[PATHFINDING] Civilian Units Route incorrectly around friendly units

K

KCMcG

Chieftain
Joined
Sep 21, 2010
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61
Location
United States
I noticed in my current game that Rio De Janeiro had placed a unit on one of my roads through neutral territory. I was allied with Rio. I had no problem with military units walking through this unit and staying on the roads. When I tried to move my workers or great people through the allied units, the worker insisted on going around, causing it to leave the road. There's no other way to get through the enemy unit because workers are considered military units and can't occupy the same tile.

I've attached the save.

Great Scientist can't route through America (Not at war)


Settler unable to go through Rio


Worker unable to get through Rio


Spearman with no trouble going through Rio
 

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Workers should definitely be an exception to the one unit per tile rule. There should be a way to pass through them, as you suggest, and also to stack them (maybe with a 3-4 worker limit perhaps) to rapidly perform critical improvements.

The one unit per tile works well for tactical battle strategy, but workers have little to do with this and should be an exception.
 
Anastomosis said:
Workers should definitely be an exception to the one unit per tile rule. There should be a way to pass through them, as you suggest, and also to stack them (maybe with a 3-4 worker limit perhaps) to rapidly perform critical improvements.
Click to expand...

Agreed, but I don't have a problem with the workers not stacking with each other. I would be happy if the workers could occupy the same tile as an allied/friendly combat unit. This is not the case right now, allowing exploits where you can prevent an ally with open borders to from creating tile improvements, possibly preventing them from hooking up strategic resources.
 
Can you please post a save? I think that this is to do with the number of movement points. You can't stack civilian units with units from another civilization, but they can move through if they have enough movement points to do so. I.e. you should be able to end turn next to that city state unit, then move through it (along the road) next turn.
 
ainwood said:
Can you please post a save? I think that this is to do with the number of movement points. You can't stack civilian units with units from another civilization, but they can move through if they have enough movement points to do so. I.e. you should be able to end turn next to that city state unit, then move through it (along the road) next turn.
Click to expand...

I did post a save. I double-checked and civilian units are completely unable to move through friendly units from another civ, whether the units are military or civilian. Please confirm this.
 
In my latest game, Japan had a city one hex away from a mountain range on the coast. I was completely blocked from going through his territory, despite our open borders agreement, because he had two unprotected workers building improvements. This is frustrating! Has anyone else noticed this yet?
 
r_rolo1 said:
By some god forsaken reason, they made the civilian units unable to ocupy a tile that has a foreign military unit. i think that explains a lot of the above.
Click to expand...

same vice versa - but the first one (own civilian vs. foreign military) is most annoying. They don't need to be stackable for all sake, but completely impassable is really annoying.

1st poster added a save, can confirm this a 100+ times ;)
 
I already had posted a save around this issue ( should be somewhere in page 3 by now :D ) ...

I think that they should had done things in a simple way: civilian and military units ignore eachother until war starts. Far simpler, works acording to expectations, and avoids some nasty exploits that can be done around this theme ( say, mess out with road building or avoid a enemy of improving a resource tile just by putting a scout there )
 
r_rolo1 said:
I think that they should had done things in a simple way: civilian and military units ignore eachother until war starts. Far simpler, works acording to expectations, and avoids some nasty exploits that can be done around this theme ( say, mess out with road building or avoid a enemy of improving a resource tile just by putting a scout there )
Click to expand...

Though in that case you could mess with the enemy by planting your own worker there. :p
 
Bah, true enough. But for solving that you need to throw the 1 upt though the window :D And doing that with a worker is basically offering a free lunch if the oponent is not dumb :p
 
Hehheh, true enough! I honestly can't think of a good solution for all these issues that retains 1upt, but feel that giving players the ability to ask/threaten to have specific units moved out of the way would help... if the AI could be made to understand it.
 
Well the simplest solution would be to revise the stacking rules so that it is

1 Military unit of ANY civ
1 Civilian unit of EACH civ (not at war with the military unit present)

and units not at war/open borders should definitely be able to pass through each other.

There's probably some issue with the stacking, and with founding cities.
 
Krikkitone said:
Well the simplest solution would be to revise the stacking rules so that it is

1 Military unit of ANY civ
1 Civilian unit of EACH civ (not at war with the military unit present)

and units not at war/open borders should definitely be able to pass through each other.

There's probably some issue with the stacking, and with founding cities.
Click to expand...

I think this is a good solution. This keeps the 1upt ability to blockade military units, even if friendly without allowing exploits like preventing a friendly civ from building improvements. More importantly, it prevents the stupid AI from blocking your roads.

I think having the ability to ask the AI to move a unit would be nice too, I just don't think the AI is smart enough to know how to request the same of you.
 
Well the simplest solution would be to revise the stacking rules so that it is

1 Military unit of ANY civ
1 Civilian unit of EACH civ (not at war with the military unit present)

and units not at war/open borders should definitely be able to pass through each other.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that looks good to me too. (Could be entertaining issues with multiple workers working on things on the same tile- in the base game I think that could only be roads but it could get funny in mods, and settling would presumably have to bump units and could get downright hilarious in simu turns MP...)

And yeah, unfortunately, getting the AI to know how to use the ability to make movement requests is the big stumbling block to that particular idea. I think something like it is still necessary- none of this solves the fact that Civ A can prevent Civ B from attacking a City-State C by interposing friendly troops, so there still needs to be a way for the AI to notice that you're doing that. Among the other things the AI needs to improve at. ;)
 
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