Study needed- greatest practical city size

Kyriakos

Kyriakos

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Does anyone know which is the greatest city size where the graphic is seen in its entirety on the map, nomatter how far you are from it?

I could use such a study in my fantasy set, since i dont want it to be cut off from the screen :)
 
Kyriakos said:
Does anyone know which is the greatest city size where the graphic is seen in its entirety on the map, nomatter how far you are from it?

I could use such a study in my fantasy set, since i dont want it to be cut off from the screen :)
Click to expand...

Not sure if this is what you are asking.

Using Goldfools template for the example, anything in the black area risks being covered by overlays such as irrigation and roads.

The rest will overlay everything but units and will be visable at all times.
 
Hi Pounder,
this is the old city size, the one used before the discovery that you can enlarge the city file for as much as you want to.
But the problem is that after a certain size the graphic is only seen when you have a unit next to the city :)
 
I verified back a few months ago that this does work when Kyriakos discovered it.

I found that it was not practical at any size because it covered over the tiles behind the city, couldn't tell what work had to be done on which tiles, and if you came down into the black area a lot of the city would be eventually covered by overlays like mines, irrigation,...

Edit: I would say no more than 50% bigger, so you can see at least half of the extra tiles covered by the city.
 
BadKharma: i think that someone had made a template, but you can make one yourself easily using Goldfools one for the regular size :)

Pounder: Yes, i think that 150% is the optimal size as well.
 
Also, you want to keep the city small enough so it doesn't spread out too far. 150% probably sounds like an optimal size. Because whenever the city goes off the screen in the game, the city graphic disappears. So if you have a huge city that covers 30 tiles e.g., the whole thing just vanishes if the city center reaches the edge of the screen.

It would have been nice if this was not the case, because it would have been incredibly useful to create almost any type of graphics overlay in a scenario.
 
One other consideration is how it will look on the coast, you should have some terrain under the city that will help blend those situations. It would not look correct to have houses out in the water.
 
I believe there are mining and irrigation improvement graphics that make it look like a city is spreading out over the tiles surrounding the one the city is located on. Somebody should know what I'm talking about.

My preference is to just use a standard sized city graphic, and if you want it to look like a city has spread out over the surrounding tiles, use improvement graphics that give that look.
 
Kyriakos, the thread where we discussed that was your own thread >here<. I did some testing of the idea, and discovered that tall cities don't disappear as readily as wide ones. I used them in my Manhattan terrain and in King Arthur's Super Scenario without any problem.

Here is a rar with some oversized city templates that I made to play with: View attachment Cities Templates.rar
 
Balthasar said:
Kyriakos, the thread where we discussed that was your own thread >here<. I did some testing of the idea, and discovered that tall cities don't disappear as readily as wide ones. I used them in my Manhattan terrain and in King Arthur's Super Scenario without any problem.

Here is a rar with some oversized city templates that I made to play with: View attachment 258436
Click to expand...

I just found this, great!
 
Hm, i will probably use this. Does it not disappear at all cases, have you tested with pixels beginning at the bottom and not going all the way up? (not very possible it would create a problem, but we do not have the code)
 
You can see it for yourself, in my Manhattan terrain, where the Empire State Building is a city/landmark. I've never seen it disappear altogether. The important thing to remember is that the red guides I placed on the template indicate the center of the image - i.e., the base of the building/city is that red diamond. You have all the space above that to play with. Hello tall castles and minarets!

One of the ideas I had was to pair these with duplicate city/units (the Tower city units were my test unit) so that some of the time, the city comes to life. The city appearance can't change with city size, but it could change era-to-era...
 
I remember there being a template file set for all city styles... sadly, some weeks back, when I started looking for it, I couldn't find anything. Started making my own x2 sized set with only the European file done as of yet... Idea beeing to have the gfx at the original size yet to add additional stuff. Has anyone still got this on their HDD?
 
Balthasar said:
Kyriakos, the thread where we discussed that was your own thread >here<. I did some testing of the idea, and discovered that tall cities don't disappear as readily as wide ones. I used them in my Manhattan terrain and in King Arthur's Super Scenario without any problem.

Here is a rar with some oversized city templates that I made to play with: View attachment 258436
Click to expand...

Im so happy i found this, thanks for making these, i was having problems getting my churches to fit, but that problem is solved!

As to the greater topic here, im not sure about the question, because I think so much is individual taste. I think cities, like the irrigation, should fit well. But that doesnt mean liberty cant be taken, if its done with a measure of art, and innovation.

I love the idea of the city terrain, i was thinking about how well a Stalingrad battle could be fought on that kind of terrain.

Civilization never runs out of new ideas, that is its secret to its longevity.
 
Zubareva said:
Im so happy i found this, thanks for making these, i was having problems getting my churches to fit, but that problem is solved!
Click to expand...

You're welcome. Glad to be of help.

Zubareva said:
As to the greater topic here, im not sure about the question, because I think so much is individual taste. I think cities, like the irrigation, should fit well. But that doesnt mean liberty cant be taken, if its done with a measure of art, and innovation.

I love the idea of the city terrain, i was thinking about how well a Stalingrad battle could be fought on that kind of terrain.

Civilization never runs out of new ideas, that is its secret to its longevity.
Click to expand...

It's the combination of art and innovation that makes modding C3C so fun. This game engine is very versatile and the art is relatively easy to mod. There are lots of modding groups for lots of games, but none that comes close to the community of artists that we have here.

Stalingrad is a good idea for a city-scenario. I always thought that Rome was another; or Venice, or Vicksburg. I'm working on London and Chicago maps, myself. There are so many; the whole genre is largely unexplored so far except for the Super Scenario and EFZI. I'd always thought that a city-maker/modeler (like Kyriakos, for instance...) might one day get interested in designing an entire city-terrain. It would be an interesting & challenging project, certainly.
 
W.i.n.t.e.r said:
I remember there being a template file set for all city styles... sadly, some weeks back, when I started looking for it, I couldn't find anything. Started making my own x2 sized set with only the European file done as of yet... Idea beeing to have the gfx at the original size yet to add additional stuff. Has anyone still got this on their HDD?
Click to expand...

On post #101 of this thread http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=111965
 
Balthasar said:
You're welcome. Glad to be of help.



It's the combination of art and innovation that makes modding C3C so fun. This game engine is very versatile and the art is relatively easy to mod. There are lots of modding groups for lots of games, but none that comes close to the community of artists that we have here.

Stalingrad is a good idea for a city-scenario. I always thought that Rome was another; or Venice, or Vicksburg. I'm working on London and Chicago maps, myself. There are so many; the whole genre is largely unexplored so far except for the Super Scenario and EFZI. I'd always thought that a city-maker/modeler (like Kyriakos, for instance...) might one day get interested in designing an entire city-terrain. It would be an interesting & challenging project, certainly.
Click to expand...

That is an intersting topic of conversation. Jeffery had an idea that i was not sure on...

Although the concept is good, im not sure of the playability, so maybe you can give a thought.


The idea is to create historic battles, of an individual nature. Like Waterloo, or the "Bulge," any battle of history.

The battlefield would be recreated in large scale, and the unitls of the battle would be placed in more or less historical army strengths and types.

It sounds like a good idea, but im not so sure that most people would want to sit down and move several hundred units around every turn.

What do you think?
 
Zubareva said:
[City terrains are] an intersting topic of conversation....Although the concept is good, im not sure of the playability, so maybe you can give a thought.
Click to expand...

The one time we've tried, the Super Scenario, is very playable. Correction: the EFZI scenario was also a City-terrain scenario and it worked well enough to get the Mod of the Decade award. I've had a peek at Vuldacon's almost-finished EFZI sequel; it's unbelievable.

Zubareva said:
The idea is to create historic battles, of an individual nature. Like Waterloo, or the "Bulge," any battle of history.
It sounds like a good idea, but im not so sure that most people would want to sit down and move several hundred units around every turn.

What do you think?
Click to expand...

I wouldn't worry about that: most historic war mods start with large numbers of units to move, including the WWII in the Pacific conquest scenario that comes with C3C (and sets the AI -the Japanese - to attack on the first turn!). Don't forget that some guys were moving little metal units around on tabletop battlegrounds long before computer games came along.

Such a "battle" scenario, done carefully and accurately (with great graphics!) could be fascinating and educational to make, and interesting to play, I'm sure. It could be a good multi-player scenario, too.
 
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