Ideas for New Attack Bonuses for Civ 5

CIV 4 has terrain bonuses for defenders as well as fortification bonuses.
There are other defense bonuses such as faster movement and faster healing in friendly territory.
That makes it a very defensive game.
The only bonus that Attacking has is collateral damage and flanking.

So I was thinking that perhaps CIV 5 should have more attack bonuses that reflect reality.

One of these bonuses can be for a unit that is stationed on a hill or forest/jungle VS enemy unit that is stationed in a none defensive tile right next to it.
For example, a unit on a hill can get 25% attack bonus when it attacks enemy unit (in a tile next to it) that doesn’t have any defensive bonus.
That will certainly reflect realty.
Call it a “Surprise Attack” bonus.
However, this should apply only to one unit (the first one that attacks).
So if we have two stacks standing next to each other, only the first unit that attacks the stack gets that bonus.

This will make positioning units in tiles more strategic because now players have to combine defense and attack considerations.

Another attack bonus that can be added is “Elevation Advantage”.
That will apply to archery and gun powder units that are positioned on a hill with 25% fortification.
When a unit passes in a tile next to them and that tile has no defense bonus then these units can get 10% attack bonus for being on higher elevation and in a fortification position.

I think that these two Attack bonuses can make the positioning and movement of units more strategic.

This makes perfect sense to me. I was almost expecting the whole "turning" action from one of the mods(Planetfall?)

Shackel said:

This makes perfect sense to me. I was almost expecting the whole "turning" action from one of the mods(Planetfall?)

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Wow, Shackel and I finally agree on something.
We must celebrate that.

Actually, I think you shouldn't see units in forests, either.

Shackel said:

Actually, I think you shouldn't see units in forests, either.

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Yes, I see what you mean.
That makes sense as long as it is one or two units only.
Entire stack should be seen.

Of course, scout units and spies should see even single units in a forest.

Yeah, this is a pretty good idea. 'Ambush' could be another one of those attacking promotions, IMO. You would just have to be careful that the game didn't swing too much in favour of the attacker.

Camikaze said:

Yeah, this is a pretty good idea. 'Ambush' could be another one of those attacking promotions, IMO. You would just have to be careful that the game didn't swing too much in favour of the attacker.

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Actually these “Attack abilities” will be used more by defensive players in their own territories.

When an enemy force invades our territory there are two things we can do.
We can reinforce the city that is about to be attacked or we can bring our own stack and try to engage the SoD that is coming our way.

That second option is harder to do because the approaching SoD is usually bigger than the stack we can assemble because we either got caught by surprise or we simply don’t have enough units.

So these suggested new attack abilities are giving the player a third option to fight a guerilla war to slow down the enemy’s movement and to inflict upon him as many casualties as possible.
Guerilla war is not represented too well in CIV 4 so that exactly what CIV 5 needs.

These new attack abilities can also be used by attackers who just want to harass the enemy but that is going to be harder to pull off.

Seige Weapons should be able to be spotted, and as time goes on, Armored Units as well.

Both of your ideas appear to favour defenders.

To attack from a hill, you have to first occupy that hill. Now that you have the defensive bonus, as well as a bonus to attacking from that tile, you'll be even more difficult to dislodge.
This creates an even bigger incentive to occupy defensive tiles and never let go.

In your own post, two posts above mine, you are talking about how defenders could use guerilla tactics to fight an SOD. Once again, that makes the attacker's, not the defender's life even more miserable.

A fresh idea: Perhaps your air units could choose which unit(s) to target, if they are within your own territory. This would certainly help offensive defensive moves. The only problem with it is realism. Can anyone propose a realistic reason for it to be made part of the game?

Seige Weapons should be able to be spotted, and as time goes on, Armored Units as well.

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I agree.

In fact I would say that a “Guerilla” promotion would have to be required for a unit to be hidden in forests/jungles.
In addition to that only infantry units (no armor and no siege) can get these promotions.

A fresh idea: Perhaps your air units could choose which unit(s) to target, if they are within your own territory. This would certainly help offensive defensive moves.

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I think that Bombers with their collateral damage can already cause a lot of damage to these defensive positions.
The issue is really for earlier eras where no air units are available yet.

Both of your ideas appear to favour defenders.

To attack from a hill, you have to first occupy that hill. Now that you have the defensive bonus, as well as a bonus to attacking from that tile, you'll be even more difficult to dislodge.
This creates an even bigger incentive to occupy defensive tiles and never let go.

In your own post, two posts above mine, you are talking about how defenders could use guerilla tactics to fight an SOD. Once again, that makes the attacker's, not the defender's life even more miserable.

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This is all very true.

To balance this we need a feature that gives Attackers some advantage or to remove one of their existing disadvantages.

The best thing I can think of to balance this issue is to give attackers a few early “Commando” promotions.
Currently we have the “Commando” promotion that allows military units to use roads and railroads in enemy territory.
The problem is that Combat 4 is required before you can get this promotion so it is very hard to get a unit this far.

If they move the “Commando” promotion down to be a third promotion then more units will have access to it (but not all units), and striking deep in enemy territory will then be more viable strategy in the Modern age.

Attacking units will then be able to bypass some of the “Ambush/defensive” positions and flank enemy cities.

Another good way for this to work is to introduce 2 new “Commando” promotions (Commando I, and II).
Commando I will grant +1 movement in enemy territory, and it will be available immediately.
Commando II will grant +2 movement in enemy territory, and Commando III (the same as the Commando promotion we have today) will grant the unit free movement in enemy roads (just like it does today).

This way attackers will have their own way to counter those defensive positions.
In fact, this will allow attackers to go deep inside enemy territory, then fortify in a defensive position and later on they will be able to use these two new attack features in enemy territory.

The reason they don't want Commando to be too low is because if the AI gets railroads, a small "Quick Strike" force could line up at your borders, and the second the war horns are called, shoot off towards a city and take it before anyone could retaliate.

It's like putting your units next to the capital of the enemy civ.

Shackel said:

The reason they don't want Commando to be too low is because if the AI gets railroads, a small "Quick Strike" force could line up at your borders, and the second the war horns are called, shoot off towards a city and take it before anyone could retaliate.

It's like putting your units next to the capital of the enemy civ.

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I agree with that.

Maybe we need to separate between the “using roads” ability and the “using railroads” ability.

We can then have “Commando III” for just using roads to the maximum movement allowed.
Then “Commando IV’ will be the next one which will allow the “using railroads” ability.

So we basically leaving the current “Commando” ability where it is and we are just adding lower level Commando promotions that allow increase movement in enemy roads gradually.

If we add more attack abilities that benefit the Defender more than the Attacker then we have to give something back to the attacker.
The gradual increase of movement in enemy territory will then allow players to avoid the defensive ambush positions that the enemy sets in their way (to some extent).
The game will then be more like a Chess game where players try to outmaneuver each other.

IMO, slow movement in enemy territory is one of the annoying aspects in CIV 4.
So incremental improvement in unit’s movement (in enemy territory) with new promotions will be appreciated by many players.