My Take on Surviving the AA on Emperor

I was reading a post in the strategy articles on "Moving up to Emperor: Surviving the Ancient Era". It may or may not have had validity in vanilla, I would not endorse it though. Link here:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=254588

Two things struck me right away. First the settings, large with 8 civilizations on continents. That yields a lot of space to work with and as an expansionist, you are going to get a lot of huts. To me this distorts the game and does not let players learn to cope. The other thing I do not like to see promulgated is "9 workers, 8 regular spearmen, 4 veteran swordsmen, 1 galley, 4 barracks". Eight spears and 4 swords? I would not like to teach players to build lots of spears in a standard game at this level. I could mention a third thing, the 7 towns. If you are playing as England, an expansionist civ, you should do much better than 7 towns on a large map with only 8 nations.

I understand some times, you cannot, but much of the time you will have lots of land and time. Starting off telling players to use these concepts is like tying one arm behind their backs, not a good idea. The "Attack phase" is another place I would not use. Grab two towns and play defense? You will get bogged down? Well maybe, but I doubt it. My main issue is not with stopping at two towns, but play defense. The proposition put forth is to use horsemen and attack attackers and play defense. It could get expensive as swords could kill any of your units with their 3 attack and you having either 2 defense or 1 in the case of horses. What if they have contacts and can get an alliance.

Remember in C3 you can get them with Writing. "After 8 or so turns on defense, enemy should be willing to make peace on very favorable terms. Try to get 2 Medieval advances (Feudalism and Monotheism) from them." This seems a bit out of step to me as we started a war with swords and we take 2 towns and now they already have Middle Age techs to give up for peace? Not so sure that is going to happen. They now have pikes. In any event they are not going to give up Feudalism. In short I do not agree with anything much in this article and it may be fine in C3, but it is not a good idea. A better idea for players making the jump is to try to stay out of wars, until you are nearing the end of the expansion phase. This is better facilitated with not making spears, but making workers and settlers and warriors.

Early wars tend to slow down your growth. This is especially true as you move up the later in difficulty. I do agree with the idea that you want to get out of a war quickly, unless you can make a significant gain. That would be to eliminate a neighbor or gain a key resource. The higher you are playing the harder it is to "cripple" an AI with a grabbing of a town or two as their discounts let them make it up. What is really needed is an article that is pertains to Conquest.

Let's see if we can come up with anything useful along that line. I will use the learn by example style or here is a game log to follow. Do note that this is just a single game, played with a single style and is nothing more than that. In other words, it not a template or even the best way. It is just one way for one game.

4000BC:

No picture of the start as you can see that anytime in any save or a later pix. It is a good start, from what I can see. The settler and worker are on a hill to start next to a river and I can see cow and wheat and gems. It is as good as you could hope for and there is nothing to think about. You would found on the spot. You would send the worker to the cow. We are not playing Always War, so I can hope to have some peace to expand for a time.

We can see another cow that will be in our border on the first expansion. This means we have 3 food bonus tiles right next to the capitol. I can also see a deer not far away and we do have the gems, but they are on a mountain.

That means lots of worker turns to get them in the box. We have only one bonus grassland that I can see, but we have hills. The cow on a plain is normally irrigated, even in despotism, but do we need the extra food in this town? Will we want to share cows and so want it irrigated anyway? I cannot know yet as I do not see enough land to determine the town placement. Let me say that I have no issue with irrigation or mining of the cows as we have that wheat. Right now we need the extra food, so irrigate is for me. I like to go ahead and set the research now. We have two things to choose 1) the tech 2) the pace.

Normally I would be playing with no huts and a big bonus for the AI, so I would go with 20%, the minimum, until I could drop it to 10%. You could go 100% as you can and gain a few beakers. I prefer the extra cash to pay for later research. This is not a game breaking pick, so do it either way. Then what do you pick for your tech? If this was Always War, I would consider going after the GLB. It is not, so I am not concerned about it. My take on Emperor is you tend to not get a lot out of it for the price. This is a pangaea map, so contacts will be quick and the tech pace should be quick as well.

I am ignoring the shot at an SGL. We are not scientific and will not be first to many techs in this age, so why sweat it. I would normally not bother to check on who is in the game as I would be lucky to be able to met one nation, before my start techs would be known. So I could make my choice without regard to the others. Just for the record, you can use F10 and find the others in the game. We find that we have Celts, Russians, Arabians, Babs, Aztecs, Chinese and Egypt. Here is a summary of the techs they know at the start:

Alpha 1 (us)
Pottery 4
CB 4
BW 2
WC 3
Mason 2

This means we have a monopoly on Alpha and go for Writing, if we like. I do that as once we get down the road to finishing Writing and have met a few of the others, we can peddle Alpha. This may in fact not work as we have two expansionist nations. It could turn out that many of the AA techs will be popped and traded, we cannot know how that will turn out, so I ignore that factor. We can expect that it will not be much of a shot for us though.

The only thing left is to decide on what to build. The game will default to an archer. This is not an awful thing, if barbs are popped near us as on this level, they could be a bother. I do not like to make archers, unless it is AW as they are not very strong and you will not be upgrading them. I also do not like to make anything other than warriors without a barracks. I switch to a warrior. We will need MP units as we only get 1 citizen born content if I remember correctly. We also need to get out and met the others. One more thing to say about the research. Yes we would like Pottery and even Masonry, but four nations know Pottery. This means it will be cheap and we should be able to get it in some sort of a trade or research it fast, once we get going.

I know a lot of people like to talk about the slingshot and it can be done, but it is not a priority for me. Let me state, I am a plodder not a race horse. I will be in no hurry to win and normally will not spend much time with diplomacy. I tend to make trades only when I need them and I intend to just take all the land. I am saying that I will probably try to get Writing and then Philo. What I take for the free one depends on the game.

It does not matter a lot to me, but if you can bust in at that point and trade to get what you need to pick Rep do it. If you have managed to get those tech before then, great. The settings are standard map, pangaea with 7 other nations. I forget what the barbs are and the temp and age or the middle ones, I think. It is 60% water, pretty sure anyway. You can find out with SeedBeast. C3 players take note that the minimum research rate means 50 turns.

3950BC:

worker starts irrigation. Here we are saying that we want the extra food more than the extra commerce. We could swap the citizen next turn to gain 1 food and give up 1 commerce and 2 shields. The shields are going to be lost either way. If you go that route, you leave the citizen on the wheat for the next turn as well. This gives you two extra food and when you put the pop back on the cow it will be irrigated and three more turns needed for the next warrior.

IOW, both the warriors finish in the same amount of time, but you gain what amounts to an extra turn of food as you are at +2 now. The two gold is not that important right now. These are things you can elect to consider or not. In the end, it is not critical. It is more important to manage the empire in terms of structures and workers.

None of it will matter if Montie and Cleo are close and decide to take your land. Their early UU with two moves and cheap cost could be harsh. So we play as if that is not going to happen, nothing we could do anyway for some time.

So we drop the growth from 7 turns to 5 turns and now we are making a road and have +3 food. The warrior drops down to 3 more turns, so we have the same 4 turn output on it. I sent out a unit as we will get the next one at the same time as we grow.

3600BC:

Sent out the second warrior. This means we we have to use the slider at 10% as we grew to size 2. We will have another warrior in 3. It turns out we have a bonus grassland in the borders that I did not see due to the graphic of the town. I have the worker moved to the second cow as we will get a border pop in 2 turns.

3500BC:

I have not seen barbs, so I pull out SeedBeast and see we have barbs turned off? I think the last thing I did was to gen a map for GR25 and they did not want barbs. The funny thing is they got barbs anyway? I could be I went to my other machine to actually make their map and forgot to set it to none. Anyway we have no barbs in this game.

Personally I do not care one way or the other. At DG or less I tend to go with roaming, above I tend to turn them off. If we had the huts we may have gotten something useful like a tech, at least some gold here and there.

I am slowly getting back hang of the movement as I had played Beyond the Sword before this and kept trying to move the wrong way.

3350BC:

I am going to make a worker as we have the wheat and the other worker will need two turns to get back. We can put off a 4th warrior so we can have two MP's and two roving. I dial down the slider as we have an MP now.

These are the things that can help, pay attention to the sliders on growth and research.

3250BC:

Worker is out and moves to wheat. We need food with no granary. We found water on two sides. I have both cows irrigated and I am working on the wheat. I am playing a bit loose as I make a barrack as I wait to grow.

Veteran archer and then will start on a settler. We have not met anyone and are not growing fast enough to want to make a settler before size 4. The good news is the AI will see us as stronger and will not try to demand anything. If they do, it will be war. On emperor, I treat them with contempt. Let them jump if they feel like it. I do not expose enough land to know if the water is all the way around. We make shields so the rax is 4 turns.

3100BC:

Worker on the gems now as we have both cows up and have +4 food at size 2.

3000BC:

Size 3 and I have to move the new pop to the wheat as the Gov drops him on a forest tile. We now have +6 food. Sure wish we had Pottery, but if I had not miss clicked I would be meeting someone next turn as I see China. Did I mention we dropped research to 10?

2850BC:

It turns out it was Arabian border and they want Alpha for Pottery, not doing that right now. Archer in and I start the settler. I move the worker that was on the wheat to road toward the next town. I am going for the hill with a river. It has the deer and a wheat flood tile is near. Those flood plains will get the settlers going. The hill is partially in the dark.

Here is the 4000BC save:

2800BC:
Another one of those points where we may be able to do some good. Rome grows to 4 and that means we need happiness boost. We can up the slider
to 10% again, so we do it. We notice that the citizens are working cow, cow, wheat and forest. We have 13 food and 7 shields. That drops our growth to +5.

If we give up the gold and extra shield by moving to the BG, we get 14 food
and 6 shields. Cost us a gold, but the shields we do not need right now. The
extra food keeps the growth at +6. We need to get the gem online and move the to the BG. I do not want to stop the road to the next site though.

2670BC:
Settler out next turn and we grow, so we will only drop to size 3. Workers
moves to next task. One to BG and one to deer.

2630BC:
did you drop the slider after Gems connected or did you forget? No big deal,
do it now. I start an archer for the next one and send our archer to new site. Still trying to move as BtS, shakes head.

2950BC:
here is why I hate the diplo aspect of the game and Civ4 is worse. I see Hammi and offer Alpha and he gives Mason + BW and 4 gold. I then dial up our Arabian friends, they are annoyed, and offer Alpha and get Pottery. He had no gold.

Now we have to think about a granary. We could make an attempt to time the granary for maximum benefit, but I am too lazy. This is not a HoF run, so why work so hard?

I had two workers that will soon be able to do a chop to speed it up, so I stay with the max shields for now and squeeze out an archer first.

2510BC:
Worker finishes road and moves to nearest forest. Granary in 9 turns. We have a second city making a warrior. I would prefer a worker, but we cannot grow fast enough.

2390BC:
I am blind as I was next to a border and never saw it. Cathy dials me up and
offers CB for Alpha. We know that probably means she has not met the other two yet. I counter with her adding in her last 10 gold and we have a deal.

We have risked the jump, but we got 4 techs and 14 gold, so I can live with it. We still cannot up the research to any effect. I looked at the town and I see we do not have to do any work to get the max from the build. We are 5 more turns for granary at 7spt. We grow in 4 at +4. We do have a chop due in 4 so we should get the shields we need in time. It is 28 in the box and 28 in 4 turns, plus 10 from chop. That is 66, should work just fine.

2310BC:
Chop is done now and we have 3 turns for granary and growth, sweet. I get greedy and move pop off forest to gem to gain 3 gold for one turn.

2230BC:
I see now that the granary has to be done the turn before, so I go back to
gems to slow growth for one more turn.

2190BC:
I will take another chance and go for a temple here as I want to get a bit
larger. I will chop the forest to speed it a bit as I do not care about the
extra shield from the Gov using it during the growth. You can get a boost from the shields that way and then adjust after you get control. I do not want to deal with that all during the AA and we have two BG's and two cows, so we are good.

2150BC:
Size 5 so we need to go to 10% again.

2110BC:
Start a granary in the second town. Spot new borders with the warrior that
turned back. Worker out, so we have 3 and all are chopping. Glad this is not
Civ4 as we would want to keep some trees. We will get 20 shields for the granary by chops, that should make it go faster.

2070BC:
Size 6 so more slider.

1990BC:
We met Mao and he wanted Alpha and 23g for Wheel. I gave Alpha and CB for Wheel and his 10g. Rome is size 7.

1910BC:
Start settler in 3. I have been skirting new borders, sure to be Cleo.

1870BC:
Cleo says hi and offers Myst for 150, I give 145 and see she know IW.

1830BC:
I see a green guy so I look at F4 and see Cathy and Monie's faces. Only one
missing. I go ahead and peddle Myst to Hammi for 30 and Mao I give it and 140 for IW.

1790BC:
Settler off to the hill as we are looking for the horses at some point. Start
a spear as I expect some action soon. Writing next turn. Veli worker starts
towards the iron. I switch Veli granary to temple to pull in the iron.

1750BC:
Made some friends for now. I traded Write to Arabia for HBR + 160g. Write to
Cleo for 120g. In case you were not aware as you peddle a tech it drops in value.

I am not saying I got fair value, I got what they had. Just that you can expect to get less with each trade. Mao has little so I trade Write for 25g. I figure it will be someone else getting the money anyway for my tech.

1700BC:
I found Antium last turn. I am running 100% to get Philo, first I hope.

1675BC:
Had to put a pop as scientist in Rome.

1625BC:
I found Ivory by China and have seen Silk and Incense as well. So I can expect to deal with AC's and Riders.

1600BC:
Arabia wants 33 gold, I decline and they DOW. I had put up walls in Antium
that will be done next turn. Worker is connecting the iron at Veli and it should expand in a turn or two to bring them in house. I am not sure I want to make Legions just yet, will think on that some. I switch Veli to a wall due in two turns. All towns are on hills so with a wall, they should be fine. I had sent a spear to the next site, but I will recall it now.

1525BC:
Philo is in and I take Lit. Map Making is not a much help to me as I am land
locked right now and this is pangaea. No one had anything to help or any money.

That is about what you would expect. Well I have not played Emperor other than AW in some time, but that is my impression. I am putting up barracks in the two towns in case others join the party. I have a settler, but I am not sure I want to send it out right now. I see lots of Pink borders, so I am considering making Legions and ripping them during the GA.

Yeah I only have a few towns and I am despotic, but it will be crushing to anyone I want.

1375BC:
Last turn I used a Legion to kick things off.

1225BC:
Kill 3 units and autorazed Arabian town for 1 gold and a slave. Got one elite.

1175BC:
I have three elites and the first one I attacked with got a leader. Looks like
a Legion army it will become, sad news for Arabia. I am in a giving mood so
I deal Philo for Math and 70 gold. I then deal Lit for Map Making. I am not
going to build the GLB anyway. I pop another settler out of Rome as we can spread out some now that we are doing damage.

1150BC:
1st kills archer and we will be able to make the HE. I sent out a boat to find
the missing Celts. I am sure they are tucked behind Cleo as that is about the only place I have not been, unless they are on an island.

1100BC:
This is too easy, I got my fourth elite and I razed two towns. The Arabian
tribe was the tech leader, but will be gone soon at this rate and the army has not gotten on the scene yet.

950BC:
Well this game is over. I just got a second MGL. I razed another town and the 1st is near Mecca. Mecca is size 2. All the towns I hit were size 1, how did they get the tech lead?

Legion, coupled with the Mil trait is just spawning elites seemingly in the first win. The AI will not attack them, unless they are yellow and then they lost the one time they tried that. It is hard to tell if they have three towns or more I see Basra and I am sure one is west of it. I am not sure if one is east of Mecca or not.

I could just go to Monarchy and do AW on this one in a waltz. I tried to make it easy by not making settlers and expanding right away, but the AI is too weak. Monte the lame won't trade Construction for Lit and CoL and cash, just because it has the GW.

850BC:
I autorazed a town and I see he has 3 left. I decide to be nice and make peace for 1 town and Construction. He now has two towns. I could not form an army as I only have 5 towns right now. Time to get some more out.

825BC:
How sweet, Hammi demands Construction, so I get my war anyway. I have the HE, 1 settler out and 2 coming. I have no idea why he thinks it is a good plan to attack someone that just clobbered the top dog and has Legions and an army???

690BC:
1st grabs Uruk. I am not too worried about flips as I will be clearing the
area of those homely blue tunics. This gives 8 towns so I form the 2nd and off it goes to see some Bab guys. I have not mentioned the wonder races going as you can see the founding dates in the F7 screen if you care. I think China finally started on SoZ last turn.

I am hoping my good friends the Arabian people will want to jump in so I can clear them out. They have regrown a number of towns.

610BC:
Tried another deal with Russia for Monarchy, but even three techs would not
budge her. It has the HG, so till it is built no deal. Well maybe for Republic.

I forgot to mention that Monte wanted 32 gold and I said no, so he declared
as well. I love to make friends.

590BC:
Got a third leader and captured Nineyeh.

530BC:
Crazy, one Legion killed a unit and was 2/5. It was attacked adn won going 1/5. It was attacked again and won. I moved it away, but did not see a warrior in the fog.

The IBT it got attacked again and won. It starts this turn with all those wins, too bad I did not use the leader, it would have been a good cantidate for one.

1st autorazed Elippi. I decide to rush the FP in Nineyeh to ease the culture
pressure and use the leader.

450BC:
Razed Babylon and some autoeazed town.

410BC:
Finally find Brennus. He is up Monarchy and down CoL and Lit. Most have Monarchy.

370BC:
Got another leader. Republic is in, so I do two more deals. It went something
like this, Cathy gets Rep for Monarchy and cash and 15gpt. Cleo gets it for
Currency 60 and a worker. Is that sad or what? I should have held one of those towns as I only have 11 right now. I have 2 en route to sites though.

I have 4 towns making settlers and 1 making workers. I got quite a few slaves from Hammi so far. I start on Engineering as I want to be able to cross rivers and I am not making Sun Tzu. In fact I probably won't make any wonders as I can just roll over these guys.

350BC:
Capture Samarra for the 12th and then raise the 3rd army. Will be able to make Pentagon now. I have not tried to gain more lux as I do not need them just yet.

I am going to be munificent and make peace for 1 town and 40 gold. I abandon it as I usually do. So only Monte is at war with me now and I have not seen any of his boys. I have to determine if I want to go into Rep or Monarchy.

I would tend to go into Monarchy here and just play kill the suckers. This would let me go ahead and declare on Arabia and clear the holdings they have between my two lands. The 4th unit will make the armies roll over even the pikes.

I guess I pretty much did everything the opposite of what I stated at the start. That is sort of good as games should dictate how you play, rather than have some locked in plan. Was it Sun Tzu that said the first contact with the enemy will force a change in plans or something like that?

In short you could have gone with a more traditional style here and stay nice, which means paying some tribute. You would have needed to have gotten settlers out sooner. The thing is this shows you do not have to do it that way and that Emperor nations can be handled.

It is true that being Rome, made it easier, but I have done similar things with other civilizations. I am posting the 4000BC and the stop point saves for those that want to look at things.

I will confess that I did not bother to manage the citizen that much, just not needed. Three armies at this stage is so strong and the extra leader for the FP!

I read the article and thought "why *plan* on losing units... why not train artillery and try to lose less units?" 2 stacks also didn't seem like necessarily the best idea.

We will need MP units as we only get 1 citizen born content if I remember correctly.

Click to expand...

With the food around I certainly don't get this. Maybe a warrior for scouting, but I tend to use the luxury slider early on. I can see how it helps, and using an MP works fine, but I don't see a need here.

I will take another chance and go for a temple here as I want to get a bit
larger.

Click to expand...

In Rome? If you built it in Rome, I can't believe you would build a temple in the ancient age like this (there's one exception, but you don't play that way). Man, you must really hate using the luxury slider. I'd much rather expand like crazy and found towns soon as one temple for Rome costs you just as much as two settlers (plus food, but you've got 5 food/turn and a granary, right?). Heck, I'd rather train 3 archers, 3 spearman, 2 swords, or even 6 warriors than a build a temple for almost all game conditions *this* early in my capital.

1675BC: Had to put a pop as scientist in Rome.

Click to expand...

Instead of a worker or a settler from a town where you had a granary? Or raise the luxury slider?

I have three elites and the first one I attacked with got a leader.

Click to expand...

Now that's good luck.

350BC:
Capture Samarra for the 12th and then raise the 3rd army. Will be able to make Pentagon now.

Click to expand...

Well, I don't war early usually, but that seems *really* fast.

Nice game. But, I think way too many early MGLs makes it something of an "untypical" game, although I could be wrong on that.

Thanks for responding, I know this is not a real good example, but it is just what I got and I did not want to spend a lot of time on it. The thread was so old I did not feel it would fair to put any post in it.

Let see if I can remember what was going on at the time.

"Quote:
We will need MP units as we only get 1 citizen born content if I remember correctly. Unquote"

"With the food around I certainly don't get this. Maybe a warrior for scouting, but I tend to use the luxury slider early on. I can see how it helps, and using an MP works fine, but I don't see a need here."

I did not find the quote, so I am not sure of the context. No action was taken, I am merely pointing out that once we grow, we need an MP or you could use the slider. I am fine with either, but I will usually make an MP and leave the slider alone at this stage.

I need troops and I can gain some coin. I don't see any advantage to using the slider with 1 town and no MP's at the time. Remember the MP is free at this point.

"Quote:
I will take another chance and go for a temple here as I want to get a bit
larger. Unquote"

"In Rome? If you built it in Rome, I can't believe you would build a temple in the ancient age like this (there's one exception, but you don't play that way). Man, you must really hate using the luxury slider. I'd much rather expand like crazy and found towns soon as one temple for Rome costs you just as much as two settlers (plus food, but you've got 5 food/turn and a granary, right?). Heck, I'd rather train 3 archers, 3 spearman, 2 swords, or even 6 warriors than a build a temple for almost all game conditions *this* early in my capital."

I found it and it is from 2190BC. Well here is where I get punished a bit for not taken more screen shots. I don't know what size the town was at that point.

I am sure I wanted to get a temple in the town to allow it to have more people working and not needing to raise the slider higher, at a later date. I will need to get to at least 20% and likely 30% on the lux slider down the road. If I want have close to the max pop and all working, I am going to need the temple.

I know I have no lux any where close enough to be mine for a very long time, figure middle ages some time. That is why I get the temple in now. I am not worried about expanding, that will come after I am set up. A settler will not come out very fast in Rome and I do not want to let it drop in size.

It has food, but not many shields as the three food tiles are irrigated. You are correct I would not like to make a temple and any of the things you listed would be preferable. I just knew that Rome was not going to be making settlers till it was much bigger and not many at any time.

Remember I am not going to get along with my neighbors, so I need to be able to either scare them or kill them. I do not pay bribes unless I am play above Emperor.

Also remember this is just one way to play one game, not meant to be anything more than that. It is intended and hoped that some of the points with be useful to others.

"Quote:
1675BC: Had to put a pop as scientist in Rome. unquote"

"Instead of a worker or a settler from a town where you had a granary? Or raise the luxury slider?"

In a word, yes. I had no need of a worker at that point and Rome is not my settler town. I did not want to expand at that point. Understand, I see all the land near me and I know it is mine, when I decide to have it. I do not have to rush off to get it and expose it to loss.


"Quote:
350BC:
Capture Samarra for the 12th and then raise the 3rd army. Will be able to make Pentagon now. unquote"

"Well, I don't war early usually, but that seems *really* fast."

I was intending to play the game completely different. I was going to expand faster and stay out of trouble, but the cards I got told to forget it.

"Nice game. But, I think way too many early MGLs makes it something of an "untypical" game, although I could be wrong on that."

No you are correct and I mentioned something along those lines, I think. I went ahead and played out the AA anyway. I figure there may still be some value to someone, if not at least it gives people some thing to read.

You cannot be sure how things will go as far as leaders are concerned. I have made scores in AW games. I know I will make a lot in a game like this, but for them to come so early is not a given.

In fact I played it out to the IA and I think I have only had 5. That is due to using armies for much of the fighting.

I don't see any advantage to using the slider with 1 town and no MP's at the time. Remember the MP is free at this point.

Click to expand...

I think I don't do it and some other people don't do it, because they'd rather have another scout exploring, or if playing as expansionist or agricultural, they might have their granary build going on (or they pre-build with barracks... well not with Rome). This way the settler/possible worker factory gets set-up sooner. I don't mean to say you should do it that way, I just want to explain why I think people do it that way. In my recent games, I've in fact forgotten any warrior/enkidu scout at all and just gone granary-settlers.

Also remember this is just one way to play one game, not meant to be anything more than that. It is intended and hoped that some of the points with be useful to others.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I know. It's just a surprise to see any relatively experienced player building a temple in their capital that early... especialy VMXA who often talks about the (relative) uselesness of temples and cathedrals.

It is a pangaea map, so not a big problem in scouting. They will find me and I do not need contacts as much, because no GLB and limited trade. I start with WC and it is know to two others and Alpha, I do not want to trade right away. Two warriors will find all the near term stuff.

It is only cathedrals that I find to be unnecessary and colosseums worthless. Temples have a use, but it is limited. I usually put one in the capitol to allow it to have maximum pop at work.

This is to facilitate the try for the GLB. A very important wonder for Sid and AW games. In this game I did it much earlier than normal, since I had decided I did not need to expand quickly.

If things got ugly, I could have won with just a few towns and went to war sooner and longer. Rome allows that style as you have a top defender and a top attacker with the military trait. You have a back up in that you start with archers.

Everything else being equal, is there a downside to settling on a hill?

As with many things in civ, it depends Delphi. A hill can provide your city with more shields later on, if you have enough food to not starve out your citizens (or don't care about such and just want shields for a bit). Settling on a hill and you lose shields. But, you do have two food for that square instead of one, so you gain food. Take your pick.

Delphi456 said:

Everything else being equal, is there a downside to settling on a hill?

Click to expand...

Nope. Although I don't know why you ask in this thread

EDIT: Ok so spoonwood is more accurate, but fundamentally you won't lose anything by settling on a hill. Defenders in your city get a 50% advantage, though, so in some cases it can be used perhaps as a strong chokepoint in battle. I don't know if the advantage is cumulative with walls or metros or not... anyone else know?

Terrain bonus is cumulative with wall/city/metro and fortify. Often I will take the hill to leave the grass for use, it depend whats going on as Spoonwood stated. In tough Aw games, the defense is my main consideration. BTW I did play this out to domination.

interesting early game strategy, very different from how i play but i see some good advice i may take up.