When do you build your Granary in your Capitol?

StrategeryBush · Aug 30, 2009

In my new cities I usually start a granary right after I get a border pop building, barring needing to build a work boat in order to have any food to store.

When do most people build their granary in the Capitol? Do some people find that it is worth while to build a relatively early Granary in the Capitol in order to help pump out settlers?

I find that a full price granary slows down your REX too much to build it before your settlers/workers, and I typically find that my capitol is the only place that is producing enough of the "need-it-now" things to side track into building a more "long-term-investment" thing like a Granary. The problem is, that frequently wind up putting off the granary, despite having done some whipping for other things, until I start running into health issues.

oyzar · Aug 30, 2009

This is actually an interesting issue. Most of the time a few settlers and workers (2-5 settlers with workers as needed) go out before getting up the granary. Getting the granary up as the first thing whipped is usually nice however.

Polobo · Aug 30, 2009

If I have super-excess food I may delay the granary a little while (and sometimes pottery as well); but if/when I start getting into heavy slavery use in my Capital I will make sure to pre-build or make it my first whip.

If you are only growing to size 5 or so with 2-3 food resources then it won't make a huge different and with that much food you are likely lacking in hammers and making it the first whip is quite reasonable.

Abegweit · Aug 30, 2009

This varies depending on the civ and the map. If the capital will reach the happy cap quickly and will be used as a settler/worker pump, then a granary is useless. This is probably the single most common case. Sometimes I slip a library though.

As soon as this role is ended, whether the purpose is to whip or to grow larger, the granary should be your first priority.

Meatbuster · Aug 30, 2009

I would only build a Granary at Rome once there's health problems. (I would rarely whip at Rome. And if I do, then a Granary may be built.)

cabert · Aug 30, 2009

I pretty often leave the granary in the capital until health problems start to show up.

Abegweit · Aug 30, 2009

What's all this obsession with health? :crazyeye:

How often do you have a capital that has health problems at size 5, especially as they usually are placed on fresh water? The capital should get a granary when it needs one to grow. That might be because it is about to be whipped or because it is ready to grow larger or because, as occasionally happens, it started on a food-poor site.

The main purpose of a granary is growth. The health benefit is a distant second, especially in small cities which is what we are talking about.

dirtyparrot · Aug 30, 2009

Unless you tech or pop Pottery early, there's usually little use in building a granary in the capital early in the game. I'll in most cases build a library before a granary to avoid unhappy/unhealthy citizens (or use as a settler or worker pump). On lower difficulties (or with someone like Washington), a granary might be of use early. If I do build it, it's usually whipped.

JBossch · Aug 30, 2009

Abegweit said:
The capital should get a granary when it needs one to grow.

Agreed. Typically I will grow to happy cap (5), then build workers/settlers as needed. The granary can wait until after the initial rex and when the happy cap improves.

smackthewise · Aug 30, 2009

Getting the granary up as the first thing whipped is usually nice however

As I recall, when i've whipped it and grown the next turn, the food bar has started from the beginning not from halfway. This is something to keep in mind.

Abegweit · Aug 30, 2009

dirtyparrot said:
Unless you tech or pop Pottery early, there's usually little use in building a granary in the capital early in the game.

Right. I don't recall ever having built a granary before Alphabet unless I have teched or popped Pottery first!

ppciv4 · Aug 30, 2009

quite late, after trading pottery with others.
it's useful for the HR pop growth.

Bostock · Aug 31, 2009

Wow, I must be weird. I go granary ASAP most of the time, then whip out settlers at size six (spending one turn over the cap) as often as possible, with worker production used inbetween to slam on the brakes, and warriors to fill in the growth periods.

C'mon, the whip is the most powerful force in the game, why would I not want to use it? And if using it, why would I not want to double its power?

But I agree that the food-crazy capitols are better off just growing to cap w/o a granary and staying there, unless there's extra happiness... in that case I'll mercilessly whip that kind of capital too...

TheMeInTeam · Aug 31, 2009

C'mon, the whip is the most powerful force in the game, why would I not want to use it? And if using it, why would I not want to double its power?

Depending on tiles whipped away, even granary whipping can come out behind.

Workers/settlers are good whipping candidates though.

Bostock · Aug 31, 2009

TheMeInTeam said:
Depending on tiles whipped away, even granary whipping can come out behind.

True, true... well to say that would be to praise myself too much, as I'm no mathematician -- I just get by with intuition and rules of thumb -- almost all of them from other people. But one of those rules of thumb is "don't whip away resources," and so if 6-pop whipping would have me whipping away resources, I would suspect I'm coming out behind.

'Course another rule of thumb is "don't whip away cottages," and that one I often merrily ignore. Impulsive... short-term-focused... :lol:

Dirk1302 · Aug 31, 2009

There can be exceptions but usually rather late.Basically there are 2 situations,

1. I have abundance of food, i can whip the capital anyway and grow back faster than 10 turns.
no need for a granary.

2. I don't have too much food. I usually self build settlers workers in that case growing to cap in
between.

Generally i don't like whipping the capital, if it works a plain mine as it's fifth or sixth tile you gain only 20 H from a whip as you won't work that tile for at least 10 turns,you always lose some extra hammers and commerce from growing back 1 level. It's here that the granary helps of course but since the gains from whipping are rather small in this case i think 60 early hammers is way to expensive.

I tend to whip a bit less in my other cities than i used to as well now, if it has reasonable production of it's own whipping isn't that profitable. Of course cities that grow unhappy,work sea tiles or other unimproved stuff should still be whipped.

JTMacc99 · Aug 31, 2009

I hadn't thought about this before. Since my normal capital has plenty of food, I can normally grow it to the happy cap and then set it on the task of building workers/settlers without the aid of a granary. I probably won't slap up the granary until I'm ready to start whipping in the capital (which I guess would be after I've expanded to three or four cities.)

I suppose I would be more likely to slip the granary up in the queue if the city was food poor, or if I popped pottery early AND had a reason to go to the whip early and often.

Beamup · Aug 31, 2009

I build it once I both have Pottery and the capital is going to be growing significantly. Typically that means when the REX is over - I probably ought to whip settlers/workers more than I do, but most of the time once I get Pottery I'm building settlers/workers without whip at or near the happy cap.

When do you build your Granary in your Capitol?

StrategeryBush

Warlord

oyzar

Have quit civ/forums

Polobo

Emperor

Abegweit

Anarchist trader

Meatbuster

formerly Robo Kai

cabert

Big mouth

Abegweit

Anarchist trader

dirtyparrot

Upholding Brannigan's Law

JBossch

King

smackthewise

Prince

Abegweit

Anarchist trader

ppciv4

Warlord

Bostock

King

TheMeInTeam

If A implies B...

Bostock

King

Dirk1302

Deity

JTMacc99

That's a paddlin'

Beamup

Higgs boson

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