Mansa Musa Immortal Cookbook

kossin

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Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
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Location
Canada
Due to popular feeling, this game was scrapped. Feel free to play it out if you'd like but the next game can be found here:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=394550




Round 1
Save,Discussion and Playing (this post and below)
All submissions for voting (upcoming)

Round 2
Save,Discussion and Playing (upcoming)
All submissions for voting (upcoming)

Round 3
Save, Discussion and Playing (upcoming)
All submissions for voting (upcoming)

Round 4
Save, Discussion and Playing (upcoming)


The Immortal Cookbook is a concurrent succession game series to help readers learn how to play and win at Immortal level in Civilization 4: Beyond the Sword, v3.19

Some of you may be familiar with the previous Emperor Cookbook games. We decided to raise the level of difficulty to Immortal because we are always playing from the best save and we were often over engineering saves to make them more of a challenge. The difficulty should be approximately equal to Emperor level difficulty, if only slightly harder.

Our Immortal Cookbook game features Mansa Musa! We will be playing at Immortal difficulty, NORMAL speed, with a standard sized map. Huts and events are disabled for this game, as they tend to make things more random and it will make for better comparison.

Here is the info on our leader, his unique unit and building as well as our starting position and settings:

Leader
Spoiler :


Map type
Continent, no huts/events, other settings standard.

========

To keep the pace going, I've decided to make rounds last EXACTLY one week, from Wednesday to Wednesday. Here's the breakdown of it:

1-Each Wednesday the save will be posted.
2-Following the posting of the save, I will post some relevant information to the position as well as some suggestions, in spoilers.
3-Players are strongly encouraged to contribute their thoughts in spoilers as well, before reading the other spoilers. Half the work of Immortal is planning while the other half is playing it out :)
4-You can play whenever you want in the week although it might be best to wait for some discussion first - up to you. Round length will be 70/40/40/50s/end unless otherwise said.
5-Play the round and submit your save by Monday, 0h00 GMT. Late submissions will be accepted but you might not get as many comments/votes as otherwise.
6-Voting begins Monday, 0h00 GMT... review the saves and then post your votes and, preferably, why. If not enough votes are generated, I'll handpick the winning save :p


========

Roster:

YOU! - contributor, voter - our most important fixture, the readers who follow the threads and play along.

Now that we have upped the difficulty level, we will return to the 'best ball' system of selecting and playing saves. What this essentially means is that after we have completed each round, everyone will have a chance to vote on which save is in the best position. The winning save will be used for the next round.

If there is any player who is strong at Immortal+ level, it would be great to have you post your saves to show us how it's done. However, I request that any of you who realize your round was far superior remove your save from the voting. This rule is intended to ensure that the game doesn't get into a overly strong winning position after only a few rounds (because what fun is that? ).

Voting Rules:

1. You may NOT vote on your own save (but you are encouraged to state the strengths and weaknesses of your save).
2. For your vote to count as winning save you are expected to have voted for 3 other saves where possible. There is an element of fair play expected from those that vote and tactical voting is not allowed.
3. Only those who have posted a round may vote (those who are shadowing are always encouraged to express their opinion!)
4. Please don't vote on a save that has voluntarily been removed from the running by the person who submitted it.
5. At the end of each round you can vote on 3 saves for first, second and third place. I believe that these votes should be made publicly in order to allow for as much discussion as possible. I strongly encourage you to explain why you are voting for a particular save. This is one of the best ways to learn, and that's what this game is all about! If you feel uncomfortable voting publicly, PM me with your vote.

========

And now, about the map!

The map generator wasn't very kind this time around! I mean, really: I actually made your life easier on this one.... well yes and no - you'll have to find out ;)

Here's your starting area, with the settler selected to see the game's suggestions.


Hmm, no suggestion.

Round one will last one week and covers the first 70 turns.

We aren't Wednesday yet you might say... well it should give you some more time for deciding your mind on what to do!
 

Attachments

Well I clicked the glowing "settle city" button on the screenshot, so my subconscious mind obviously wants me to play!

Trust the warrior to be in the most useless position for turn 1 scouting :mad: Looks like a choice between 1N (noncoastal clam - jump for joy) or burn a turn to look for food east. Don't fancy the current position much if there's nothing in the fog.
 
Hi all, gonna give this a shot.

Warrior can't do much, has to be 1NW. Probably show nothing, settle 1N., or take gamble and SIP.
 
4000 BC - 1200 BC (70 turns)

Spoiler :

Moved the warrior 1NW, settled 1N. Researched Fishing - Bronze Working and build a worker to mine the gold first and then started chopping. First chop went into a workboat and then chopped/mined the hill after researching Sailing and continued to chop for the Great Lighthouse after Masonry. Finished the Great Lighthouse in 1720 BC.

Continued with Agri - AH and saw the need for Hunting - Archery and then went Pottery - Writing - Mysticism.

Whipped a settler and settled my 2nd city on the last turn near the rice/clams.

Had some trouble with barbs and needed to get warriors (4) and skirmishers (3) to spawn bust.

Tough map. I'm considering to go for Metal Casting next to try something different. Edit: could use a Great Merchant to bulb it.
 

Attachments

i'd move the settler to scout here, SW is probably not too bad, frees up the clams and isn't one off the coast, perhaps more food in the fog... if there's no food, one north to get the clams. if i just had time to play atm ... too bad. might shadow this later.
 
If you don't move the settler 1N to settle, it looks like the Clam will not be workable based on where the coastline seems to run. My inclination is to settle 1N. We know the start doesn't offer much food (thanks, kos!), which I interpret (perhaps mistakenly) to mean we can't make a major difference by moving around. Moving 1N1NE is another option to get the Clam, but losing the Gold sucks. Unless there is really good stuff W across the hills, it isn't worth it to go that far.
 
Oof, not pretty then. Looks like 1N for the clam is a no brainer. An extra unforested hill too - gives a bit of an option to skip BW for a while (not going to do much slavery with the capital that's for sure!)

FWIW the clam would be workable anyway, you can see the coast curve round again at the top of the fog.
 
Turn 0-70

Spoiler :
I moved warrior 1NW (found nothing, as suspeted) so settled 1N(Glad i didn't scout with settler). Started on worker whilst teching
Fishing>BW>Sailing>Mas>Hunting>AH>Archery>Not sure what was next. Mined gold and worked it in BFC while building WB.Got a couple of warriors out for fogbusting> chopped lighthouse>GLH, completed GLH at 1760BC. Barbs started coming in (alot) so whipped skirm then 2 pop whipped settler. Settled 2nd city at 1400BC, built another couple of skirms and a workboat in cap for 2nd city. Started on last skirm> turn 70.


[EDIT2] @ Fierabras

Spoiler :
We played very similair starts.
 

Attachments

bwahahaa, what fun you had making this one, Kossin :)

I tried it out, though im a marathon player :mischief:
My 70 turns is in spoiler
Spoiler :

I settled 1 n, worker first, while i teched fishing, then BW and chopped boat.
Warrior scouted around, killing a couple animals, got woodsman 1.
Decided to go heavy fogbusting and made 4 more warriors, they all got killed by barbs.:cry:
Therefore I teched for the UU, and got some out, while I had a settler going.
Wanted to settle at the cow/rice first since i didnt had IW, nor planned to tech that early.
Bad decicion !!
My Skirmisher got ambushed by a barbarcher, who almost killed him, I had 0,4 hp left when the battle was over. Ahh well, he could stand and heal, while my settler ran to the spot...........well, he could have, if it wasnt for a Barbarcher just spawned and ran towards him, well, my warrior with the Woody prom was standing there as well, hiding in the dense forest, np I thought
Bad decicion !!
First he killed my Skirm, even though he had healed to 2,7 hp, then he killed my fortified woody IN the forest, whereafter he followed my newly made road to my city spot, razing the city. :mad::mad::mad:
I know, I SHOULD have had my skirm healing in the city, but, I was in short supply of spawnbusters after the 4 warriorkills :mad:
Well, I limped on, getting a new settler out, this time settling the clam/rice site, all the while I got myself a guerilla 3 skirmisher from holding the Pass of Thermopylae there. Maaan those barbs came STREAMING, I thought ....hmm, was it raging barbs or what ?Nope, our lovely neighbor build the GW, whereafter he settled like a true champ, he had 7 cities :eek: when i closed the game at turn 70.
The worst part was
Spoiler :
No strategic resources, only the awkward placed iron, you can get by your 4th or something City. AND, our peaceloving neighbor has them all in a very short distance of hes Capitol, not that he intends to use them :)

SO, all in all, i will follow this from the shadows, this map is in over my head :lol:
I have ONE advice for you guys still going at it : make Skirmishers, a..LOT...of ...Skirmishers :D
 
@(Pro)Peanut_P

Spoiler :

Yes, very similar! We both made a very logical choice with this food poor map: Lighthouse .. and then might as well build The Great Lighthouse :)

TGL needs trade partners, so I guess you'll be sending a workboat up coast as well soon. Is there a reason you haven't opened borders yet?
 
Ok, I played till turn 70, but I haven't come up with a report. One question:

Spoiler :
Is The Great Lighthouse the only way to create a viable economy in this particular game? I'll get my save up soon: I did a lot more exploring, met a neighbor, and got a third city up - but lack the GLH...
 
A Coastal start, huh? I can guess which Wonder GKey will be beelining! ;)


I see the Warrior + Settler movements working out in the following ways:

a) If you think that you are likely to settle 1N for the Clam in our capital, then send the Warrior 1SW onto the GFor square. If you are not enticed by what you see, stick to your plan of moving 1N. If you are enticed, then move the Settler elsewhere.

b) If you think that you are likely to settle 1SW on the GFor Riv, then send the Warrior 1NW onto the Plains Hills square. Assuming that nothing amazing is revealed (such as a second Clam being N + N of the PCow Riv square), then stick with your plan of settling 1SW.

c) If you are thinking about settling in-place, then at least move the Warrior 1NW onto the Plains Hills square, to see if it is possible to use the Clam in a nearby City. If it isn't possible, then I suggest picking one of the other two settling locations, due to the claims of there being a low quantity of Food Resources being available to us. If it is possible to use the Clam with another City, then go ahead, settle in place--you might get lucky and receive a Grassland Copper or something in the fogged squares to the south that those who move the Settler 1N might miss out on.
 
Kossin, why did you not re-roll when it was apparent this was going to be another cow-glitched map?

A warning to others, not only is there the infamouse no-food bug for BFC in this start, but there's another bug where we are missing the guaranteed 3-hill minimum requirement by the normalizer. There's a few other things that seem wrong there too but that's the main couple that often break the early game.
 
Turn --> 70
Spoiler :

I had a little bit of bad luck in that even when defending in a forest my warrior almost died to a silly cat right away. Then after healing for a billion turns, I finally start to move and BAM, a bear kills me right after.

*Bang head on desk


So then with a little less fog-busting, and being blind early on, I had a few more problems with barb archers, etc. This messed up my optimal builds etc, but nothing to really cripple me.

Right now the capital is pretty decent, she has also a granary and barracks in place. The sister city will pop borders in 2 turns, and have a granary in 3 (I had to stall these due to emergency barb problems). I already have the WB to get my second clam up in 2 turns.

Scouting south is complete, and right now the plan is to grab a few more cut-off spots from Shaka. He has double my city count, but his power isn’t so great. If he dows on me I would slaughter him right now.

Tech wise I have all first tier techs, and I also have:
  • Pottery
  • Animal Husbandry
  • Archery
  • Bronze Working
  • Iron Working
  • Writing (turns)
t70x.jpg

 
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