Barbarians of different races and other twists for Barbarians

As I looked into wicshade's thread I remembered of something that really astonished me for quite some time.
1. Why should all barbarians have the same race, namely be orcs, especially if you consider that there are human barbarian civilizations. I found it one of the coolest things about Civ Rev, (the lack of complexity on the other hand disturbed me) that barbarians of different climatic zones had different leaders, so why don't we create human, nightelvish and dwarven barbarians. Especially for the Worldspell of the Svartalfar would be much more useful in a multiplayer game, if you introduced barbarian units with the unit skins of Svartalfar. Overall I think we have by far too less barbarian leaders. Every civilization once had wild and barbaric beginning.
The nightelves after my understanding of their flavor still are some kind of predators waiting for their prey in their deep forests (and I think Svartalfar need a second leader, who could have barbarian).
And I always wondered why there is no evil dwarven empire, because greed, which is strongly associated with the Dwarves, has high potential to turn one evil, when nothing has a value except gold. A such civilization, to come back to my point, has left everything civilized behind and would therefor be called barbarian. Another possibility would be connected to artifacts. Think of Gollum saying "my precious" after he was confrontated with the Ring. Wouldn't you say Gollum is barbaric? This also would be a good background for a Dwarven Barbarian civilization (though Gollum is of course no dwarf, but that doesn't matter IMHO)
2. If leaders with the barbarian trait would be able to improve the overall tech level of the barbarians of their race (So orcs could give the barbarians the possibility of producing Ogres for example, once they discovered the techs related to this units), this would make the trait much more interesting.
3. Linked with point 2 the territory of Barbarian leaders should be treated as Barbarian territory concerning the appearance of new barbarians. Because once all land is settled, no barbarians can appear anymore and make the trait quite useless. This way barbarians still could appear.
4. If this is not possible to realize, I have another idea that should be doable: Barbarian leaders can build barbarian camps in their territory by sacrificing a unit of that type. Every x turns a new barbarian appears on this camp similar to the forts of the scorpion clan.

I have one thing to say- Don't expect any Dwarves to go barbarian. The Dwarves are not about greed, all the money they make is appropriated through legitimate and fair means.

I would rather suggest to create

1) Pirates
2) Lizardmen
3) Orcs (might be splitted into Goblins, Orcs, Ogres as well but not necessary)

However I believe this is better to be realized in a Scenario. Then these races could be minor civs like in Rhye's and Fall of Civilization.

I think that human competitors just can't compete with the Orcs, who are basically humans optimised for barbarity. Elven barbarians are a nice idea, though.

Rod - I assume you mean different competing AI barbarian factions? Not bad in theory, but Lizardmen are typically affiliated with the Orcs if I recall correctly. Maybe expand on the Frostlings, though?

Giving a percentage of the barbarians skins that mimicked the barbarian leader (or svart) nearest to the spawning point would bring meaning and open up for unique barb promotions that could provoke players to counter in new ways.

fx. barbs spawning near the clan could gain +20% fire dmg. or blaze... That would make mob 1 + water 1 adepts much more valuable.

Killing barbs is fun.

Come on this is dark fantasy and I've know enough fantasy books, fantasy games or Pen&Papers where dwarves are really greedy. The fair and legitimate dwarf is just the one image of the dwarf, a quite prominent I concede, but there exist others. FFH right now has two different images of the dwarves: The dwarven tinkerer and the dwarven warriors/merchant (Gimli style) who love gold (by what reason is never specified. From the second IMHO it's not a far way to a greed driven dwarven civilization (I don't know by what D&D Duergars are evil, so I don't know if they are a good example, because I mostly play Realms of Arcania), I even know roleplay systems, that have "real barbarian" dwarves (Realms of Arcania, the most successful P&P in Germany) and these roleplay systems are no unknown ones.

One thing that I like about FFH is that Kael and his team don't try to create civilizations everybody likes. I'm sure there would be lots of players who would like an evil dwarven civ, though some would hate them. But that's the fate of all other civilizations. Some like them, some don't.

Concerning elves as I already said, it would have a game meaning. Right now the worldspell of the Svarts is really useless in MP. If there would be nightelf barbarians it wouldn't be so clear that it's Madame Viconia who is attacks you. And elves (especially Svarts) aren't just Treehuggers, but as I said the born predators (better reflexes, faster, better sensory perception and so on)

And if Orcs are so superior to human why haven't they killed humans long ago? Doviello are in fact Barbarians so similar tribes also should exist.
It is a matter of climatic zones: Orcs are along their racial promotions a jungle race, so they have expulsed all human barbarians in their terrain , not all over the world, because they are perfectly adapted to their environment. But as a jungle civ the Orcs surely never would dominate in tundra (if in the choice of making them a jungle civ is any logic), as they would be killed in the hills by dwarven tribes and in the forests by elves.

P.S.: Resources exist to be consumed. And consumed they will be, if not by this generation then by some future. By what right does this forgotten future seek to deny us our birthright? None I say! Let us take what is ours, chew and eat our fill. - Nwabudike Morgan, the Ethics of Greed - This could be the Ethics of an Evil Dwarven Empire

hey, nice thread with good ideas. I definitely agree that having only orcish barbarian gets repetitive after a while