RoM in Space!

Hydromancerx

Hydromancerx

C2C Modder
Joined
Feb 27, 2008
Messages
16,281
Location
California, USA


So I have been trying to think on how we could go "beyond our planet". Since it seems that multiple maps are not feasible at the moment I was thinking what if we had a new "Spaceship Menu" like the one that's is in the game. Except rather than a spaceship that you add parts to, its a solar system map you add colonies to.

There is a concept image of what it could look like. The details are not set in stone but it would give a little more death to the future era game.



Alternatively you could have more than one window such as one for the moon, one for like Mars, one for the solar system one for Alpha Centauri and so on. In theory you could have many missions for each type of spaceship-like menu.

And rather than parts added to a spaceship you could have building added to say the planets surface. Heck if you got advanced enough you could bring in really high tech stuff like a Dyson Sphere to a solar system menu or wormhole gates in a galaxy map.

What do you moders think? Is such a task doable?
 
Yeah, the building-the-spaceship-parts of the game should be re-modded completely, I think.
New "parts" should actually be the colonizing the "whatever" like seen in your screenie #2. If a "part" would be completed this could be matched by a little map overview of a starsystem like in the BtS mod final frontier that would be fantastic. I even would like to have more strategic maps to play on the same time. Switching between the maps would be really nice, although for the sake of RAM the other maps might be small maps with final frontier design for the whole galaxy maybe.
I would want to build buildings in the newly settled colonies and would want to meet my rivals of earth on these maps in space too.
And there's even more what would challenge the rise of mankind: alien civs, robot-empires, space pirates.
I want full interactivity - do you hear me, god of civ? Get it done, give us Civ 6, now!!!

Hydromancerx said:
There is a concept image of what it could look like. The details are not set in stone but it would give a little more death to the future era game.
Click to expand...

Yay, future to the depth of death - ^^
Take that, black hole of Sense!

(caution: inversive joke. don't mistake the english meaning of sense here, Sense is the german word for scythe)
 
Okay, here goes, Making new windows and screens are all done in python. There are plenty of talented python modders here at CFC, but I am not one of them.

Making a new screen showing parts of the galaxy would be do-able, but it wouldn't look like the regular map. You'd need to do a ton of SDK work (and have lots of C++ know-how) to get it done. Anything's possible, but I think you'd need to get someone with Jdog5000, EmperorFool, Dom Pedro II, Kael, Xienwolf, or the HotK team's talent to help. Those are the best C++ coders here at CFC. (I hope I didn't forget anyone...)
 
love the idea, much more feasible in the way of coding and user friendliness. So instead of waiting 50 minutes each turn to calculate the entire galaxy, it's just a window. Being a real space freak (like afforess is a LotR freak:lol:) this really gets me motivated to learn more C++ (learn to add MAD to ANM for starters) in hopes of actually making something like this. It also gives me a reason to add wormholes to the game. :lol:
 
Besides the "cool factor" what are the planned benefits of space colonies (i.e. Resources, Commerce bonuses and yields), as well as costs (Revolutions in Space, Maintenance costs, Diplomatic Pressures)? Are there going to be different types of "colonies" (Military Base, Mining Facility, Settler Colony), and are the effects going to be different based on location (Moon Military Base allows you to bombard enemy cities, Venus Military Base allows access to a Chemical 4 promotion, Asteroid Mining Facility provides Iron, Titan Mining Facility provides Methane, Ganymede Settler Colony provides 20 Beakers and Reduces cost of all other colonies built on Ganymede by 25%, Moon Settler Colony adds +1 Trade Routes in all cities)?

This sounds like cool concept, which will make the Future Age more dangerous, like it should be. Such a project is going to be a Herculean effort though.
 
Afforess said:
What tipped you off? :p
Click to expand...

Your avatar and title for starters.:crazyeye:

Anyway, I was thinking random events could allow a civ with a telescope or Hubble to discover new moons/planets/stars and the Alpha Centauri mission can't start until a civ discovers it. Ultimately making the 'space race victory' into a 'galactic conquest' and/or 'galactic domination'.

EDIT: and I just thought: there goes Hydromancerx and his mother spheres :lol:
 
I'd love to see this done i've always wanted to combine final frontier and ROM
 
Afforess said:
Okay, here goes, Making new windows and screens are all done in python. There are plenty of talented python modders here at CFC, but I am not one of them.

Making a new screen showing parts of the galaxy would be do-able, but it wouldn't look like the regular map. You'd need to do a ton of SDK work (and have lots of C++ know-how) to get it done. Anything's possible, but I think you'd need to get someone with Jdog5000, EmperorFool, Dom Pedro II, Kael, Xienwolf, or the HotK team's talent to help. Those are the best C++ coders here at CFC. (I hope I didn't forget anyone...)
Click to expand...

Well I see it being done 2 ways.

1. Replaced each spaceship 3D object with a new 3D mesh. Such as the main base model could be replaced by a planet. And each "part" could be replaced by say a landing site, colony, spaceport, terrafomng facility, etc. Basiclly little meshes to added on to the top of the main mesh just like you have little part meshes added to the top of the rocket mesh.

2. Skip the whole visual stuff and just have a new menu with statistics and possibly 2D picture icons to make it pretty. Basiclly just one big menu showing information about the galaxy. And each time you launch stuff up (produce it from your city) another stat gets updated on the "Space Menu".

generalstaff said:
Besides the "cool factor" what are the planned benefits of space colonies (i.e. Resources, Commerce bonuses and yields), as well as costs (Revolutions in Space, Maintenance costs, Diplomatic Pressures)? Are there going to be different types of "colonies" (Military Base, Mining Facility, Settler Colony), and are the effects going to be different based on location (Moon Military Base allows you to bombard enemy cities, Venus Military Base allows access to a Chemical 4 promotion, Asteroid Mining Facility provides Iron, Titan Mining Facility provides Methane, Ganymede Settler Colony provides 20 Beakers and Reduces cost of all other colonies built on Ganymede by 25%, Moon Settler Colony adds +1 Trade Routes in all cities)?

This sounds like cool concept, which will make the Future Age more dangerous, like it should be. Such a project is going to be a Herculean effort though.
Click to expand...

I love these ideas!
 
Hydromancerx said:
Well I see it being done 2 ways.

1. Replaced each spaceship 3D object with a new 3D mesh. Such as the main base model could be replaced by a planet. And each "part" could be replaced by say a landing site, colony, spaceport, terrafomng facility, etc. Basiclly little meshes to added on to the top of the main mesh just like you have little part meshes added to the top of the rocket mesh.

2. Skip the whole visual stuff and just have a new menu with statistics and possibly 2D picture icons to make it pretty. Basiclly just one big menu showing information about the galaxy. And each time you launch stuff up (produce it from your city) another stat gets updated on the "Space Menu".



I love these ideas!
Click to expand...

I was thinking of an entirely new screen, the scrollable thumbnail entries on the right, the info on the left, new planets are only discoverable by telescopes, hubble, or space-bound satellites.
 
i know this is probably a really stupid idea but is it possible that you could have say final frontiers galaxy map and code it so that all the planets are coded as cities except that when you click on them instead of getting the city window you get say a new land map (the planet)
i hope that made some kind of sense
 
Darken24 said:
i know this is probably a really stupid idea but is it possible that you could have say final frontiers galaxy map and code it so that all the planets are coded as cities except that when you click on them instead of getting the city window you get say a new land map (the planet)
i hope that made some kind of sense
Click to expand...

I understand what you are saying. A map inside a map. I have no idea how workable that is though....
 
Darken24 said:
exactly btw how hard is it to learn to mod civ 4
Click to expand...

It depends on what you want to do. Civ4 is one of the most moddable games ever. If you just need new units and buildings, it all XML, which is a text-language, very simple for non-programmers to learn. Adding screens, like the advisor screens takes an understanding of Python, a programming laungauge. The most advanced mods, like Revolutions, FFH2, etc... require C++ changes.

The map changes you propose would take a very experienced C++ coder.
 
Afforess said:
It depends on what you want to do. Civ4 is one of the most moddable games ever. If you just need new units and buildings, it all XML, which is a text-language, very simple for non-programmers to learn. Adding screens, like the advisor screens takes an understanding of Python, a programming laungauge. The most advanced mods, like Revolutions, FFH2, etc... require C++ changes.

The map changes you propose would take a very experienced C++ coder.
Click to expand...

Only if TheLopez never left CFC, it would be extremely difficult to imagine what he could've made by now and what a different place this site would be.
 
So if this is done we could do it in one of 2 ways.

1. Based on Earth (Moon, Mars, Jupiter, Asteroid Belt, Venus, etc).

OR

2. Randomly Generated (No specific names of planets and other cosmic objects)

Lets say we use #2 so every game is unique there would have to be some constants. For instance we should have a moon only because the planet would be much diffrent without the moon or more than one moon. We could have the moon be the training ground for spreading to other planets or moons in the solar system. The other constant would be the sun and at least one large Gas giant like Jupiter.

The other issue is distance. While its not too much trouble traveling within your solar system traveling to other star system could take much much longer. Even generations. So like having eras we might need to have more than one "Space Eras". Think of it like Columbus and how long it took to go from Caravels to say Commercial Airliners.

The first "era" would be within the "Modern Era" basically once Satellites are discovered and the Apollo Program is done. You start with missions to the moon, walking on the moon and then getting samples. But since there are no real resources colonization would not happen until later.

Next you send probes out to other planets in the solar system and possibly a rover to the closest habitable planet aka Mars. This would be like stuff you do when you discover space flight tech and make the Hubble and stuff. So basically the available missions would be the whole probe thing. Sort of like how you send out a scout to see whats out there.

Next is the space station not much to do in missions other than building the space station. And then space tourism. This for now would be stuff in orbit and possibly the ability to put say a tourist building on the moon.

The next big step is in the Trans-Human Era with Space colonies. This is where colonies on the Moon and Mars would take place. Put a tourist building on Mars too.

These next ideas would split from the established tech tree. Things like Asteroid Mining, Spaceports (Mass Drivers), Colony Arcologies, Solar Sails, Mass Driver Propulsion, etc. Basiclly all the techs to help colonize the solar system.

Once all space is filled on habitable planets and moons then terraforming would come in. Turning uninhabited world into inhabitable ones. This means cold ones like Mars to be more wet and hotter while at the extreme ones like Venus cooled down. That would be like advanced terraforming.

Meanwhile we could be using Hubble Telescope or other long range probes to see what else is beyond the solar system. So the interstellar travel would be something that should be pushed back a ways so you cannot get it until you have researched other space propulsion. But once you got a method then it could be done and sending actually people to other solar systems would be just like we had before for the innter solar system.

The new solar systems would take a very long time to get to which would mean time between your home planet and them would be a long time. Such isolation could lead to possibly the beginning of new species. Ones adapted to space, ones adapted to each of the planet colonies, etc.

I mean this really becomes the limit on how complex you want to get and how far can we imagine into the future. I mean I am sure we can fully fill out all the home solar system exploration and colonization but beyond that I am not sure. Because it eventually just becomes un-realsitic fantasy.

I mean we most likely will not find aliens in our general area of the universe. Sure there might be some bacteria or even some fauna or flora but intelligent aliens? They are probably really far out there. Even to get there we would need to invoke sci-fi modes of transportation such as folding spaces or wormholes since warp drive or light speed is impossible.

So yeah. I say we first flesh out the moon missions. We have been there done that. Then move on to working out Mars mission and eventually other solar system missions like the Asteroid belt or Moons like Titan. I think at least for planning that's an achievable goal. Whether or not we can actually create it and cod it is still another matter. But at least we would have the details of specifically what we would want to do.

Let me know what you guys think and what ideas you have.

Goals
- Moon
- Mars
- Asteroid Belt
- Gas Giant Moons
- Venus & Mercury
- Kuiper Belt
- Mastery of the Solar System
- Expansion to Alpha Centauri
 
Hydromancerx said:
So if this is done we could do it in one of 2 ways.

1. Based on Earth (Moon, Mars, Jupiter, Asteroid Belt, Venus, etc).

OR

2. Randomly Generated (No specific names of planets and other cosmic objects)

Lets say we use #2 so every game is unique there would have to be some constants. For instance we should have a moon only because the planet would be much diffrent without the moon or more than one moon. We could have the moon be the training ground for spreading to other planets or moons in the solar system. The other constant would be the sun and at least one large Gas giant like Jupiter.

The other issue is distance. While its not too much trouble traveling within your solar system traveling to other star system could take much much longer. Even generations. So like having eras we might need to have more than one "Space Eras". Think of it like Columbus and how long it took to go from Caravels to say Commercial Airliners.

The first "era" would be within the "Modern Era" basically once Satellites are discovered and the Apollo Program is done. You start with missions to the moon, walking on the moon and then getting samples. But since there are no real resources colonization would not happen until later.

Next you send probes out to other planets in the solar system and possibly a rover to the closest habitable planet aka Mars. This would be like stuff you do when you discover space flight tech and make the Hubble and stuff. So basically the available missions would be the whole probe thing. Sort of like how you send out a scout to see whats out there.

Next is the space station not much to do in missions other than building the space station. And then space tourism. This for now would be stuff in orbit and possibly the ability to put say a tourist building on the moon.

The next big step is in the Trans-Human Era with Space colonies. This is where colonies on the Moon and Mars would take place. Put a tourist building on Mars too.

These next ideas would split from the established tech tree. Things like Asteroid Mining, Spaceports (Mass Drivers), Colony Arcologies, Solar Sails, Mass Driver Propulsion, etc. Basiclly all the techs to help colonize the solar system.

Once all space is filled on habitable planets and moons then terraforming would come in. Turning uninhabited world into inhabitable ones. This means cold ones like Mars to be more wet and hotter while at the extreme ones like Venus cooled down. That would be like advanced terraforming.

Meanwhile we could be using Hubble Telescope or other long range probes to see what else is beyond the solar system. So the interstellar travel would be something that should be pushed back a ways so you cannot get it until you have researched other space propulsion. But once you got a method then it could be done and sending actually people to other solar systems would be just like we had before for the innter solar system.

The new solar systems would take a very long time to get to which would mean time between your home planet and them would be a long time. Such isolation could lead to possibly the beginning of new species. Ones adapted to space, ones adapted to each of the planet colonies, etc.

I mean this really becomes the limit on how complex you want to get and how far can we imagine into the future. I mean I am sure we can fully fill out all the home solar system exploration and colonization but beyond that I am not sure. Because it eventually just becomes un-realsitic fantasy.

I mean we most likely will not find aliens in our general area of the universe. Sure there might be some bacteria or even some fauna or flora but intelligent aliens? They are probably really far out there. Even to get there we would need to invoke sci-fi modes of transportation such as folding spaces or wormholes since warp drive or light speed is impossible.

So yeah. I say we first flesh out the moon missions. We have been there done that. Then move on to working out Mars mission and eventually other solar system missions like the Asteroid belt or Moons like Titan. I think at least for planning that's an achievable goal. Whether or not we can actually create it and cod it is still another matter. But at least we would have the details of specifically what we would want to do.

Let me know what you guys think and what ideas you have.

Goals
- Moon
- Mars
- Asteroid Belt
- Gas Giant Moons
- Venus & Mercury
- Kuiper Belt
- Mastery of the Solar System
- Expansion to Alpha Centauri
Click to expand...

What about faster than light travel? Far into future (like last 25 or so years before the game finishes if you are playing with Time victory?
 
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