Disease System

So I was working on my Health Mod and wanted to have something to counter all the health they bring. So I was thinking about how to apply diseases to the game beyond just random events. And I came up with this idea ...

Like Religions or Corporations
Use the Religions or Corporations as a base where each disease is like a diffrent religion or corporation. They would spread a lot quicker than regions or corporations too.

New Category
Is it possible to make a separate category for diseases? Just like religions are in a separate category than corporations. If not we would have to piggy back on one of them.

Tech Discovered
Like religions, the first to discover a tech would be the first to discover a disease. Such a first to discover Naturpathy, Medicine or Modern Medicine could be first to discover a disease.

Event Discovered
Not as important but i suppose it could be possible to have some discovered through events if you wanted to.

Disease Stats
Just like corporations giving a bonus to a city with it in the city the diseases would give a negative effect to whatever city it was present in. The nastier the disease the worse the effects.

Resource Effects
Different resources could have effects upon the diseases such as having Pig resources gives +1 unhealthy with Swine Flu in your city. On the other hand some might counter the effects such as Lemons give +1 health to Scurvy.

Spreading Diseases
Like having Missionaries or Executives you could have "Infected" units to spread diseases to rival nations.

Curing Unit
Like having an Inquisition to remove religions from your city you could have a "Doctor" to help cure diseases. Thus removing a specific disease from your city.

Tech Curing
Each diseases would have a diffrent tech involved with its cure. Such as developing a smallpox vaccine to cure smallpox while things like the common cold would not have a cure until possibly the trans-human era.

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So what do you guys think? Could this be done?

Eh, no offense Hydro, but this already got discussed and voted down...

It's just too negative. It's like Dark Ages; while it will affect all players, the human players will always think either the AI is cheating, or that it's too harsh. It's the same reason a lot of people don't like Revolutions, too.

I realize this however can you point me towards the right direction so I could possibly make it myself?

The way I see it is with say the Water Mod and my Health mod there is going to be a lot of Health going on and not enough Unhealthy going on. To help counter this I wanted to make the Diseases to counter act them.

I mean I will add them s a corporation or something if I must but I would rather do it the right way instead of forcing it to work in a half@ss way.

Also being able to spread it to your enemy means that diseases can be sued as a weapon. Which means people might actually look past the negative effects of the mod.

Hydromancerx said:

I realize this however can you point me towards the right direction so I could possibly make it myself?

Click to expand...

There is no way you will be able to do this without SDK modding.

Don't let that stop you though. The SDK isn't something to be feared. While a project like this is out of your scope of abilities at the moment, given time, you can become competent at C++.

I'd seriously consider learning to SDK mod, you seem to have a firm grasp of XML and if you got decent, you could probably do most of your ideas on your own. I'll help you as much as I can. If you are willing, I highly, highly recommend you start by following "The Idiots Guide to the SDK", by Xienwolf.

Thanks. I figured this project would be my ongoing background project to work on a little at a time until I get skilled enough to accomplish it. Especially since it seems completely doable. Don't you think?

Hydromancerx said:

Thanks. I figured this project would be my ongoing background project to work on a little at a time until I get skilled enough to accomplish it. Especially since it seems completely doable. Don't you think?

Click to expand...

Yeah. The Total War mod already has some sort of disease system in it's SDK. It could be adapted, or at least used as an example, when you get competent enough.

Afforess said:

Eh, no offense Hydro, but this already got discussed and voted down...

It's just too negative. It's like Dark Ages; while it will affect all players, the human players will always think either the AI is cheating, or that it's too harsh. It's the same reason a lot of people don't like Revolutions, too.

Click to expand...

Speaking of diseases... I think the Plague event is way too punishing considering it is purely random. In the last MP 2 games I got it twice while my enemies did not get it even once. I even got Smallpox to boot.

The only problem with doing it like this Hydro is that none of the human players would want to discover those specific techs therefore crippling the AI dramatically. If you ask me, i'd handle disease discovery completely different.

-Have it through events, must be through events, they might not be random, but they must be through events.

-Have the disease start on a tile with a resource on it, for example Smallpox was speculated to have started from an african rodent, so have 'Furs' start the disease.

-This is when the disease should be entered in your disease screen with all the cities of the world with that disease, given smallpox started within your borders and not another civ's.

-Next have the nearest city that is connected by a road get the infection, reduce the population by percent accordingly. I say by percent because a city with a higher population can get the disease spread much more easily. On top of that, there are people with natural resistance to diseases.

-The higher the population, the easier it is for the disease to spread along trade networks

-The more networks, the easier it is for the disease to spread.

-Diseases can raise the food growth threshold to simulate the occasional death from the disease.

-Specific technologies give specific benefits against known diseases. i.e. Naturopathy can lower the initial population reduction of infection or food threshold difference.

-Only civilizations that have trade networks, espionage against, or have a unit looking over a city with a disease can know that the civilization has that disease, therefore putting it in your index allowing you to plan accordingly.

-Specific techs and buildings may help the disease spread (like harbors, airports, etc.) or give you an edge on fighting future diseases (like healer's hut, doctor's office, etc.)

@Civ Fuehrer

I like those ideas.

Could you help me with this project. You have a lot more modding experience than I do and I really could use some help with both planning and executing.

Diseases

A helpful link.

Spread
- Very Slow
- Slow
- Medium
- Fast
- Very Fast

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Anthrax (Req Animal Husbandry)
Cause: Random Chance when Access to Sheep or Cow Resources
Spread: Slow
Cure: Smart Drugs

Special Abilities

• +1
• +1 from Sheep
• +1 from Cow
• +5% Spread from Cow
• +5% Spread from Sheep

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Cholera (Req Canal Systems)
Cause: Random Chance
Spread: Fast
Cure: Smart Drugs

Special Abilities

• +4
• +1 from Freshwater
• +1 from Sanitation
• +1 from Modern Sanitation
• -5% Spread from Freshwater
• -5% Spread from Sanitation
• -5% Spread from Modern Sanitation

-----

Diphtheria (Req Trade)
Cause: Random Chance
Spread: Medium
Cure: Medicine

Special Abilities

• +2

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Dysentery (Req None)
Cause: Random Chance when City has Unhealthiness
Spread: Medium
Cure: Modern Health Care

Special Abilities

• +4
• +1 from Freshwater
• +1 from Sanitation
• +1 from Modern Sanitation
• -5% Spread from Freshwater
• -5% Spread from Sanitation
• -5% Spread from Modern Sanitation

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HIV (Req Genetics)
Cause: Random Chance with Laboratory
Spread: Medium
Cure: Homo Superior

Special Abilities

• +2
• +5
• +25% Spread from Brothel
• +10% Spread from Bath House

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Influenza (Req None)
Cause: Random Chance
Spread: Medium
Cure: Smart Drugs

Special Abilities

• +1
• +5% Spread from Pig

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Leprosy (Req Crop Rotation)
Cause: Random Chance
Spread: Slow
Cure: Modern Health Care

Special Abilities

• +1
• +2

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Malaria (Req None)
Cause: Random Chance with Jungle in City Radius
Spread: Fast
Cure: Modern Health Care

Special Abilities

• +4

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Measles (Req Anatomy)
Cause: Random Chance
Spread: Fast
Cure: Modern Health Care

Special Abilities

• +3

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Plague (Req Agriculture Tools)
Cause: Random Chance with Wheat or Rice
Spread: Fast
Cure: Modern Health Care

Special Abilities

• +2
• +5
• +10% Spread from Wheat
• +10% Spread from Rice

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Scarlet Fever (Req Biology)
Cause: Random Chance
Spread: Medium
Cure: Smart Drugs

Special Abilities

• +3
• +5% Spread from Cow

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Still more to do ...



If you have ideas for what effects the diseases should have on a city when infected please post.

Curiously I don't like the Revolution Mod (Extremly hard to manage for me )

But i find the Diseases idea wonderfull.

now will you have the diseases eventually leave the city before you get the cures symbolizing the death of everyone who will catch it and the immunities of the rest so that diseases come in wipethe population leave and a few generations later possibly comes back?

Say... Would it be possible for spies to spread these diseases on rival civs?

draz said:

Say... Would it be possible for spies to spread these diseases on rival civs?

Click to expand...

That's sort of the idea. You would have a unit (Infected Citizen) that could spread the disease (like how missionaries spread religions) and a unit (Doctor) that could cure diseases (like how the inquisition takes out religions).

Darken24 said:

now will you have the diseases eventually leave the city before you get the cures symbolizing the death of everyone who will catch it and the immunities of the rest so that diseases come in wipethe population leave and a few generations later possibly comes back?

Click to expand...

I was think of the cure like an Obsolete tech where once you get that tech the disease disappears from your cities without having to use a doctor to cure a city. Also it would never be able to reinfect from a rival civ who has not discovered the cure tech yet.

This revised idea is much better and I quite like it.

I don't think Anthrax is a disease, just very deadly microorganisms.

Would it be possible for the diseased city to affect units strengths as well? It would be tactically interesting if say, I could send in my "Smallpox Blanket" unit before I send in my army

Anthrax is a disease and like most diseases it is caused by microorganisms.

Would you be able to "weaponize" the diseases, making them stronger? Assuming you had the proper techs.

hey, CivFührers proposal on this topic looks very promising to me. in fact it's exactly how i imagined it to work. however i don't see a clear description on how a plague should affect an infected city so i'll just throw in my ideas into the discussion:

the time needed for an plagued city to end the illness should depend on the / ratio... maybe on the city size too. either you would have a predefined number of turns for the disease to go away (that would be affected by the previous mentioned factors) or you would have a chance each turn.

however after the plague is gone the city should become immune (to every(!) disease). how long this state remains could be determined by the very same mechanics used to regulate illness duration (with the same modifiers but working in an invert way).

optionally one could add the possibility to put a city in quarantine after a disease hit the city which would put the city into rebellion (sounds maybe wrong, but the idea is that the town can't do anything and can hardly defend itself during this period.. so it's exactly what the rebellious state does) and heavily reduce the chance of spreading the illness. however a quarantine requires military... the more you have stationed the more effective the quarantine will be. the quarantine option should be only available if the city possess medical buildings (healers hut?) and has a garrison.

units in a city under quarantine (alternatively any city with a plague) should not be able to heal and maybe even have a chance of losing health each turn! btw. the same should be true for units in a rebelling town!

EDIT: the AI has alway much more military per city than i do so it should be able to handle plagues via quarantine much better than i do! so this might become an interesting challenge.

Hmmm which is better? Making a disease into a corporation or religion, OR making a new disease category?

Either way how do you make a new corporation or religion?

Or maybe its better to do it all through events. Hmmm.

EDIT: Looking through the events all I could find for existing diseases are the Black Death, Influenza and Smallpox. All of which I should probably redo if i get this working.

EDIT2: I also have been looking at the plague system in Rhyes and Fall of Civilization. Not sure if I want to use any of that for this.

EDIT3: This will probably help me ...

[TUTORIAL] Guide to event modding in BtS

EDIT4: Yep looks like I am better off making custom events.