Lonely Hearts Club, BtS Edition, Chapter XXXIII : Louis XIV

r_rolo1

King of myself
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Welcome to the 33th edition of the Lonely Hearts Club for BTS. In the Lonely Hearts Club we explore strategies to cope with one of the most dreaded situations in Civ IV ( possibly the main reason for reloads after the military collapse one :p ): starting in isolation....

For the 33th game in BTS the choosed leader was Louis XIV of the French:
Spoiler :



Oh, well, I must reckon that I really, really dislike Louis AI and his pompous, arrogant and sometimes utterly stupid actions in game ( off topic: I do remember one time when I was playing earth 1000 AD vanilla map in normal speed as Japan and Louis decides to dow me because of some denied begging/demand of his side .... the problem is that his up to date medieval stack took so long to get my ex-chinese possessions that it was received with agg rifles..... that tells a lot of the caracther of the beast ( and from vanilla bad algorithim of war decisions that almost didn't took distance in consideration ... ) ). About playing it... well, I find the French leaders a little dificult to fit in a coherent plan embracing traits and UU/UB ( IMHO the chinese suffer the same problem ).Louis is a good example of that: Ind/Cre + a UB that gives a free artist screams for cultural wins , but then the UU becomes somewhat redundant..... Oh well: Louis is definitely one of the leaders that can acheive cultural wins with less effort ( a good deal of my few cultural wins were with him ) and the nature of LHC will probably help with that, while making the UU a little unimpressive.


His UU
Spoiler :

The Musketeer, as I already stated in the other French LHC, is a musket that has 2 movement points instead of 1. Rivers of internet blood had already runned because of the utility of this particular UU ( permeated with some easy jokes about french ppl and running fast (who says that definitely doesn't live in a country that has been invaded by them in the last millenium ) ), so I'll not elongate about that issue. My only point is that will be dificult to leverage this UU when you olny can invade using galleons.....
His UB
Spoiler :

Well, the Salon is the french version of the Observatory, that comes with a free artist. Like I already said elsewhere, this screams for Representation, Sistine and cultural wins. It has certainly it's uses, but I'm really not a fan of this particular UU ( if you're not aiming for a cultural win, it is dificult to find a decent use for that artist.... )

The start (for reasons that I'll explain below, the warrior may not be exactly in that spot in your game ):
Spoiler :

Can you say flood plain? Then say it 5 times :p too bad that it is FP and not much more. This is definite textbook Beaurocracy capital, but it can prove dificult to make a empire out of it idf there is not something in the dark

Regarding the saves: given some complaints about the efects of the AI starting without archery in high levels ( giving a unfair advantage to AI that have early UU and/or have early warmongering tendencies ), I decided to make 3 WB saves ( all in the same zip file ). The WB saves are equal except for the fact that one of them ( labeled Monarch ) has all of the AI with archery as starting tech ( corresponding to a game started in Monarch ), one ( labeled Immortal ) has all of the AI with archery,hunting and agriculture as starting tech ( corresponding to a game started in Immortal ) while the last is the corresponding to a game starting in Noble ( labeled Noble ). All WB saves are playable in all levels, but ( for a example ) if you use the Monarch one the AI will start with archery ( and archers ) in any level. This has only a slight effect in the human directly ( mainly via the garrisons of barb cities ), but has a huge effect on the AI gaming in the outer lands ( avoiding scenarios like Pacal, Shaka or Sitting Bull to take all the barb cities and becoming moguls ). I strongly recommend the usage of the Monarch save if you want to play in Monarch+ and the Immortal at Immortal/Deity.... All the speeds are working well ( no more games ending in 1900 ) The saves are zipped... you only have to unzip this to the worldbuilder saves or for the PublicMaps folder ( either one will do ) and load it from the scenarios.
Any problem PM me...

And about the fact that the starting unit not being always on the same spot: the WB saves that I give only state startings spots for the settlers ( it is the only way of getting the number of AI units to scale correctly with the dificulty level ... otherwise the game will only put the units stated in the WB save , not putting the extra units given by dificulty ). After that the mechanisms are the same than in a normal game: the game will read the XML, decide how many defensive units and extra settlers the player ( Human or AI ) will receive by their handicap and if it is a human the game randomly picks a spot in the starting BFC to place the defensive units ( in case of the human , warrior or scout, depending of having hunting or not ).

This ( as the free techs because of the dificulty level issue ) unfortunately can only be solved with modding and that goes against the philosophy that I've been trying to maintain here, that is "a map for everyone and you choose the dificulty you want"

P.S WB saves are crosscompatible between 3.13 and 3.17 if they don't have No Espionage ticked. No problem with the patches here :p

Again a small request ( not mandatory :p ) :

We ask the participants to do, if possible, a write-up with the victory save and a description of your game ( strategies, techs researched, wars,...). All the info should be in spoiler tags ( to not disturb other people's games ). If you want ( we would like to :p ) post reports at this moments of the game:

Checkpoint 1 - when we have explored the island and are aware of what resources it has. Its not so important when this is, but this is a time to discuss city sites etc. Don't look into a checkpoint 1 spoiler until you have reached this point yourself.

Checkpoint 2 - first contact - when we have met all the other AIs. At this point we can discuss our strategy to get to this point and our plans for dealing with them.

Checkpoint 3 - when we are committed to a victory condition (or at least think we are).

Checkpoint 4 - Victory (or defeat).


The last words are to wish good luck to all :goodjob: . And let the games begin!



P.S We don't have any kind of problem with defeats and reruns. Just play and enjoy ;)
 

Attachments

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Ha, though the French haven't been known for deadly military prowess since the world wars...indeed those jokes are questionable...it was a top military power in Europe more than once.

This is reflected in the french leader AIs...interestingly De Gaulle is the biggest walkover of the 3. Louis has a solid unitprob of 30...very very high among wonderspammers...and nappy is a top warmonger in the game and every bit as threatening as Shaka or Ragnar (unless you're doing a chariot rush, stay the hell away from Shaka then).

As Rolo says, this has bureaucracy written all over it. We probably have 1 food special in place - RNG doesn't hand out a couple flood plains only. Obviously our warrior may spawn in different places and reveal this...but if it spawns there I'd check south to see if we can get away with 1S, and if nothing appealing is down there other than FP just settle in place.
 
I know that the worldbuilder save will randomly put your warrior in different spots...but why does it do that?!? That gives unfair advantages to players who may see some extra resource.

And by the way r_rolo_1, you might want to edit where it says "For reasons I'll explain below..."

But anyway, looks like a great start. :) I wish I could find time to play, maybe during Thanksgiving. :(
 
I'm sorry but this thread is just asking for some quality French jokes ;)


-What do you call 100,000 Frenchmen with their hands up? The Army.

-What is the most useful thing in the French Army? A rearview mirror, so they can see the war.

-Why do the French have glass bottom boats in their Navy? To see all their other ships.

-How many French soldiers does it take to guard Paris? Nobody knows, it’s never been tried before.

-What did the Mayor of Paris say to the German Army as they entered the city during WWII? "Table for One Hundred Thousand?".
 
checkpoint 1

Spoiler :

Well, i do not know there iron or uranium is, but...

My warrior was lucky to start near wheat so i settled in place. Teched pottery first (actually not teched mining first out of habit)and had granary before first (so far only) settler.

Starting warrior killed enough animals and barb wariors to have WII.

Before AH i was worried about ever having to settle junky copper or teching archery, heh, i even went through hunting as it gives discount to AH. Now with settler on the way and half the highway built i will settle on horses. C'mmon it is great farm for great people and tundra horses is not a super tile.

quest i won't do:


south part:


north:


Luckily i can play on job today:goodjob:
 
I think I'll give this a try at Noble.

Just moved to Prince (4 or 5 games so far) and got my first isolated start ever as Montezuma. Not going too much into details, but it wasn't pretty.

So I hope to learn a thing or three with this one.
 
I know that the worldbuilder save will randomly put your warrior in different spots...but why does it do that?!? That gives unfair advantages to players who may see some extra resource.

And by the way r_rolo_1, you might want to edit where it says "For reasons I'll explain below..."
It looks that it was lost somewhere in the Ctrl-C Ctrl-V :mischief: Will edit....

And about the reason: the WB saves that I give only state startings spots for the settlers ( it is the only way of getting the number of AI units to scale correctly with the dificulty level ... otherwise the game will only put the units stated in the WB save , not putting the extra units given by dificulty ). After that the mechanisms are the same than in a normal game: the game will read the XML, decide how many defensive units and extra settlers the player ( Human or AI ) will receive by their handicap and if it is a human the game randomly picks a spot in the starting BFC to place the defensive units ( in case of the human , warrior or scout, depending of having hunting or not ).

This ( as the free techs because of the dificulty level issue ) unfortunately can only be solved with modding and that goes against the philosophy that I've been trying to maintain here, that is "a map for everyone and you choose the dificulty you want" . Maybe someday I'll do a LHC mod to cover this misfeatures of the game ( Firaxis clearly didn't predicted that ppl would want to do a thing like this )...... :mischief:
 
Checkpoint 1 (2110 BC, Noble/Epic)
Spoiler :
Well, since I'm playing Warlords, I had to replace a couple of leaders with other leaders. I'm not gonna say who with what right now, as it's cheackpoint one, and I shouldn't know about that. >_>

Anyway:


Oh, well that's a very... fortunate warrior position. Thanks for your faulty programming, Rolo!

Anyway, I moved the settler 2E to pick up the Wheat and the Pigs, with coastal. :D. Looks like a great GP farm, if nothing else. Horrible production, though.



:D

Anyway, iirc, the tech path was Fishing, Mining, Animal Husbandry, Bronze Working, and I started Pottery

Popped a couple goody huts, and all three gave me maps. Of open water. Fun.

Build path, IIRC, was Warrior>Worker>Warrior>Settler

Where I left off:


Dotmapped fully, including fishing villeges. I think thars some iron in dem hills, though, where I marked iron. The dots nearby are my guesses for Iron cities. If that happens.

So, WheatMarble first, then SugarCopper?
 
@BakingTheArt
Spoiler :
What leaders did you putted instead of the BtS ones? I am curious to see what leader you putted in place of Sury :p

And
Spoiler :
Thanks for your faulty programming, Rolo!

Hey , give Caesar what is from Ceasar! :p In here all the credits for the programming ( faulty or not ) is from Firaxis :D
 
Spoiler :
Oh, crap. I just realized I forgot to change Gilgamesh! >_< Does he get replaced with a random leader, or is there just a empty space where he should've gone?

Anyway, I replaced Sury with FDR (I probably should've replaced him with Isabella, but I'd never played a game with America where I didn't rush him immediately.), and the Pacal with Heouanya Capac.
 
Spoiler :
I don't really know what it will happen to the game as I never tried to use BtS WB saves in warlords ( I always assumed that it would not even load, so i already learned something new :p ). I would give a look at the WB to check that...

OFC that it will spoil you the map :p and most likely you'll need to reboot the game.

HC instead of Pacal is a very fitting choice. FDR instead of sury.... not that much but Sury is quite a class of his own :p

P.S have you changed the starting techs? they are defined in the WB, so you didn't you are getting HC with pacal starting techs and FDR with sury ones ....
 
Spoiler :
Pretty much, but I don't think it matters that much.

About Gilgamesh, I looked in WB (Sorry!) and there's just a bunch of empty space where I bet Gilga was. Hopefully, it'll get divided equally among the 4 AIs on that continent. Probably not, but maybe I'll get a spectacular end-game war out of it.
 
Signing up for another LHC..

I must admit, I really look forward to these. I got started late, didn't play any Vanilla versions, don't have warlords, and got started with BTS.

Any how, after my last effort, which I gave up too early, as I replayed both under prince (I was so frustrated) Conquest, then went into world builder, devassalized all and killed them all AGAIN, and again under Monarch (Damm Ramesses :egypt: runaway AI AGAIN), who I destroyed after he wonderspammed ALL the late game wonders...AGAIN!!!!!!!!, and got voted a diplomatic victory :woohoo: :trophy:

Monarch again, as I've only just won my first Emperor level game, where I've tech traded twice as much as I have previously...must be getting the hang of trading.
 
1st check point, spoilers for animal husbandry and bronze working
Spoiler :


first up warrior started to the north, so I know more floodplains to south, move settler 2 squares to view south, see 4 floodplains, settle 1 south, to make if fair.

In hindsight, would have been better to settle on the grassland hill to the NE as its coastal, river flood plains and gains plains wheat, and hills piggy. BAH..Could have gone GLH route, but will forgo now. DOUBLE BAH.
Spoiler :



Popped 2 techs from hut, I researched Hunting 1st for scout to pop huts, and he's popped Archery (1st pop) gold 2nd, Animal husbandry (3rd) gold with 4th.

My starting 1.8 woodsman 1 warrior LOST TO A PANTHER on a Jungle hill top at...
Spoiler :
97.8% odds :mad:
and my Scout has beaten 3 panthers, 2 lions and is now woodsman 2.

Builds worker, scout, barracks, till bronze working in, 2nd worker;whipped and chopped at size 3 for IMMEDIATE 3rd worker, back to barracks, plan archer till max size, then settler to go to bronze site, build GLH there.

1st worker, built 2 farms, part of 3rd bronze working in, chopped trees on truffle hill, for 2nd and 3rd workers now mining and more farms.

TECHS; Hunting 1st for scout, archery (hut) mining, animal husbandry (hut), bronze working, Currently going Priest hood for Oracle slingshot to Code of Laws.

Wonders planned GLH in bronze city, 3rd city in south for marble/oracle in capital.

Capital has 4 hills to mine with 5 flood plains to feed. Lots of health, pigs, sheep, fish, clam wheat Gems and Sugar for happy
 
Hi Rolo :hatsoff: ,
About playing it... well, I find the French leaders a little dificult to fit in a coherent plan embracing traits and UU/UB
Louis: hardcore SE
Nappy: build troop, crush someone, whip courts, repeat
De Gaulle: I agree with you :lol:

The UU is nice drafted and to follow your cuirrassiers and cannons, but not impressive...
The UB is :smoke:, seriously... even for a cultural run, they are not worth teching Astro...

I haven't time for this one... too many games :rolleyes:
Good luck to all...

Cheers,
Raskolnikov
 
3 attempts, 3 utter failures on Emp/Epic, which I usually don't even have to try that hard to win.
Spoiler :

In my first game, Sury pulled a runaway by badly owning and vassaling pacal and spamming cottages. I'd have won this one except I played an iffy opening. I oracle'd MC and expanded using bureaucracy capitol/gp farm 2x fish city/hammers elsewhere. My tech rate wasn't bad...1000+ BPT when in tech mode pre-1600 AD. Should be ok on emp but nope...too much sury spam.

In game 2, LIBERALISM WENT IN 660 AD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This isn't deity or even immortal I'm playing. 660 AD? It would be a bigtime reach to get that in isolation no matter who you are. Ridiculous. I met everyone backwards even though my tech pace was normal. I got dow'd on and gave up what was probably too early.

Game 3...liberalism goes later...like oh say...780 AD :mad:. I'm not playing immortal or deity! What the HELL. Obviously it's pacal though. The only reason I won lib a little after 1000 AD in game 1 is that pacal got his face kicked in by Sury. Still, in game 3 I was looking good. Strong tech rate, really powerful production cities, and JUST starting to mass rifles/frigates/airships/galleons...when Sury dows me. I take my stack of 20 knights I'd built for defense (along with longbows) and handily splatter his offensive stack. I get lucky with a withdraw on his lone ballista elephant and take no losses.

...Then the AP puts me at war with 4 people at once...people who had a trading partner who hit liberalism pre-800 AD. I actually fought everyone off since it was rifles vs rifles, but the sheer volume of AI ships got all my seafood pillaged. I retaliated on Sury after buying the others out of war with 20+ rifles, and yet after stuffing his attacks he STILL had the troops to crush this upon landing...with cavalry he didn't even have pre-dow. Peter, with his TWO vassals ( voluntary toku...? and gilgamesh) was going culture and going well with it. I wasn't going to be able to get to any of those cities...Peter was 2x everyone's score and #2 behind pacal in tech. Very frustrating games...I don't mind losing the lib race, but losing it in times it's still around on deity sometimes in isolation :(?


I need a break before I try this again. That was just ridiculous. What a screw job. Did I break a mirror or something?
 
I've met the remaining 6, and Hmm not sure how I feel about it all :confused:
Spoiler :
1st one met was our friend and lovable civ Surry. :p



.Same turn I meet his 2 VASSALS Soon to be 3 mind you :eek:.Peter and Pacal (last) 2 Buddhist, Peter in free religion.



Speaking of which I soon met vassal No 3 Tokie....just as he capitulated :crazyeye:.

Next to meet was Gilgamesh, Hindu, who's not happy with me...Meh..what are you going to do Gilly, invade me with Galley's...:lol:

Last but not least was Kublai Khan who's Jewish.

Nice mix and I can see where all the GG's were coming from, Capitulation.:cry:



Anyway, Wonder spamming along, I build; Great Lighthouse (ha I did it anyway), Pyramids (chopped, with a whipped library for 172 overflow), Hanging gardens (7 cities settled gained bonus), Missed Parthenon:cry:, went early, should have targeted, Great Library, Sistine Chapel, Hagia Sofia, Uni of Sankore, Angkor Wat, and bulbed 3K to finish off education.



Peter, popped a great engineer, who IMMEDIATELY built the Taj Mahal for him, launching a golden age, with which, he's finished education and racing me for Liberalism.



Shows my tech position, looking OK, apart from Peter having just got Education.

Finally a word on Barb ships...don't get many do we...NOT!!!!



Yeah right...I had to send up 3 Triremes to hold them out
 
Checkpoint 2 (1520 AD, Noble/Epic)

Spoiler :

I feel like I teched a lot slower then in previous games, even though I'm getting better at city specialization. I guess I just delayed optics too long? Anyway, here's the world in 1520.



Met Kublai (he's isolated, but close to me in tech parity, and higher then the other continent. Plus, HE found ME. >_< ), Peter, Inca (Replacement for the Maya), America (Replacement for Sury), and Japan. Gilgamesh mysteriously disappeared, (Nothing to do with my faulty modding. Ahem) leaving a huge swath of land unsettled. Two turns away by Galleon. :D

Wonders built: Stonehenge, Great Wall, Parthenon, Great Lighthouse, Hanging Gardens (Provided a nice boost, as many of my cities are food starved), Angkor Wat, and maybe some other ones. I forgot. >_>

Great People: If I remember correctly, a priest, a merchant, and two scientists. Priest settled in Paris, Scientists built academies in Paris and Lyons, my best commerce cities. Merchant lightbulbed paper.

Lost the race to Confucianism, but got Taoism. Right now it's in everyone of my cities, and is spreading like wildfire. :D

Kublailand:


How he teched so fast is beyond me. He's my first invasion, after the peaceful Rex into eastern Russia. Sure, he's got tech parity, but he's probably also got 1-2 unit garrisons.

Inca-land:


I think Peter invaded him. No capitulations, and didn't check the diplomacy, but I see no other reason why Inca's so weak, even as they built the Pyramids and the Temple of Artemis, to name a few.

Ameripan&#8482;


Note Washington is in Japanese hands. I've never seen a game where Roosey hasn't been a punching bag for the rest of the world. Never.

I won Circumnavigation, and am about to win Liberalism. :D

Victory conditions to consider:

Cultural: Hell naw. I hate cultural.
Diplomacy: I could do it, but everyone hates me right now. Maybe once I get to Liberalism + Free Religion everything will be better, but I doubt it.
Space Race: I got some great production land, and a tech lead, so very possible.
Conquest/Domination: :evil: I'll probably end up doing this. Setting a couple cities up in eastern russia->Kublailand->War to end all wars in Russia?

 
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