Monarch Student^ IV - Tokugawa

Meatbuster

formerly Robo Kai
Joined
Dec 6, 2005
Messages
2,302
Location
Philippines
I never intentionally picked Tokugawa in single player ever since Warlords came out. How I missed his glory days of AGG/ORG.

In Warlords and BtS, Toku is AGG/PRO. Meaning Muskets and Rifles rock like no one's business. Before that, melee units get Combat I, and archery units get City Garrison I and Drill I. Can Japan survive until guns are invented, without any economic trait or advantage?

Starting traits are Fishing (not again!) and The Wheel. And don't worry about not starting with Agriculture or quickly heading to Animal Husbandry, the starting screenshot starts with no grains or herds. But at least we can research Pottery first. :lol:

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One of the best unique units EVER, the Samurai are a forced to be reckoned with. A Maceman that starts with 2-3 first strikes... awesome!

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The Shale Plant gets a lot of criticism for being a later unique building, and replacing the already heavily-maligned Coal Plant. Still, even with +2 unhealthiness rating, you can't sneeze at 10% extra hammers and power without needing coal.

Wait... power without coal? If you're not playing Japan, I hope your National Park city site is on a riverside. Do you really want to blow all those hammers on Three Gorges Dam? Or risk a nuclear meltdown? I feel sorry for the forest preserves. :lol:

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Map Settings...
Map: Standard Lakes
Oppnents: 6 leaders/civs that are in Vanilla and have been changed in Warlords
Sealevel: Low
Climate: Temperate

Spoiler map hints, spoiler and comments :
Research Calendar. ASAP. This is a powerful starting move in FfH if you have those resources. But in BtS? Hmm... let's think this over.

Also, I want to see Samurai in action. The only reason you won't have iron is if you don't expand to your second city. So there's no excuse not to field Samurai.

I didn't get to take much of a look at this map, so I'm in the dark enough to play my own shadow game.
 
This is the start:
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The Worldbuilder save is below. It is good for Monarch or Emperor starts. Nobles and Princes may need to remove archery from the computer players. Immortals and Deities may need to give the computer some more free techs.

To play, unzip one of the worldbuilder files and place it in your Documents/My Games/Civilization 4/Saves/WorldBuilder or Documents/My Games/BTS/Saves/WorldBuilder folder. Start the game by choosing Single Player -> Play a Scenario, where you may adjust the speed and difficulty to your liking. Or Custom Scenario, if you also wish to turn off huts, barbs or events and adjust other settings.

Let us compare strategies and progress with other players as well as learn to play. Win or lose, for better or worse, feel free to report on your glorious exploits. Perhaps other players can give you advice on your game.

Please keep your reports in spoiler tags to ensure and safeguard the richness of others' playing experience.

Recommended Checkpoints:
*1000BC or 1AD or 100AD
*500AD, 1000AD or Liberalism
*1200AD or 1400AD
*Victory!

Save is below.
I think Vanilla players can play this one too.
 

Attachments

This week, thanks to the magic of Unrestricted Leaders, BtS players can experience the same map but with retro Vanilla traits for all leaders in this game. It's like playing Vanilla all over again... except with Trebuchets, Espionage, Unique Buildings...

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Please be sure to note which version of the game you're playing. :D
 

Attachments

MB, there are two saves. What's the difference between them?
In the second save you are playing Hammurabi of Japan, which simulates the AGG/ORG Toku from Vanilla. The opposing leaders are "Vanilla-ized" versions as well. Such as
Spoiler :
Gandhi of Arabia
 
Low sea level??? Ackkkkk. Any imperial Ai will expand like crazy!
 
Hopefully I can finish this one. I tend to lose interest quickly if I'm not in any great position by 1000's AD.

Emperor/Epic 155BC (Part 1 of 2)
Unrestricted game.
Spoiler :
So far from the attachment downloads, I presume no one wants to play the unrestricted game, so I bite. I will be using Hammurabi cosplaying as Tokugawa of Japan.

Settle in place.

Bad luck strikes at the start of the game.
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Since the poor warrior met his early demise, I had to just go stay at home watching the eons pass by, while other civs contacted Japan.
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Come to think of it, Pacal and Victoria look very much alike.
Note: There is a bug with Mehmed in my computer. Tried upping the Mehmed fix, same problem.

By 2025 BC I had research Agri, Pottery, Mining, BW and Masonry. I still have only one city, because it just built the Great Wall--I expect barbarians to be a total downer on this map.

Against TMIT's wishes, I decided to beeline Calendar, starting with Writing, here, and going to Mathematics.
civ4screenshot0008y.jpg


Soon after, Osaka was founded to claim the Bronze...
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Along the way, the Americans and Russians were expanding AWAY from me, giving me time to claim my land. But it wasn't long before the Americans were encroaching on what was rightfully mine:
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When Math came in, Washington had Alpha, so this trade was done to speed up Calendar:
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Soon after, the third city was founded to block off the advancing Russian settlers:
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(to be continued next post)
 
Emperor/Epic 155BC (Part 2 of 2)
Unrestricted game.
Spoiler :

Soon Washington was making an arrogant demand, to which I accede as Huayna and the Incans are halfway around the world.
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Gandhi had spread his religion to my capital. And by the favor of the gods, it spread further throughout Japan.
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Thanks to the power of the Great Wall, worker and barbarian can live in harmony.
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As more civs gain the knowledge of Alphabet, more trades were made:
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The technology situation seems bleak after Mathematics was passed around like bottles of beer.
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However, a great spy has joined the Japanese as a super "research" specialist:
civ4screenshot0025.jpg


...and after he revealed everyone's demographics, he started to focus his efforts on the Russians.
civ4screenshot0034.jpg


Meanwhile Japan's fourth city was founded:
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...it wasn't long before the world is torn apart by war, which currently doesn't concern the Japanese people:
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(Note: Did you see that... that's Gandhi declaring war!)

Ok, now it does concern us:
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The Japanese finally learn the secrets of Calendar at 165BC:
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...and they shared its secrets with the world, just like some other leaders would've traded Aesthetics.
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Julius Caesar was convinced to aid us in the fight against the Incas as a result:
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The history of the Japanese people ends prematurely at this point, but there are some appendix pages in this book:
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Final notes:
Neighbors are peaceful and friendly. I expect GNP to improve after the calendar resources are... well, improved. The plan so far is to tech peacefully to Civil Service through Currency. After that, we may attack a neighbor (probably Russia or Arabia) with Samurai and Trebs. Someday they will be joined by Cuirassers or Cavalry or Riflemen.
 
People mock poor Toku, but goddamn that is an awesome UU. And his gunpowder units are like UUs in themselves! The one time I used him I was successful, but that was on an archipelago map. This low sea-level business has me worried. Lots of room for the AI to build numerous cities and tech crazily. Samurai are great and all, but not much use against infantry and machineguns.

Before I start I really have to post my Sitting Bull game...
 
Toku might have poor traits and possiably the worst AI, unless if he for some oddball reason winning an early religion due to lack of traditional zealots, where he suddenly can become a major beast due to him being fairly nasty to play against when he's economic is carried by a big shrine. But he got without question the best UU and some of the best lategame nonUU units (only challenger there is proberly Churchill, which allready have all the lategame help he needs in Redcoats)

If the player know how to keep the Economy floating without crutching on traits Japan is certainly one of the stronger players from Civil Service onwards, and is certainly able to do some nice Samu/pult wars

in the game in hand (which i just might take a stab at) i'd proberly settle somewhere east ... theres a river and theres nothing critical lost by going over there
 
People mock poor Toku, but goddamn that is an awesome UU. And his gunpowder units are like UUs in themselves! The one time I used him I was successful, but that was on an archipelago map. This low sea-level business has me worried. Lots of room for the AI to build numerous cities and tech crazily. Samurai are great and all, but not much use against infantry and machineguns.

Before I start I really have to post my Sitting Bull game...

The UU and UB are middle-of-the pack. The UB is very good but late. I'm happy to have it when I do though. The UU gets a lot of attention, but why? It comes in the hardest era to war, doesn't upgrade any better than basic toku gunpowder, still needs siege support, and still needs help against knights (against which it is just a mace). It is a very powerful city attack unit but it just doesn't have the edge that merits being called "awesome". While certainly a useful UU (unlike, say, portugal's on pangaea in single player), it just doesn't stack up to the likes of prats, immortals, keshiks, war chariots, the musket UUs (OK, it's about even with the musketeed), the cataphract, conquistador, redcoat, etc etc etc.

Certainly a worthwhile UU, but not "awesome" unless half of the UUs in the game are awesome. Definitely better than that HRE crap though.
 
Certainly a worthwhile UU, but not "awesome" unless half of the UUs in the game are awesome. Definitely better than that HRE crap though.
I agree. It's not a great stand-alone unit, so all it does for me is maybe save some siege units when city busting.

On the other hand, his traits make all gunpowder units semi-UUs, which is kind of cool.
 
Gave this a go at deity and lost miserably however I just wanted to add that

Spoiler :

Definitely did not have any metals until I lucked into copper from a random mine around 200AD! Where the heck did you put your second city :p
 
They're overrated because they're cool, but that doesn't mean they aren't a very good UU. Especially on slower speeds Medieval war isn't that bad (you can have a big army that you don't need to upgrade in a long time) and the most important part of Medieval conquest is the nutcracker unit, and Samurais come second only to Cataphracts at this job. Both his traits also help Medieval war immensely. As a bonus they're very good stack (or city) defenders against siege.

Not in the top-top-tier, but definitely on par with the likes of Musketeers, Oromos and Conquistadors IMO. I'd include Keshiks in that but I don't dare to do that when replying to the HA master himself ;)
 
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