6.jpg


Turn 10: Scouting warrior kills a lion. Find jungle to the south and coast to the south west. Decide not to explore further into the jungle. Looks like there is another source of gold, as well as food. Here is a snapshot of the area:

SouthernLands-Turn10.jpg


Rice/gold may be a good city to quickly claim the gold and get research up and running. However, I am leaning towards founding a production city next in case we need to fight Ragnar. Wait and see.

Turn 14: Meet Alexander. Great, just great. Always end up fighting him. That production city is looking better and better.

MeetAlexander-Turn14.jpg


Turn 21: AH done. Find Horse just outside Ragnars borders. Almost lose warrior to a lion, but he survives and is promoted to Woodsman 1. Plan to rest him up and explore as much of the southeastern portion of the landmass as soon as I can.

RagnarHorse-Turn21.jpg


Turn 22: Buddhism FIADL.

Turn 23: Worker done, send him to improve cow tile. Start Warrior in capital. Reassign 3F tile to 2F1H cow tile (want N/NW scouting out earlier)

Turn 28: Find Horse deep in the jungle. Decide it is going to be too time consuming to clear the jungle to make early use of it.

Horse-Turn28.jpg


Turn 31: Warrior done in capital. Start on another Warrior.

Turn 32: Original warrior defeats a bear while in jungle. Rests until healed.

Turn 33: Mining done. Start BW.

Turn 34: 2nd warrior survives a lion encounter while on a hill. Alex adopts Slavery. (uh oh! :P)

Turn 35: Meet Gilgamesh. Every game I have had him as an AI he has done very well, usually is on a different landmass and is the strongest AI by the Industrial/Modern Age. Should be interesting to see him in the early game.

MeetGilgamesh-Turn35.jpg


Turn 37: Hinduism founded, by Ragnar. 3rd warrior done, start production of second worker.

I am not aware where Alexander or Gilgamesh are, but I met their scouts south of my city. I believe I may have some land behind me to the north to REX into as well as a few good city spots to the south. I may be able to build my next two cities towards the AI and backfill peacefully after that. We shall see, however. I intend to adopt Hinduism if it spreads to me and no other religions are present.

Turn 40: Warrior 2 kills a wolf. Gets Woodsman 1 promotion. I am obviously not used to the tech pace of Immortal, looks like my Worker will be idle for several turns before BW is in. Not a single non-forest hills tile in the BFC and I don't have roads. Decide to farm the one grassland river tile and work it for the extra commerce. Shaves 2 turns from BW. Also switch production to a barracks to allow Washington to grow a bit. Plan to have worker pop the same turn BW is done.

Turn 42: Meet Wang Kon to the south/southeast. Quite far away. Not a Buddhist.

MeetWangKon-Turn42.jpg


Turn 44: Meet Mansa Musa's scout. He is the Buddhist founder, and has three worst enemies.

MeetMansaMusa-Turn44.jpg


Turn 50: Original warrior dies to a lion while on flat ground. Managed to reveal a bit more of the south. Still only found Wang Kon and Ragnar at this stage. 2nd/3rd warriors finish scouting north, looks like we have a small area behind us with access to lots of resources. Will discuss city placement once copper is revealed.

Turn 55: Worker done in capital, BW reveals one source of copper, but it is in a poor-food area. Here is a picture of the known world with resources on.

KnownWorld-Turn55.jpg


Turn 56: Pressed end turn to clear Anarchy, switched to Slavery. RL interrupted me for quite a few hours at this critical point (of course).

There is a possible spot to build a 2nd city to claim sheep/stone, allowing us to try for the Pyramids, but I am worried about the fact I do not have either Hunting nor Archery for defense against barbarians.

I expect the Immortal AI to spawn more barbs than I am used to (although I do play AggAI on Monarch) and the AI to settle very quickly in my direction. Therefore I think I should found city 2 and 3 in the direction of the AI and city 2 should claim the copper.

By my calculations I can found four cities behind me, however, these will mostly be backfill type cities.

I think I have several choices for city 2 site, see the diagram below:

CopperSites-Turn56.jpg


Its 56 turns in and I only have two warriors. I chose site 2 as it will get me copper without a border pop. My dotmap for the backfill cities north of the capital will still use the clams, so those are not lost.

I planned to found city 3 on the coast to claim gold/fish as I should have Fishing and Mysticism available by then, however without a forest to chop early I think it will take too long to produce the monument/workboat. Think I will have to take the rice/gold site behind my capital to get it up and running sooner, although it will also need a border pop to claim the gold.

Tech path is Mysticism → Wheel → Writing.

I don't think I can afford to settle any cities in the jungle, despite the good assortment of resources available there. Plan after that is to let the AI clear out the jungles and prepare for a war against the closest AI (probably Ragnar) with cats/swords.

Add a settler to the build queue, sink a turn in and start applying chops. Alternate between this and Barracks production.

Turn 60: 3rd warrior defeats a barb archer while on a hill. Damn, that is fast. I think this vindicates my decisions on city 2. 2nd warrior fogbusts the proposed 2nd city site.

Turn 69: Barracks in Washington done. Add another Warrior.

Turn 71: Warrior completes due to chop. Sufficient hammers to finish Settler next turn.

Turn 72: Settler completes. Start a Worker.

Turn 74: 2 pop whip Worker. Put overflow into Stonehenge to provide some gold to keep research going.

Turn 75: New York founded. Start a Barracks. Figure city is not in desperate need of a border pop at this stage. Lose 4th warrior to a second archer spawned.

Turn 80: Kill another barb warrior with 2nd warrior. Ragnar has another city close to his capital, claiming dyes.

Turn 82: two more barb archers spawn north of Washington (is this normal on immortal? :P) Luckily, this is the exact same turn copper is hooked up to Washington. Prepare an axeman for a 1 pop whip.

Turn 84: Kill one barb archer at 94% odds, though, he does pillage the grassland farm first. Axeman is promoted to Woodsman 2.

Turn 86: Kill second barb archer at 77% odds but lose the corn farm to pillaging. Still think I am dead right now if I didn't hook up Copper that quickly. Decided to leave Stonehenge to build, only four turns left and I already have three workers. Two of my planned science cities need border pops anyway. Plan to chop out another settler after it is complete.

Turn 88: Complete Stonehenge. I think this will work out better than I originally planned: I can now found rice/gold city on the coast and reduce overlap with capital, and I can pick up gold/fish city a bit faster. Lastly, Ragnar has the Hindu holy city, which means a Great Prophet will be very useful in keeping my empire afloat should I capture it. Start building another Axeman and chopping a second Settler.

Stonehenge-Turn88.jpg


Turn 90: Check diplo screen of Ragnar. He is the worst enemy of both Wang Kon and Mansa Musa. I want OB to explore Ragnar's lands/religion spread however I decide against it for now, I have a feeling that Mansa Musa will do a better job of spreading Buddishm. I shall try to find out who else is close at hand.

Turn 92: Great Wall built in a faraway land.

Turn 96: Barracks finished in New York. Start on Axeman.

Turn 98: Axeman done in Washington. Settler due to finish in one turn due to two chops.

Turn 99: I stopped here, Writing is to finish this turn, also have an Axeman to move, a Settler to move, and a Worker team to move. Key decision is whether to settle Rice/Gold city or Fish/Gold city. I am now leaning towards settling the Fish/Gold city to deny the site to the AI.

Screenshots of my empire:

Empire-Turn99.jpg


South of my empire:

South-Turn99.jpg


Southeast:

SouthEast-Turn99.jpg


Southwest:

SouthWest-Turn99.jpg


Power:

PowerGraph-Turn99.jpg


Proposed city locations:

CityMap-Turn99.jpg


Plan for next few turns is to get 3rd and 4th cities mining gold for research and crank out more axes, add a fourth Worker and tech Fishing, then beeline to Construction. May try to backfill lands as time allows.

I think my start is actually a lot better than I thought it would turn out, I survived, grabbed an early Wonder and am beginning to develop a military. I think the two barb archers from the north delayed my capital's growth due to the additional whip required (still 20 turns of angry to go) and the two tiles pillaged, but if we build more Settlers it won't grow past the happy cap.


Save is linked below.
 

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ah, sorry, one last thing i might have forgotten: when posting reports please change them to your user name and give the date
 
Ok, I'll remember that for next time. Changed the save game name and civ name. Report took me quite a while to do so I don't really feel like going back through it, although it does have turn numbers indicated in the report. I'll add a game date to the next report if it is easier for people.
 
I've added the Immortal Cookbook to the Monarchist Cookbook Bullpen thread, and updated it as well. Link is in sig if anyone cares :lol:
 
to 1500BC
Spoiler :


Didnt go as well as i wanted, but oh well...

After settling on place it seemed that there wont be enough things to do if I start with worker, so i did warrior first.
Tech order: mining -> BW -> myst -> hunting -> archery -> wheel -> pottery -> writing
Buildorder: warrior -> worker -> worker -> settler

I dont normally start with warrior or do two workers in row, but it seemed the best option at that time, i also chopped settler right after to get the gold city up fast. I also chopped stonehenge into capital, mostly because i needed something non worker/settler to build to grow the city and my workers were chopping anyway so it was pretty fast to get done.

Not sure if the gold+fish was best choice for second city but atleast it boosted my research... or would have if barbarian archer hadnt destroyed the mine right after i got it done ( my archer was turn too late there :( ). My third city will take sugar, pigs, copper after first border pop.

My scouting warriors didnt last for too long so I barely see anything on map but it looks like I have enough space to rex anyway so scouting can be done later anyway.

Situation at 1500BC:
Civ4ScreenShot0060.jpg

Civ4ScreenShot0061.jpg


And yes, i dont have AH yet... somehow i couldnt fine time to research it, most likely its the first tech after writing.

 

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OK here we go. One of my fav leaders, and a reasonable looking start.

IMC 1, Round 1, 4000 BC-1500 BC:
Spoiler :
Settled in place, relying on the map generators "wisdom" to supply me some food after moving the warrior 1 SE and seeing nothing. Got a reasonable couple of tiles, Corn (not irrigated) and a Plains cow. Added to the nice river running through my cap, it should be a decent capitol. I really prefer coastal starts with this leader, but we cant always get what we want, eh.

I started a Worker while teching Mining --> BW. I sent my warrior off to explore, and found some nice areas to the SE. After the worker was finished and sent to farm the Corn, I built another warrior while growing the city. 2nd warrior went North, and found some more decent city sites, and when BW showed me Copper was very close, I figured I could skip Hunting and Archery and teched Wheel and Myst next.

New York was settled in 2600 BC, and started a Barracks, since Myst was not done yet. Once Myst came in, I waited until I was 9 turns from growing to 2-pop and stuck a Monument in front of the Barracks, and started teching AH. I spit out another warrior, and worker, then started a Barracks in Washington, and when I hit 4 pop, I stuck a settler in for a 2-pop whip.

Meanwhile, my workers were busy chopping, building some mines, and connecting Washington and NY, as well as putting a road on the Copper so I could mine it ASAP when the borders popped. I had a good 4 warriors by now, luckily, because 2 barb warriors and a barb archer converged on New York. I managed to hold them off, as my settler was finishing (overflow went into finishing the barracks and another warrior).

I settled Boston in 1700 BC down by the Horses. My theory is that its on the coast, and has 2 inland lake tiles, which will be 3F2C once I build a Lighthouse. I mined the Copper as I started a couple more workers, teched Writing after AH, and my set ended with 13 turns left on Pottery, and my tech rate a dismal 7 BPT (50% slider breaks even). With writing in, I should be able to chop out a few Libraries. I am going to need IW pretty soon, to develop Boston.

Here are some relevant screenshots:
Spoiler :
Washington
Civ4ScreenShot0257.jpg


New York
Civ4ScreenShot0258.jpg


Boston
Civ4ScreenShot0259.jpg


Northern lands Dotmap
Civ4ScreenShot0255.jpg


Southern Dotmap
Civ4ScreenShot0256.jpg


Techs:
3725 Mining
3100 BW
2750 Wheel
2500 Myst
2975 AH
1575 Writing

Military and Buildings:
5 warriors, 3 with promotions.
2 workers, 2 in progress
2 Barracks
1 Monument, one building

AIs met:
Wang
Mansa (Buddhism)
Alex (Hindu)
Ragnar

Open Borders with all.

Pros:
-Should be able to expand to 10ish cities, need to put 3rd city up East of NY to cut off Rags (maybe ON Marblem maybe on Desert near Gems?)
-Access to Copper in 2 cities, need road for 3rd
-2 Barracks up, makes Axe Rush a possibility?
-Writing in, can chop/whip Libraries for teching

Cons:
-Low tech rate
-Lack of workers (2 being built)
-no "barb killer" units made yet
 

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Spoiler :


immortal-cookbook-1-1500bc.jpg


3500 AH for cows. Problem is no commerce and time to BW. Saw gold (commerce) and started Mysticism for a border pop for the northern one.
2600 Mysticism
2875 Wheel to keep worker busy (too long for BW)
2575 New York for gold commerce. Didn't have a good reason for grabbing the northern gold rather than the southern one. Safer, but meh.
2050 BW
1800 Boston - had been building road down coast for a fish/gold city, but then saw copper.
1775 Pottery for Granaries - but maybe could have waited and started Masonry right away.

1 Barracks, 1 Monument, 4 Warriors (lost 1), 3 Workers

Working on Masonry and Settler for lake/Sheep/Stone. Probably should have chopped Workers before the Settler. Plan for Washington is to chop some workers then Pyramids, not sure I really want it but Ind/Stone, OK. Maybe should chop Workers in the other 2 cities, for that matter.

Maybe should have adopted Slavery after finishing the 2nd Settler, but the moment didn't seem right.

Northern Warrior is cowering in the forest rather than exploring.
 

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- 1500BC

Spoiler :


Mmm a blue circle indicating we should move but it would take at least 2 moves so settled in place. Starting techs are fishing/agr so first build was a worker for the corn. Were industrious so I decided SH would be good to go for so first tech was Myst. I then went AH/Mining/BW/Wheel. It would mean the worker wouldn't have anything to do for a few turns but not to important as we could use the 3 hammer plains hills for building before BW came in.

My initial warrior went South meeting Ragnar/Alex/Wan in that order. He was exploring well and hit the dizzy heights of woodsman II when this happened.

Civ4ScreenShot0028.jpg


Lost at 99% odds. With all the jungle down there a new explorer would have to wait.

Apparently were doing well in the advanced status.

Civ4ScreenShot0027.jpg


At least we made the top 7. :)

So after building a couple more warriors we started on Stonehenge and.

Civ4ScreenShot0029.jpg


We have now managed to build rocks. :lol:

I wasn't to worried about barbs as warriors fortified in a city with 40% defence are unlikely to lose against archers. i.e

Civ4ScreenShot0030.jpg


90% to win and another behind if he happened to lose and you can always whip.

This is a bit different.

Civ4ScreenShot0031.jpg


:eek::eek::eek::eek:

I had settled New York for the clams/bronze and the barb axe appeared the turn the copper was hooked up. Nothing the whip can't handle so he was duly seen off not before he pillaged our pasture though. :(

The beeline for SH set back my settling plus the lack of gold from huts so have just settled the third city for the fish/gold. Long term not great but working the fish and gold will bring in commerce whilst building some workers. Currently only have 2 but that is the problem of going for early wonders.

After BW I went for Masonry for a possible shot at the Great Wall but no real chance at getting it as I have to much else to do. That takes us up till 1500BC. Just about to finish Pottery.

I assume as the idea is to play on from the best save I won't say what my future plans would be but with this much land available a strong rex would be a good idea.

Finally the demographics.

Civ4ScreenShot0033.jpg


Now off to read the other reports.
 

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Save for 1500 BC.

Spoiler :


I'm fooling around a bit going for a wonderhog game, I'm used to normal speed now so I thought it took a long time to meet any AIs. I was thinking we were isolated first then I saw that it was only 2675 BC when I met Ragnar.
Gambling with Oracle to finish at the same time as Writing and then planned to pick Aesthetics. Was going for Maths first for chop bonus but then suddenly made contact with lots of civs, 2 warmongers and 2 techwhores, should be interesting for diplomacy.
At least TGW went late (1675) so I'm hoping there's no other wonderhog wannabees around.
There's good enough lands to the north for 3 more cities putting us at 5, squeezing in another should be no problem, only spot with a bit of urgency for this type of strat is the marble.
Normally I'd go for more aggressive expansion and try to get the gems when I get copper so close to my capital and all but I set this up as a wonderhog/diplomacy game ala Obsolete.
Could be difficult with Ragnar as closest neighbour though, we'll see. ;)

Tech: Mining->BW->Myst->TW->Poly->PH->Writing (in progress)
Notable omissions: AH, no time with this strat.

Builds: Worker->Worker->Warrior->Warrior->Warrior->Stonehenge->Warrior->Settler->Axeman->Oracle
(Some hammers on Barracks now and then)

Assuming Oracle is successfull, AH should be next followed by Masonry then see what we can trade Aest for with a little research. Stone city up next and Finish Barracks->Pyramids

Some pics:

ImmCookbook10000.jpg


2 prechopped forest by Washington marked in save. Probably use them for Pyramids along with two more or so so that settling the stone city can be delayed a little (economy drag, prefer second gold but stone more important for Pyramids unfortunately).

ImmCookbook10001.jpg


ImmCookbook10002.jpg




Edit: I decided to be a little more userfriendly and added a couple of pics.
 

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One question, which mods if any are used? Do you use Solver's patch? BUG? Perhaps we should have version numbers as well if you do.

I might try it too, depending on the answer to Gliese's question. :) BUG doesn't modify the gameplay, so it shouldn't matter if you use it or not, as long as you installed in directly in the Custom Assets folder, and not in a separate mod folder. Solver's patch is another question though... The non-patched saves are probably still usable, but the results may not be comparable.

For the record I use 3.17 with Solver's patch and BUG in Custom Assets.
 
I used the same patch+mods as Carl Corey for my round.
 
1500bc.

This is what happens when you rush a game without thinking:

Spoiler :

ic1a0000.jpg


Four small cities (3 of them 1 tile from the coast!). Four workers, five warriors. No wonders. 2 barax, 2 monments. Couple of axes being built. Little exploration.
Techs: mining, BW, myst,AH, wheel (writing next turn).


This is save the trash game, isn't it?
 
Finally found time to play. Sorry for the lacklustre report. Life's pretty hectic right now.
Spoiler :
Fun map. It's a fairly tough start in some respects, but there'll be plenty to work with as the game goes on, and I'm looking forward to seeing what other players have in mind.

For me, security concerns trumped both the desire to block off a big chunk of land and the temptation to go for an early wonder-grab. In the short term, barbs worried me. But, looking further ahead, Ragnar was my main concern. At this level, with a highly aggressive leader nextdoor, my policy is almost always "crush at the first opportunity". Hence, my save is very much aimed at getting an army in the field.

The state of play:
Spoiler :
Culture map, showing Raggy's location to the east:
IC1R11Culture.jpg


Cities and resources:
IC1R12Map.jpg


Capital:
IC1R13Wash.jpg


2nd city:
IC1R14NYC.jpg


3rd city:
IC1R15Bost.jpg


Units:
IC1R16Units.jpg


Tech:
1c1R17Tech.jpg

 

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