Is Civ5 salvageable? Yes or No poll

Ok, the previous poll had a "perhaps" option that people were claiming was skewing the results. We'll re-do the poll this time with only yes or no choices. If you're not unsure or undecided, please go with the choice you feel you are 50% or more leaning towards.

This was the original thread:
For those who don't play the game anymore... Is Civ5 salvageable?

NOTE: this poll is only for people who have stopped playing Civ5. if you enjoy it and still play, please do not participate in this poll. also please refrain from coming in here to tell people the game does not need salvaging. read the previous thread and you will see.

Civ 5 sux, first post, your arguements are invalid
Moderator Action: Don't troll here.

I agree with that last guy, Civ 5 sux
Moderator Action: ...and don't spam..

I must say no. Civ5 is not meant to be mainstream, it is meant to be the niche TBS we expect it to be. It will never be complex due to the devs' oath to make it 'streamlined' and 1UPT - a system better for board games - does not have its place in an empire sim.

Yes, the Civ series really felt like an empire simulator, and a great one at that. I don't care about winning, I care about going from 4000 BC, watching my fellow civs rise and fall, and having a fun time. The fact that the AI and the game design do not allow me to experience this is bad enough.

Now 1UPT. It is ok if there are A LOT of tiles, in which case it would indeed conjure a more epic feel to the game. But alas, armies by the human player rarely exceed 50 (except with possibly ICS), and the board in Civ5 is clogged by AI overproduction. It might not be so bad if the AI were able to actually congeal their units into some reasonable front or system, but it does not, which makes the game not only easy but also tedious and boring. Even if the AI might improve over a few years, the number of tiles is too great to provide any reasonable gameplay proving that Civ5 is not salvageable.

I hate going through this coping process; I really wanted a good game. We all did. Wait a few years, let the developers procure a good AI capable of putting up a fight, reduce the completely outrageous system requirements for a TBS (another dent in the car crash), and make the game fun again.

It was a big step, but the devs went in the wrong direction.

It doesn't need salvaging. This is utterly ridiculous.

Revoran said:

It doesn't need salvaging. This is utterly ridiculous.

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read the original thread. this poll is not for you.

This poll is useless. Whether you answer yes or no, you're still admitting that Civ V is somehow 'broken' and needs salvaging. This is similar to the old childhood quip, "did your mother ever catch you playing with yourself in the closet?"...whether you answer yes or no is irrelevant, you're still admitting that you play with yourself.

By default this assumes Civ V is broken, and well it is certainly flawed, I'm not sure those flaws go beyond some of the flaws common to other Civ games. It's certainly in much better shape than the final versions of Civ I and Civ III. Many would argue its an improvement on Civ II, and some have even argued it improves on Civ IV.

I think the desired complexity is pretty easy to achieve through mods, and have no issue with the vanilla version of the game being more basic, streamlined and friendly to new players. My major concerns are that certain awkward things are very hard to modify.

charon2112 said:

This poll is useless. Whether you answer yes or no, you're still admitting that Civ V is somehow 'broken' and needs salvaging. This is similar to the old childhood quip, "did your mother ever catch you playing with yourself in the closet?"...whether you answer yes or no is irrelevant, you're still admitting that you play with yourself.

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It is okay charon2112. People mature at different rates. Masturbation and CivV sucking are facts of life everyone has to deal with at sometime in their life.
Moderator Action: This kind of spam is not wanted here.

Arsenic Steel said:

It is okay charon2112. People mature at different rates. Masturbation and CivV sucking are facts of life everyone has to deal with at sometime in their life.

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Nevertheless, my post is 100% accurate.

And here they come again, the newly discovered Torquemadas of civ0.5, ready to burn every infidel in their bonfires of civ0.5 onanism...

The OP clearly asked for you fanatics to stay out of this thread, yet you have to come and use your only tactic: destroy threads that don't idolize civ0.5.

Vade retro!

charon2112 said:

Nevertheless, my post is 100% accurate.

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Yet it does not pertain to this poll since the demographic the OP is after, just like his previous thread, are the denizens of CFC which do not play civV anymore because of various problems with the game.

Well, we are having breakthroughs in the modding department. The community is steadily developing some nice tools and discovering how to do certain things. It still needs some developer help, but it most definitely is salvageable. I'm working on an awesome Roman Empire mod right now which I can't wait to play.

ricardojahns said:

The OP clearly asked for you fanatics to stay out of this thread, yet you have to come and use your only tactic: destroy threads that don't idolize civ0.5.!

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It's only fair that it works both ways .

charon2112 said:

This poll is useless. Whether you answer yes or no, you're still admitting that Civ V is somehow 'broken' and needs salvaging.

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Did you even read the OP? This poll is clearly meant for those who do think Civ V is broken and needs fixing. It explicitly tells you not to vote if you enjoy Civ V. It is not assuming that everyone must think Civ V is broken, nor is it forcing you to "admit" anything. So stop hyperventilating over nothing.

I answered no.
I think the concept around Civ 5 allows it to mature into a new version, but not the current one. A bit (for me, I do not talk for others !!) what I felt with Civ 3 and then Civ 4 : a draft, then the achievement.

charon2112 said:

Nevertheless, my post is 100% accurate.

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The point is the thread is aiming to the players that are unsatisfied and stopped playing, which you are not.. It is stated by the OP and you are just spamming nonsense...

The answer is still no.

Even "defenders" of the game typically claim to be in favour of 1upt, and in the next sentence then say "If only there would be a 'bit' of stacking (like stacking workers, allowing units to cover the same hex during multi-turn movement and what not more)".
The developers are already changing the advertised course of diplomacy. In fact, by doing so they admit that their core ideas about the game don't work.

Civ5 is a still-born child and saving it means changing it into a game which maybe it should have been from the beginning on.
But the ideas behind the released version are badly thought through, have been proven to not working and in total restrict the gameplay in a way which makes even Civ1 look like an revelation of good, deep gameplay.

Akkon888 said:

Now 1UPT. It is ok if there are A LOT of tiles, in which case it would indeed conjure a more epic feel to the game. But alas, armies by the human player rarely exceed 50 (except with possibly ICS), and the board in Civ5 is clogged by AI overproduction. It might not be so bad if the AI were able to actually congeal their units into some reasonable front or system, but it does not, which makes the game not only easy but also tedious and boring. Even if the AI might improve over a few years, the number of tiles is too great to provide any reasonable gameplay proving that Civ5 is not salvageable.

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The problem is inherent to Civilization games: what you are fighting for is control of cities. Control of terrain is only a means to get you near cities.

Which in consequence means that having more units than needed to conquer a citiy is counter-productive in most cases.

The developers actually have proven to have no understanding of Civilization games. Therefore, their helpless attempts to push some ideas from other games into the framework of a Civilization game are so ridiculous.

Revoran said:

It doesn't need salvaging. This is utterly ridiculous.

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I agree.
A corpse no longer needs mouth-to-mouth reanimation.