Poland should apologise for starting the Second World War?

Shekwan

Kim Chi Quaffing Celt
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They should if you listen to the Russian defence ministry and Sergei Kovalev, who is a senior researcher there. Here's the story:

Spoiler :
Russia has accused Poland of provoking the outbreak of the Second World War by refusing to accede to the "very modest" demands of Nazi Germany.

The Russian defence ministry posted a potentially inflammatory essay on its website, claiming that Poland resisted Germany's ultimatums in 1939 only because it "wanted to obtain the status of a great power".

The lengthy diatribe also lashed out at Britain and France for giving the Poles "delusions of grandeur" by promising to intercede if the Nazis invaded.

"Anyone who has been minded to study the history of the Second World War knows it started because of Poland's refusal to meet Germany's requests," the statement written by Colonel Sergei Kovalev, a senior researcher at the ministry, read.

"The German demands were very modest."

Appearing to take Germany's demands at face value, the defence ministry insisted that the Nazis were interested only in building transport links across the Polish Corridor to East Prussia and assuming control of Gdansk, which had been designated a free city.

Western historians largely recognise that Poland would have lost its independence had it acceded to the demands, pointing to Hitler's policies of Lebensbraum and the creation of a "Greater Germany" as evidence. Germany invaded Poland on September 1, 1939, prompting Britain and France to declare war.

Poland's foreign ministry said it would summon the Russian ambassador to Warsaw to demand an explanation, as the allegations showed signs of triggering a row between the two countries.


Heres the link

Well, is anyone buying this?
 
How can they possibly make that a valid argument knowing what we know now? :crazyeye:
 
Here's an interesting article about the matter from a Russian source:

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/article/1328/42/378061.htm

The Defense Ministry said today that an article put on its site a few days ago that has sparked outrage with its suggestion that Poland was to blame for the start of World War II “must not be considered the official point of view of the Defense Ministry.”

In a statement to journalists, the ministry’s press service said that the article, “Inventions and Falsifications in the Assessment of the Role of the USSR on the Eve and at the Start of World War II” by Col. Sergei Kovalyov of the ministry’s Institute of Military History, was only for discussion.

Kovalyov's article appears to have been taken down. (It was posted here.) At the very least, it is not currently listed in the section where it was posted, nor could it be retrieved as of Thursday morning.

(An effort to find a cached copy on Yandex Thursday afternoon was also unsuccessful. What appears to be an earlier version of that article — it bears the same title and has the same author but is dated October 25, 2008 — is available, however, on the Russian Orthodox nationalist site, “Yedinovye Otechestvo.”)

The key passage in Kovalev’s article is the following: World War II “was begun as a result of the refusal of Poland to satisfy … extremely moderate demands such as including the free city of Danzig in the Third Reich [and] permission for the construction of extra-territorial highways and railroad, which would connect East Prussia with the rest of Germany.”

Not surprisingly, especially given President Dmitry Medvedev’s call for beginning “a struggle with falsifications of history that harm the interests of Russia,” several Russian commentators jumped on Kovalyov’s article as an indication of just how much of a threat to historical accuracy such a campaign will likely be.


One of the most thoughtful reactions to the article was provided by Ivan Sukhov in Thursday's issue of Russian daily Vremya Novostei in which he points out that Kovalyov not only misuses sources in order to distort the past but seeks to justify what Hitler did in ways that the German Administration for the Defense of the Constitution would see as a violation of the law. “That should not be an occasion for laughter,” Sukhov notes, “especially if one keeps in mind that [Russians] live in a country that has never assessed the crimes committed by bolshevism from a legal point of view.”

"The administration for the defense of the constitution works in Germany," he continues, "[while] in Russia now there is a government commission for preventing the falsification of history,” at least if those "falsifications" harm the Russian state.

While complaining about Western writers who talk about “a new Cold War,” Kovalyov himself writes in a spirit of precisely that kind of conflict without appearing to recognize he is doing so, the Vremya Novostei commentator continues. Although if he doesn’t recognize this, many Russians and those living in neighboring countries certainly do.

Indeed, Sukhov says, Kovalyov’s argument fits into the pattern of “hysteria” in certain Russian quarters about the removal of the Soviet war memorial from the center of Tallinn, even as Russian companies move similar monuments within Russia in order to make profits from the real estate beneath them.

The military writer’s argument also fits with the notion, now enshrined in a Russian history textbook, that “Joseph Stalin was ‘an effective manager.’” According to Sukhov, texts like Kovalev’s suggest that the time may come when some in Russia will decide to describe Adolf Hitler as “’an effective manager’” too.


But even before that happens, Sukhov suggests, the countries of Eastern Europe that experienced both “Soviet and Nazi ‘effective management’” will be declared “guilty” of everything that happened to them, especially if others extend the argument of people like Colonel Kovalyov.

(Unfortunately, there are many Russian historians who are prepared to do just that. For an example, see the comment by St. Petersburg political scientist Sergey Lebedev who came out in support of Kovalyov Thursday and argued that “Poland had conducted itself like a lion among hyenas.”)

Many in Moscow are now talking about how Russia must use “soft power” to influence others, especially among its neighbors, Sukhov notes. But articles like the one authored by Kovalyov are not going to help anyone except in one respect: They show that “the struggle with the falsification of history at the expense of Russia will take place again at the expense of Russia.”

Whew. Looks like the Cold War isn't any more over inside of Russia than it is amongst many in the US...
 
Its still completely ridiculous that they would let it appear on the website. Its clear that people are going to take it as the Defence Ministry's position if they publish it on there.
 
Apparently, the defense ministry has taken down the article:

The Defense Ministry said today that an article put on its site a few days ago that has sparked outrage with its suggestion that Poland was to blame for the start of World War II “must not be considered the official point of view of the Defense Ministry.”

In a statement to journalists, the ministry’s press service said that the article, “Inventions and Falsifications in the Assessment of the Role of the USSR on the Eve and at the Start of World War II” by Col. Sergei Kovalyov of the ministry’s Institute of Military History, was only for discussion.

Kovalyov's article appears to have been taken down. (It was posted here.) At the very least, it is not currently listed in the section where it was posted, nor could it be retrieved as of Thursday morning.

(An effort to find a cached copy on Yandex Thursday afternoon was also unsuccessful. What appears to be an earlier version of that article — it bears the same title and has the same author but is dated October 25, 2008 — is available, however, on the Russian Orthodox nationalist site, “Yedinovye Otechestvo.”)

Why do I find this more amusing than offensive?
 
I would imagine the Poles are the only people who find it more offensive than amusing.
 
And apparently many inside of Russia who are now trying to rewrite their own history by using facts instead of propaganda. I wonder if the same will happen in the US anytime soon...
 
Of course those statements are ludicrous, but it is also silly to even think that a world war can happen because of just one or two countries wanted it.
 
Heh

I'm glad they took the offending article down - as I can see some of my countrymen going apehorsehocky over something like this. I can hardly blame them - we were attacked from all sides at the outbreak of WW2, not only by the Germans but ALSO by the Russians, our country was turned into rubble, and over 10% of our population was murdered.

So when is this guy getting fired?
 
The Defense Ministry said today that an article put on its site a few days ago that has sparked outrage with its suggestion that Poland was to blame for the start of World War II “must not be considered the official point of view of the Defense Ministry.”

Apparently, some good soul had informed them about the fact that Ribbentrop's position on the issue was the same.

I would imagine the Poles are the only people who find it more offensive than amusing.

I find it amusing in a slightly scary way.

“a struggle with falsifications of history that harm the interests of Russia”

Especially that.
 
This is kinda funny.
 
When they will send reparations?
 
If not Poland, it would have been someone else.
 
This sounds like it was copied word for word from that book A.J.P. Taylor put out on the very same subject. I've heard that Taylor mostly wrote it to be provocative and didn't really believe the thesis himself.
 
Well, is anyone buying this?

No.

The Poles had seen what had happened to Czechoslovakia where the
Czecks had made concessions regarding the German speaking parts and
Hitler merely demanded more and more land and then proceeded to
occupy the entirety of the country including the rump where there
were no indigenous German speakers.

And Mein Kamf was very clear on Hitler's objective to take over all Poland.
 
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