Nobles' Club XLIX: Churchill of England

The Nobles' Club series started out as a way for Noble-level (and below) players to improve their game. Most of the original participants now play at much higher levels, so this has become a way for advanced players to help others learn to play better. You can play your own game at any level and with any mod, but it would be nice to comment on the games of other players and give them advice.

Our next leader is Churchill of England, our third English leader (after Elizabeth in I and XII, and Victoria in XXXVII).

The English start with fishing and mining.

• Traits: CHA means extra happiness and faster unit promotions; PRO means better defenders. Extra happiness can be highly valuable during early city growth, and the monument bonus might cause you to prioritize Stonehenge. The two traits synergize with the UU (see below).
• UB: Stock Exchange, a bank giving 65% bonus instead of 50%.
  
• UU: Redcoat, a very popular UU because of its 25% bonus versus gunpowder units; it's the only UU based on riflemen, already regarded as a strong unit on its own. With CHA and PRO, they start with Drill I, and the three promotions for Drill IV only require 8 XP; there's a recent discussion of the value and limitations of Drill IV redcoats.
  

And the start:

Finally, a cut and paste of our standard doctrine:

There are no hard and fast rules here: fun and learning are our primary goals, but we do request that you update your progress at various points in the game, using the Spoiler feature of the boards.

Tentative posting updates are suggested at:

4000 BC (starting thoughts, no spoiler required for that discussion)
1000 BC or so (how you decided to progress up the early tech/build paths, which AIs you have met, where you're thinking of putting cities, etc)
500 AD or so (after establishing some cities and a possible plan of action)
1200 AD or so (mid-game, Lib race, wars or peace, or whichever happened or didn't, met other continent if applicable, etc)
1600 AD (or when you have decided on a course of action and a specific victory condition)
End of game (Victory!!! or defeat, no shame in losing, especially if you tried a higher level. Learning is what we focus on, not fastest win or biggest empire)

Remember, these are only guidelines. What we really want are your thoughts as the game goes on, so if your strategies don't fall into line with those dates, feel free to adjust your reports accordingly.

We also welcome players to ask for specific game advice, as we have a number or stronger players who lurk and help out with solid tips, and of course, we help each other. Replies to specific questions should also be in spoilers, with a simple "@" in front of the person the answer is directed towards.

Special Thanks go to Bleys and TMIT, who really made this series a great one, r_rolo1, mapmaker extraordinaire, for his maps for most of the series, and all of you for playing.

The WB-saves are attached (zipped; they are bigger than standard saves). To play, simply download and unzip it into your BTS/Saves/WorldBuilder folder. Start the game, and load your favorite MOD (if you use one, if not, check out the BUG MOD), select "Play Scenario", and look for "NC 49 Churchill Noble" (or Monarch, if you want the AI to start with its usual Archery bonus tech, or Immortal for Archery+Hunting, or Deity to add Agriculture). This allows you to play with your favorite MOD at the Level and Speed of your choice. From Quick-Warlord to Marathon-Deity, all are welcome! We stuck with the name "Nobles Club" because it has a cool ring to it.

Reserved.

Wow... that's a great capital spot. The only two coast tiles have resources, there's lot of food and great room for a lot of cottages. I might even try this on emperor tomorrow (probably going to lose ), although...

spoiler about map

@CivilizedTiger:

I didn't mean anything negative with the question, I hope I didn't create that impression.
I don't need maps to be doctored much, I appreciate all the effort you put in the maps you offer.

I was only curious whether the form of the terrain was stranger or what one would generally expect from this map script. I don't want to see the map yet, and I guess you've had your chance to see it already.

I didn't interpret it as negative.

The extent to which I suck at Pangaea maps knows no bounds. I don't know what it is about my play style but when I first started reading here a kajillion years ago, I was shocked to find that people hated isolated starts and that many seemed to prefer Pangaeas. So this will be a good one for me. I've been trying some prince games on my own lately but I think I'll stick to noble/marathon on this since it's such an issue for me.

Initial thoughts; I'll likely SIP but I'll move the warrior first to verify I don't want to move.

This should be interesting. I don't think I've ever played a Pangaea map as the idea of it just sounded boring. However, there's always a first. Haven't played Churchill much either. (except trying Kossin's barb deal at the moment) His traits are very different from the other English leaders but very synergistic with the UU.

initial thoughts:

if you haven't started, nor read that drill iv thread, read it now. from there you can have a pretty good idea what the delamb was looking for in this map. however, if you want to do it or not, that is up to you.

@Amao:

Never played churchhill before...I'll give this a crack on Emperor/Marathon...hopefully I can get farther than i did last time...

@dalamb

I'm going to do this on Monarch/Epic, as usual. Hopefully this one will go better than the Sury game did!

I'll move the warrior to be sure, but I'll most likely settle in place. Initial build will be a work boat for sure, to take advantage of the clams. After that I'm most likely doing warrior, worker, either work boat or settler depending on population at that time.

Tech order will depend on what I find, with early exploration but I'll probably prioritize hunting, BW, and Masonry to take advantage of the local resources. I need to think about the exact order more.

General plan will be domination/conquest. Rule Brittania!

I'm debating stepping up to Prince. I sorta bogged down in my attempt as Sitting Bull (NC 7); if I finish that first it'll be very late in the cycle for this game. But as you probably guessed I'm very fond of the idea of some Drill IV redcoats (plus support troops) stomping the continent, so I might abandon SB (or at least continue my long pause).

BW first for slavery. After that, mysticism for Stonehenge, then perhaps hunting for elephants and archery for good defenders. Other worker techs as they prove appropriate with exploration. I expect to try for Oracle/MC given the nearby marble.

Edit: workboat first, and maybe a second. After that worker, and chop a 2nd worker while building a warrior. I have a bad habit of too few workers, so chopping a 2nd quickly seems like a good idea to me.

You should definitely try prince difficulty out. Trust me, it's not much more difficult than noble, and considering how many noble games you've played, you should have no trouble.

I for one felt no difference in: (not to say there is no difference, but it seems discrete)
- how fast the AI techs
- how well AI defends and attacks
- how fast the AI expands

The prince games I've lost, I would have lost in noble as well, due to too great ambition supported by no reality (i.e. capturing a barb city well within the continent ruled by three factions, with all other cities of mine somewhere else)

I think ill try this sometime in June when i'm on holidays as i don't have much time for civving these days (Leaving cert exams are only 5 weeks away!!!) But if i do this, i'll do it on Noble level, normal game speed. I've been very interested to try Churchill since the ALC game. I think the traits will make the redcoats even better. He's one of the few good protective leaders.... This will be my first posted, online game bdw.... That elephant resource looks great to me for nationhood draft abuse later in this game....

I will try it at Prince/Epic (playing lately mostly this setup).
The cap looks good, but will see how will look the map around.

Techs maybe directly for BW (chops, slavery + copper), rush will be decided when i see who is around and how far. Then probably wheel for roads, hunting (elephant).
Build order WB, maybe 2 (depends on techs), worker, war, probably settler for 2nd city.

millahnna said:

The extent to which I suck at Pangaea maps knows no bounds.

Click to expand...

lymond said:

This should be interesting. I don't think I've ever played a Pangaea map as the idea of it just sounded boring.

Click to expand...

Pangaea maps are a favourite for HOF quick-conquest games, since you can reach everybody pre-Astronomy and never have to mount a naval invasion. I was initially planning multiple continents but realized I hadn't done a Pangaea, at least not in a long time, and decided to give it a try. The flip side of you being able to reach everybody is that everybody can reach you, too; we'll see how that works out.

So, I went Prince, and will likely whine for advice even more often than usual:

@dalamb

@CT: