Normalized/Balanced Start Locations?

I have been looking at starting positions using the fractal map standard settings and they vary wildly (I checked in world builder to see all the resources and other civ's starts). Resource wise minimum seems to be 1 food/health and 2-4 random resources. Some of the other civs get some real crappy starts (desert tiles in the start location). Some get a few food, a strategic resource, and a few happy resources that show up in groups. I remember the other map scripts being similar in start location quality, so i don't think it is fractal.

I started tinkering with the 'Full of Resources' map script, set to fractal only. The script is not what it sounds like, the maps it makes do not have any different amount of resources. The script itself is what is full of resources as it can do so much.

I set it to wipe the starting cross and randomly add 3 food sources. And one strategic resource. I tried adding a happy resource to that, but the mine based ones seem too powerful to have at the start with 3 health resources compared to the other happy resources.

Start location settings:


What do you guys think would be fair/balanced starting resources? I'm single player, but if I regen some starts it seems unfair since i don't check the AI start locations to regen when they get shafted and it seems at least 1-2 get a poor start and 1-2 get a good/great start. I think there might be better games if the AI had similar starts.

I'd like to keep it close to what the map generates, but make sure everyone is about equal.

In the cross:
Maybe 1 not so great food/health resources (cows?) and add 3 random other food resources? 4 Food might be too much?
Random 1 strategic resource of the 9, different for each player.
I was thinking limited to the early ones might be more interesting? iron, copper, horse, stone, and marble. Or just the early military ones?
Does the capital need another resource? Maybe one random selected from all the happy resources, but set it to give the same one to everyone (so if it comes up gold mine, everyone gets it)? Some of these are super powerful to have early and in the capital and others you have to wait forever to even use.

I also turned on the starting location improvement script. In start locations, It removes mountain peeks, tries to provide a river, removes jungle, and desert/tundra.


Sample balanced starts (set to conservative 3 food, 1 strategic):


Sample Fractal Starts:



The other settings I have been looking at is 'equalizing' resources in the player's zone (land closer to player than nearest enemy, for every player ai/user). It would add the early five strategic resources: iron, copper, horse, stone, marble (can add all of them, but think the early ones are most important). The script will check for each resource and make sure one is available in a location closer to the player than the nearest enemy. If it is missing it will be added somewhere in that player's zone.

Resources can also be added to the tiles within a few tiles of the start location. I tried the strategic resources here, but it didn't look/feel right. The 'player zone' worked better as it adds fewer resources to the map as these resources are normally in that player zone area.

Guess there isn't much interest in this. I've got a configuration I am happy with:
Full of Resources Map script:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=151629
Config file: View attachment 4f_1h_1sr.zip, Extract config file to (My Documents\My Games\CivilizationIV Full of Resources).

4 Food random, different for each player, not likely to repeat a food type within a BFC
1 Random Happy Resource, same for each player (they are too unbalanced to allow different one for each)
1 Strategic BC resource different for each player (Copper, Iron, Horse, Stone, Marble).

1 of each Strategic BC resource in the player zone, not guaranteed to have it close to you, and won't add if its already in the player zone, so shouldn't create duplicates other than the starting resource. They are still up for grabs, but shouldn't be totally locked out from a critical resource if you need it.

The forest dump on the start location no longer occurs, since everyone has a good start. Unusable tiles are removed from the BFC. Seems to play good for every start location. No need to regen any start.

Mountain peaks disabled.

Knowing that you are going to have great food + an early strategic each game seems overpowered imo, but to each his own.

Copper = axerush; horses = chariot rush; marble/stone = wonderspam. All three are very powerful. Throw in great food for whipping or growing a huge bureaucracy capital quickly...

Yeah. I was bouncing between 3 and 4 food resources. I am still play testing it to see how it works, but won't get serious about it till the weekend. I might take out the strategic resources being added to the player zone area of the map and just focus on equalizing the start locations rather than the start and expandable space.

I wish the script could be set to be more random, but keep the starts roughly equal for everyone, but as it is i have to specify a fixed number for each resource category (food, happy, strategic). It might be more interesting to have like 100 points and assign each resource an arbitrary value that it randomly adds till it reaches the point value for each start location to make them equal, but different.

Are the starts too rich? The fractal maps I was generating ranged from 1-8 resources at the start, so at least a few plays got at least 6 resources that i am setting everyone to. From what i read on the 'forest bug' recently mentioned in the chopping thread the game is supposed to add resources to get the starts roughly equal, but is failing to do so. So some civs keep their super starts and some get the deep woods 1 resource starts.

A great start depends on more than just the BFC in my opinion. Having a standardized/balanced BFC and being surrounded by jungle or on a small island is still a horsehockey start.

Junuxx said:

A great start depends on more than just the BFC in my opinion. Having a standardized/balanced BFC and being surrounded by jungle or on a small island is still a horsehockey start.

Click to expand...

With Full of Resources, you can't start on a small island (except if there are only small islands). The starting locations take in count the richness of the area. However you can start surrounded by jungle, but except if you play on a huge map, this is more like a wall.

I think starting resources in one of the major factor that unbalance a map (I usually give an early unit bonus like copper to all AI). After, you can adapt your strategy to what you find.