OMG! They Killed Civilization !

Im not an "affraid of changes" person, Im not the “Windows XP was better” kind of person. (I love 7 BTW). I play civilization since -Civilization I- and there was A LOT of change since then, and I loved every change, CIV BTS was the best civ ever.
But somewhere, somebody thought "CIV IV is excellent, this product is best of its kind, we have assured sales for the next issue, let's just change for the sake of change, let there be a new engine, new mechanics, lets attract younger and newer audiences to grow our niche, but to our more than 10 year loyal followers who spread the word and play until today: Let them eat cake!, we want now simple mind players who dont want complications, nor lot of options or control, we just want them to buy the box and say mission accomplished to our investors. We are going to this by the book, we are going to offer what the sales manual says ! Cool graphics, ease of use, simplicity, fun. Voila! You just turned an “EMPIRE RULING SIMULATOR ” to a “JUST A GAME ”.

Btw it is not a fun game, I had not fun. Why?

Am I the only one who thinks this is a perfect way to kill a franchise? Sure is a good game and some people enjoy, but for how long until they get bored and play another game?

Please, don’t kill civilization. Build a game that stands the test of time.

I totally agree with everything you said.

I also played Civ 1 through 5 and I think 5 is the best so far.

Still it is your opinion, just know that not everyone agrees.

haha

"Can you build a game that stands the test of time"

MS should have bought Firaxis and made it an 'only on xbox' title

But yes I have the same feeling as you, but hey I get used to it.

There are still 2 games coming out soon, which ain't mainstream and not made by 'big money makers', which will be great fun (for me): il-2 Storm of War and Red Orchestra 2, had CIV on my list, but I was wrong on that 1 (which I could knew..).

_Mk_py said:

Build a game that stands the test of time.

Click to expand...

Isn't 2 week a little too short to judge that?

i like civ V - just last week i couldnt understand what ppl were complaining about, but i can already feel i'm getting a bit bored with the game. i have only played around 45 hours ... now thats not good.

i played civ IV for almost 2 years before i reallyu started to get bored with it. (part of the reason may have been that it was my first civ game ever)

I still think, there are lots of interesting changes, and maybe with a few patches and expansion packs it would be awsome.

Overall - i agree that civ V is a good game but as is, it's not a game i expect to be playing 2-3 months from now BUT i feel saying they killed the franchise is going too far.

BTW - simplifying is not the problem i see with the game. i like the simplifications, problem is the way AI behave, they far too eager and keen to go to war and they get their ass handed to them. Resulting in every game going down the same path, I.e. stupid AI declaring on you and then getting butt whooped, so you end up steam rolling everyone.

I think the AI needs more personality like the civ IV. gives more flavour to the game, rather than having a bunch of half wit AI who just want to DoW on you at the drop of a hat, not to mention DoW'ing each other. so it ends up becoming a silly tactical war game and nothing more.

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and btw, Civ5 isn't anti-matter to the Civ4's matter. This ain't one of those Harry Potter schemes, where in order for other to rise, the other must fall.

AND mayby they wan't to keep the new generation hooked on civ as well, luring them in with civ5 and then improving and making it more complex until they'll return to the basics again in Civ10, just to get a new generation of players to keep the franchise running.

And I'm outraged aswell that some people dare to like PURPLE, while I like RED! How dare they use RED to make PURPLE! RED was good, WHY MAKE IT PURPLE?

Dorkhan said:

AND mayby they wan't to keep the new generation hooked on civ as well, luring them in with civ5 and then improving and making it more complex until they'll return to the basics again in Civ10, just to get a new generation of players to keep the franchise running.

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That is ridiculous.. it's like saying they should make Civ a First Person Shooter because it will get the new generation, then go back to how Civ originally was at the 10th iteration. Whether or not the game mechanics are more complex or not doesn't mean much if the game feels rather shallow on the surface.

I don't think they intended to dumb it down, I really think the game was just unfinished. There are a lot of issues that are clearly issues they would've noticed, like 90% of buildings not even being worth building. Most likely there's something we don't know about that got the game rushed, or, and hopefully not this, they just made the mechanics and are leaving the actually gameplay to the mods.

_Mk_py said:

Im not an "affraid of changes" person, Im not the “Windows XP was better” kind of person. (I love 7 BTW). I play civilization since -Civilization I- and there was A LOT of change since then, and I loved every change, CIV BTS was the best civ ever.
But somewhere, somebody thought "CIV IV is excellent, this product is best of its kind, we have assured sales for the next issue, let's just change for the sake of change, let there be a new engine, new mechanics, lets attract younger and newer audiences to grow our niche, but to our more than 10 year loyal followers who spread the word and play until today: Let them eat cake!, we want now simple mind players who dont want complications, nor lot of options or control, we just want them to buy the box and say mission accomplished to our investors. We are going to this by the book, we are going to offer what the sales manual says ! Cool graphics, ease of use, simplicity, fun. Voila! You just turned an “EMPIRE RULING SIMULATOR ” to a “JUST A GAME ”.

Btw it is not a fun game, I had not fun. Why?

Am I the only one who thinks this is a perfect way to kill a franchise? Sure is a good game and some people enjoy, but for how long until they get bored and play another game?

Please, don’t kill civilization. Build a game that stands the test of time.

Click to expand...

I just registered to this forums to say:
I loled at this

EMPIRE RULING SIMULATOR

Click to expand...

Slowpoke said:

Most likely there's something we don't know about that got the game rushed

Click to expand...

Well what got it rushed is something we *do* know about, and that's they announced the release date and stuck to it regardless of how far they'd got through their to-do list. You can be sure that they have months and years of things they would/could have done, and will now work through them as patches.

This is totally standard practice in IT projects where I work too, and for good reason. We have to deliver *something* on time because the part we're working on is just a component in a larger web of dependencies. The only feasible way to do it is for people to work with our near-complete stuff, on time, rather than for them all to have to go through and reschedule all their work.

In a game the size of Civ 5 which has all the media tie ins and so on, not to mention all the different strands of development - gameplay, civilopedia, art, music, AI, ad infinitum, it would be impossible to keep shifting the date because one of them was running late (civilopedia team I'm looking at you...)

Whoever said "mid September 2010" a year ago should have said "mid January 2011". Haha, some hope. Timescales in game development are no doubt just as squeezed as I know they are in general IT. It's the 21st century world - it's the norm for everything to be done shoddily, everything rushed, few things are done with craftsmanship and love.

To be fair all the Firaxis and 2K people that have interacted with the community over the last few months come across as people who do care, and Civ 5 itself definitely "feels" like something that was built with the right spirit. So I do have faith the game will be polished up in time.

(Yay, second positive post of the day!)

I've "only" played 13hrs of CiV and so far I like it!
I can see it needing some iprovements here and there but it's still a great game
that takes on a new level of play compared to it's predecessor.

Give the game a few patches and maybe an expasion at some point and it will be amazing!

The exact thing happened with simcity societies but much worse, lets dumb it down and attract all the mainstream and simple minded people. No zones, lets just popup buildings, no complexity.

Regardless of how you feel about the 'core' Civ V game, it does seem a little odd to say that a game that has modding central to its design would not have longevity.

The mod tools will only continue to get more powerful - the C++ SDK isn't even out yet and by the time it is I'm sure the quirks with the art tool will be addressed.

To write off the game at this stage before anyone's really had a chance to write some truly game-changing mods seems, well, awfully premature.

And given how accessible mods are in Civ V, I'm sure they will receive an awful lot more exposure than in previous versions, which will only encourage more mods...

Catchy "shocking title" to grabb people's attention : /Check
Claims to have played Civ since Civ 1 : /Check
Same old same old : /Check
Post Count below 10 : /Check

What exactly makes this thread diffrent from the 100's of other "ZOMG CIV V SUXXORS" threads?

To answer simply : Welcome to Civilization 5, this is number 5! not 4+2 expansions.

The best you can do is either deal with the fact this is "not" Civ 4 but number 5 (hey counting is so cool! after 4 comes 5!)
Or simply go back to Civ 4 + 2 expansions (whichever you like best).

_Mk_py said:

Btw it is not a fun game, I had not fun. Why?

Am I the only one who thinks this is a perfect way to kill a franchise? Sure is a good game and some people enjoy, but for how long until they get bored and play another game?

Please, don’t kill civilization. Build a game that stands the test of time.

Click to expand...

I've also played every version of Civ since the beginning. I've played Civ5 for about a week. I loaded up CivIV BTS again tonight when I got home because I was more excited about playing another challenge in the RFC mod than I was about playing another game of Civ5.

I got bored, really quick. And that never happened with any of the previous versions of Civ, including Colonisation (which I know was a bit hokey compared with some editions).

JoxerNL said:

Catchy "shocking title" to grabb people's attention : /Check
Claims to have played Civ since Civ 1 : /Check
Same old same old : /Check
Post Count below 10 : /Check

Click to expand...

Is 2000+ posts enough for you then? This coming from someone who has made all of 15 posts...

To answer simply : Welcome to Civilization 5, this is number 5! not 4+2 expansions.

Click to expand...

Why, I never would have guessed. Moronic thing to post.

Or simply go back to Civ 4 + 2 expansions (whichever you like best).

Click to expand...

Which I did tonight. I think that says a lot.

No they didnt. It's a brand new game

I have to admit, when i first played Civ3, i went back to Civ2 for a while, and waited for expansions to fix the stuff i didnt like. Play the world was better, but the game was "perfected" at the time with the release of the 2nd expansion, Conquests.

Then Civ4 arrived, i didnt fancy all the changes at first, so i went back to Civ3 Conquests for a little while. (At this time i was also playing World of Warcraft, so waiting for expansions was not very hard). The game improved with Warlords, but was perfected with Beyond The Sword and patch 3.19.

I have no doubt that Civ5 will improve the same way both Civ3 and Civ4 did with their expansions, but the difference for ME is that I actually enjoy the changes, and I play the game as it is, rather than going back to BTS (I tried, got bored rather quickly).

Ofcourse, there is a lot of bugs and small fixes that needs to be sorted, but thats what you get when you set a deadline, and have to ship an unpolished products. My personal opinion is that it was well worth it though.

If i could change anything, it would be:

• Better AI (took me 3 days to win on Diety in Civ5, thats not HARD)

• Add Religions (found lots of related stuff in the XML's, they cant be far away)

• Fix the numerous bugs (Units on Explore missions could start to obey city state borders to name one, and the 5GPT diplomacy bug to name another)

civ 5 is easily the best civ game ever made