[Module] Less Dangerous Animals 1.30

Milaga

Prince
Joined
Jan 19, 2008
Messages
470
Here are some changes I am playing with to make the wilderness a little less dangerous. Not nearly as many changes are needed as in previous versions. These are mostly temporary fixes that will be resolved soon anyway. I'd rather the RiFE team focus on more important bugs than toning down the wilds. This should help the AI keep some of their improvements and give them a fighting chance.

Spoiler Version 1.303 - 2010.08.19 :
* Mammoths really won't be able to attack and kill your Avatar units this time. I promise.
Spoiler Version 1.302 - 2010.08.18 :
* Wurm strength reduced from 5 to 4, and their appearance probability cut in half.
* Orc fire resistance reduced from 100% to 50%.
* Changed version number to comply with info.txt for modules
Spoiler Version 1.30a - 2010.08.17 :
* Fixed a CTD associated with age 100 units becoming unleashed.
Spoiler Version 1.30 - 2010.08.07 :
* Started from scratch. RiFE 1.3 is here!
* Now in in a Module form. Neat!
* Cyklop and Hill Giant move reduced to 1.
* Meteor strength reduced by 1, range reduced by 1, collateral damage reduced by 25% and damage limit reduced by 10%. Brass Drakes rock my D'Teshi butt.
* Cyklop and Hill Giant have been given Minotaur leashes.
* Minotaur leashes now require the Bhall barbarian civilization and are bMustMaintain. Captured units should lose their leashes.
* Elephant Blood promotion no longer lets Elephants and Mammoths attack.
To install, extract the archive into the the Rise from Erebus/Assets/Modules/NormalModules directory.

Activating, deactivating or updating this module should not break game saves.
 

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Nice mod!
I especially like the reduced move a giants :goodjob:

Thank you.

I understand why these units were given 2 move. They are big, so they should be able to move faster than most smaller units. Unfortunately, this means that usually they will show up on your borders one turn and be in striking distance of your city, improvements or workers the next. This is why it was much harder to mount a defense against a single hill giant than a stack of warriors. The way I see it, while they can move faster than a human you will see or hear them coming a mile away.

Added to the Download thread. Alot of this will be addressed in 1.31 as is. :p

That's what I figured. These are just the changes I've been playing with. I released them so others don't have to wait for 1.31 and you guys won't feel rushed to release a patch!
 
Sounds good, will give it a try. :) AI not getting decimated by animals and barbs would be very welcome ^^

Edit: Should this module be showing up in the RiFE launcher? Cause for me it aint. :/
 
Edit: Should this module be showing up in the RiFE launcher? Cause for me it aint. :/

It should be. Did extract it in your Modules folder or in the NormalModules folder within the Modules folder.
 
It should be. Did extract it in your Modules folder or in the NormalModules folder within the Modules folder.

The module files are in C:\...\Civ IV folder\beyond the sword\assets\modules\normalmodules\LessDangerousAnimals

Tried a "play now" game and it definately wasn't on, saw a civ wiped out in the first few turns and despite getting off to a sweet start with a great prophet and an early expand I was taken out by an army of cyclops as well
 
The module files are in C:\...\Civ IV folder\beyond the sword\assets\modules\normalmodules\LessDangerousAnimals

Tried a "play now" game and it definately wasn't on, saw a civ wiped out in the first few turns and despite getting off to a sweet start with a great prophet and an early expand I was taken out by an army of cyclops as well

It should be in:

Beyond The Sword\Mods\Rise from Erebus\Assets\Modules\NormalModules\LessDangerousAnimals.

Basically, you have it in BtS. Not RifE.
 
I understand why these units were given 2 move. They are big, so they should be able to move faster than most smaller units. Unfortunately, this means that usually they will show up on your borders one turn and be in striking distance of your city, improvements or workers the next. This is why it was much harder to mount a defense against a single hill giant than a stack of warriors. The way I see it, while they can move faster than a human you will see or hear them coming a mile away.

Yeah, exactly. Even worse when they come up over a peak that you a) can't see over, and b) are conditioned to expect to be safe. Since I doubt it's possible to make them more visible, I would really like to see them stay at 1 move (though if they have 2 move, it's not the end of the world... mostly I can just deal with it and reload slightly more often). Also, it would be nice if fewer units had mountainwalk. Giants, yeah, they pretty much have to have it - wouldn't make sense if they were stopped by mountains. And for Dwarves, it's thematic. But maybe not Trolls? It just feels like there are too many units that just pop right over the mountains and gank my workers. Though I know it's not specifically a 1.3 issue, since most of the same units had mountainwalk in 1.23.
 
Yeah, exactly. Even worse when they come up over a peak that you a) can't see over, and b) are conditioned to expect to be safe. Since I doubt it's possible to make them more visible, I would really like to see them stay at 1 move (though if they have 2 move, it's not the end of the world... mostly I can just deal with it and reload slightly more often). Also, it would be nice if fewer units had mountainwalk. Giants, yeah, they pretty much have to have it - wouldn't make sense if they were stopped by mountains. And for Dwarves, it's thematic. But maybe not Trolls? It just feels like there are too many units that just pop right over the mountains and gank my workers. Though I know it's not specifically a 1.3 issue, since most of the same units had mountainwalk in 1.23.

Heh, I actually removed the ability for Trolls to mountainwalk in my local version. I didn't change them in this module because, as I remember, they were the key recon unit for the Jotnar.

Units that can mountainwalk:
* Any unit with the Dwarven, Giantkin or Trollkin promotion
* Any unit led by a Giantkin or Trollkin commanders
* Any flying unit
* Greater Rutila Scorpions
* Haunts
* Meskwaki
* Yvain
* Mother
* The Mithril Golem
* Heralds
* All Druids, as far as I know.

This is way too many. Flyers can move into peaks, of course. But apart from Heralds (who really should be flying, considering they are in a chariot led by pegasus), Giantkin and minions on the same tile (Giants are the only ones I can really see stepping over mountains), and maybe the Mithril Golem (because anything a Giant can do you can be damn sure this thing can do too), none of these units should be mountainwalking.

Except maybe Meshwaki. Because what the heck is a Meshwaki? Why do I not know that?
 
I guess Giants could suffer from additionally movement and combat penalties in marshes as they would be constantly sinking.
 
Heh, I actually removed the ability for Trolls to mountainwalk in my local version. I didn't change them in this module because, as I remember, they were the key recon unit for the Jotnar.

Units that can mountainwalk:
* Any unit with the Dwarven, Giantkin or Trollkin promotion
* Any unit led by a Giantkin or Trollkin commanders
* Any flying unit
* Greater Rutila Scorpions
* Haunts
* Meskwaki
* Yvain
* Mother
* The Mithril Golem
* Heralds
* All Druids, as far as I know.

This is way too many. Flyers can move into peaks, of course. But apart from Heralds (who really should be flying, considering they are in a chariot led by pegasus), Giantkin and minions on the same tile (Giants are the only ones I can really see stepping over mountains), and maybe the Mithril Golem (because anything a Giant can do you can be damn sure this thing can do too), none of these units should be mountainwalking.

Except maybe Meshwaki. Because what the heck is a Meshwaki? Why do I not know that?

I don't think it's quite that simple. There are good reasons for all of those units to be mountainwalking:


* Any flying unit => Well, they're flying ;)
* Heralds => Same as above
* Greater Rutila Scorpions => Unless I fail to use the pedia reader that's the only effect this promotion has + it's a pretty high level promotion so it's not like you're going to see that many of them
* Meskwaki, Yvain, Mother, The Mithril Golem => These are all World Units, they are meant to be powerful and they can only exist once so they can hardly be made responsible for there being to many mountaineering units.
* Haunts => Perhaps they don't need to be mountaineering, but like the World Units they are UU available to only a single civ and they can't even be build, making them unable to move through peaks would hardly solve your problem
* Any unit with the Giantkin or Trollkin promotion => The vast majority of mountaineering units since many of them are common barbarian units, perhaps you could remove it from Trollkin, though I always understood them to be so well adapted at living in the wilds that they can climb mountains which are impassible for human armies. And giants really shouldn't be bother by mountains any more than humans are bothered by hills.
* All Druids => Same as Trollkin, except that Druids are late game national units who would have very little effect on the overall number of mountaineering units in the game.
* Any unit with the Dwarven promotion => I guess you could remove mountaineering from dwarves, there is no reason why they should have to be any better at climbing mountains than humans. That being said, you could easily come up with a reason (e.g.: They are the children of Kilmorph and thus are better at moving in uneven terrain, similar to how the elven are better at moving in forests) and mountaineering is important for their gameplay, we want dwarven players to settle in hills near mountain ridges, that's why they get production from peaks after all. Yet without mountaineering, settling near mountains would make them almost defenceless against mountaineering barbarians and they would have trouble hooking up resources on the other side of a mountain ridge.
* Any unit led by a Giantkin or Trollkin commanders => Didn't even know that, guess you could remove it, though that wouldn't have much effect except against human Jotnar players.

PS: Pedia Reader FTW.
 
Would raising the moment cost for peak by one (or more) help this. Would seem that even large and flying units are slower when trying to get past mountains.
 
Would raising the moment cost for peak by one (or more) help this. Would seem that even large and flying units are slower when trying to get past mountains.

No.The common mountainwalking units, Giants and Flyers, ignore terrain movement cost. No so sure about trolls, but I think they tend towards 1:move: anyway.

I think mountainwalk could be removed from everyone but Fliers, Druids and units that spend promotions on being able to. To some extent it depend on how big you think giants are, I thought they were GIANTS, but according to some who care more about lore than I do, they're just big humans - not enough to step over rivers, mountains or wade though forests as if it was tall grass.
 
Heh. I think I would be the one Odalrick means in that post... yeah, I see them as just around 10-12 foot, honestly. They came from Man, so they aren't THAT big.

To explain the list....


  • Any unit with the Dwarven, Giantkin or Trollkin promotion
    • Dwarves (Khazad +2 and Luchuirp +1) and Jotnar (+1) gain production from peaks. I want them settling near them. This is difficult to do if they are not able to move through peaks.
    • In the case of the dwarves, it also (in my mind, at least) represents their tunnels through the mountains... Not them going over the top.
  • Any unit led by a Giantkin or Trollkin commanders
    • Was not aware of this actually. Feel free to remove it.
  • Any flying unit
    • Flying.
  • Greater Rutila Scorpions
    • I made this scorpion all about hills and mountains (and burrowing. :p), and it is a relatively high level promo.
  • Haunts
    • These guys are just the form that the Scion hunters take in Haunted Lands. However, HL cannot be placed on mountains. Shouldn't ever really be able to use them that way.
  • Meskwaki
    • No idea why he can.
  • Yvain
    • Always been able to. Other than that, no idea.
  • Mother
    • She's freaking huge. I have trouble seeing anything that big, with that many legs, NOT able to climb a mountain.
  • The Mithril Golem
    • Same as mother; Just huge.
  • Heralds
    • Pretty much the same as flying.
  • All Druids, as far as I know.
    • Always been able to.

The big sources are the Dwarves and the Giants.... But both races need it, to be able to utilize peaks effectively.
 
Actually being huge can be a problem to climb mountains, because huge are usually heavy and mountains aren't that stable.
 
[*]In the case of the dwarves, it also (in my mind, at least) represents their tunnels through the mountains... Not them going over the top.
Could this be better achieved by only allowing workers to walk on mountains, and then requiring other units to have a road on the peak before they can move over it?
 
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