Dr kossin #30

Welcome to Dr kossin #30.

Dr is an acronym for Daily Round. Yes, I mean to get in an update every day to the games I will be playing. Of course there might be some days where I can only play a little or not at all, but I will make up for it those other days when I do have extra time on my hands.

Since the 21st edition of this series, the difficulty level has been cranked all the way up to Deity. I'm not at the point where I can win every game thrown at me on Deity level... I probably can't even win every game thrown at me on Immortal but it is getting a bit boring. My goal is now to achieve competitive skills on this level which should hopefully help me improve more.

You, the reader, can help me achieve this goal by pointing out where I got astray, give suggestions on how to proceed, use complex abstract mathematical analysis to argue, curse at me or anything that you may like. Please note that you must respect the Terms of Service of CFC in any case

You may shadow this game and post it here if you please, but I kindly request that you put it in spoiler tags and that anyone reading the report abstain from using information found there to help me out.

Should you want more clarification about something I've done, just ask for it and I will try to answer as best as I can.

Enough talk, on to the game.

Dr kossin #30​

Round 1a To Liberalism -> Nationalism
Round 1b To Flight -> ready to start buildup
Round 2a *Tank
Round 2b Just a matter of turns

Game settings
Deity
Normal Speed
Fractal
No Events
No Huts
BTS 3.19 with BUG 4.3 in CustomAssets and BULL 1.1
Everything else is normal.

The leader, this time, is:


Please refer to the France Civ IV wiki for more information on this leader/nation.

The start:


This is the second start I generated. The first was with Pacal... yea uhh I forgot to select Louis! All I know about this start is that I'm not isolated. I might be semi-isolated, I might have no metals with Shaka next door... I just don't know.

Looks like Animal Hunting is the way to go here. The only question however is do I go through Hunting or straight there.
It's hard to see but there's a multi-tile lake 2N of the settler, at least 3 tiles from the looks of it.

The warrior can move to the forested plains hill to check if seafood will be lost otherwise SIP looks decent enough.

GLH could be in the works here depending on surroundings, the fresh lake certainly asks for an early lighthouse. The only problem I see with this approach is the lack of production... cows+2 hills means I'll be around 12/turn, 18 with Industrious. It's still a lot of hammers&turns to generate for a Wonder. As Silu pointed out, production is not a problem at all if you count the fogged tiles... plenty of hills there!

Let's see what the RNG handed us this time before running around in circulatory discussion.

As a side note...
Sum of all attachments owned by kossin: 41.73 MB
Hopefully I make it through the series before hitting the 60MB mark

kossin said:

2 seafoods+1 cow means 2.33 resources so there should be something NNW of the settler.

Click to expand...

What is this? Apparently seafood count as 0.66 of a start-resource? Is there some guide documenting how the start location is generated?

I'm guessing an additional piece of seafood to the north or alternatively some food/strat resource 2n1w and an uranium in one of those forests. Not a very good start for the French starting techs anyways, but I'm sure you'll make it work.

Wreck said:

What is this? Apparently seafood count as 0.66 of a start-resource? Is there some guide documenting how the start location is generated?

Click to expand...

Correct, flood plains also count for 1/3 I think.

I don't remember any guides on the issue but there are a few posts that discuss the algorithm used to spawn starts. I'll see if I can find it again...

Finally found it.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=252429

It doesn't list Flood Plains value however but if my memory serves it's 1/3 for each tile.

Not the best start. Maybe a decent candidate for an early Moai?

Some discussion for those who peeked inside the WB or are curious about a map spoiler.



I'll just say this publicly: Soirana did some serious cooking here...



...and as such I'm no longer interested in this game.

And kossin, I'm sure these games would be much more interesting with you playing first-generation maps or maps from someone who can actually generate maps.

kossin said:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=252429

Click to expand...

Interesting read. One assumes that the algorithm has been changed since 2007. "Bhruic" (apparently a developer?) was working on it even then.

I'd like to read the BtS 3.19 version of CvGame.cpp for myself, to see what it does. But after poking around the net a bit, I don't know where to look. I have a copy of the vanilla civ4 SDK as of 2006, and it has CvGameCoreDLL_v161/CvGameCoreDLL/CvGame.cpp -- but surely that must be out of date. Can anyone point me towards the BTS 3.19 SDK?

JFleme said:

I'll just say this publicly: Soirana did some serious cooking here...

Click to expand...

Okay... I don't want to play cooked games on Deity. I'm scraping this one and will use my own maps from now on. Sorry for the problems everyone!

Cheers, you can go ahead and look at the spoiler now if you didn't already. The map was seriously stupid.

Wreck said:

I'd like to read the BtS 3.19 version of CvGame.cpp for myself, to see what it does. But after poking around the net a bit, I don't know where to look. I have a copy of the vanilla civ4 SDK as of 2006, and it has CvGameCoreDLL_v161/CvGameCoreDLL/CvGame.cpp -- but surely that must be out of date. Can anyone point me towards the BTS 3.19 SDK?

Click to expand...

Yes. I'm guessing (mainly, your OS) you'll find it on your own computer at C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meyer's Civilization 4\Beyond the Sword\CvGameCoreDLL\ .

I'm happy to submit unaltered maps checked for iso etc.
Alternatively Kossin feel free to send me a save to be checked if you like

Thanks for the offer, I'll consider it after this one!

~~~

The OP is edited and the game can start anew.

With the new game, I'd definitely consider settling on the wine. If all you lose is lake tiles, it might be worth it. That being said, trading a few fresh water/lighthouse lake tiles for plain water tiles isn't a very good tradeoff.

I can't decide whether it is better to move the warrior 1NE to the pig hill to see what would be at the N of the BFC if you settle in place, or 1 SE to see if there is any seafood worth moving toward. Probably the latter, but I am not familiar with Deity.

Edit: Nevermind. Moving the warrior 1SE wouldn't reveal many coastal tiles. Not sure what I was thinking (and should have read the OP post). I would move the warrior to forested plains hill. And yes, AH first.

Lack of production? 3 unforested GH + 1PH + Cow, that's a great prod capital if u ask me, especially if taken into account the very possible stratreso if there's no resources in the fog. Going obsolete is certainly an option if the situation warrants it (like, nearby Stone/Marble).

I see no argument for Hunting first since all your good tiles are AH ones, you'd trade sth like a dozen food for a dozen beakers - not good, and even that's assuming you'll have use for Hunting at all.

Silu said:

Lack of production? 3 unforested GH + 1PH + Cow, that's a great prod capital if u ask me, especially if taken into account the very possible stratreso if there's no resources in the fog. Going obsolete is certainly an option if the situation warrants it (like, nearby Stone/Marble).

I see no argument for Hunting first since all your good tiles are AH ones, you'd trade sth like a dozen food for a dozen beakers - not good, and even that's assuming you'll have use for Hunting at all.

Click to expand...

Uh... good catch, I forgot to count the fog tiles

The reason for mentioning AH is in case SIP reveals a grain resource and for the possibility of going Archery if needed.

SIP looks like it's your best bet. Hopefully this one will turn out well like the last one. Nuke wars are fun. >:]

kossin said:

It's hard to see but there's a multi-tile lake 2N of the settler, at least 3 tiles from the looks of it.

Click to expand...

How can you tell that its a lake and not coast? By the lack of waves?


Along the same lines how can you tell the 2 hidden grass hills are unforested? Thanks!

Norvin_Green said:

How can you tell that its a lake and not coast? By the lack of waves?


Along the same lines how can you tell the 2 hidden grass hills are unforested? Thanks!

Click to expand...

Determining the difference between lake and coast I find to be much easier if you open the save, rather than just look at the picture (zooming in and all).

As for the forest, this is pretty easy. If they were forested there would be trees that are visible on those tiles (even though the tiles aren't visible). Just for comparison sake, I added some trees to those tiles (WB) so you can see the difference.

edit: posted the wrong screenshot, for an unobscured view see my next post :/