Immortal University 60 - Pericles

Habitus

Habitus

Emperor
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
1,138
Location
UK
Greetings, Immortals and would-be Immortals (and indeed any other players of any level), and welcome to the Immortal University.

Here is our Leader:



Here's the opening scene:



I rolled with the following settings (note not the first start as we got a plains cow start on first :) )



AI Spoiler
Spoiler :
The AIs are in 3 teams of 2


In terms of updates, well nobody follows that anyway. Post in the manner you feel comfortable. Typical comparison dates are 1 AD, liberalism, and victory/defeat, as well as any major events. If in doubt, go with that.
 

Attachments

Another thing i like about on the Stone, all your water tiles will be resources, so no weak unimprovable water tiles, thou you might pick up a tundra 2E1S
 
1 NE is an interesting start position too. You loose one 1 extra hammer and a wood in the beginning, but you will get an oasis with an very fast boarder pop (creativ) and a mine on the stone will hurry up the workboat production sagnificantly.

I know that you waste some lands in the south, but just think about an alternate position.
 
From the SS: 1W the best choice for me (2 grains, 2 clams, + an high hammers producing stone in CFC).
- yatta
 
450 BC
Spoiler :
Teamed AIs, interesting :)

1E turns out to be a good idea, it gains grassland sheep in addition to the 3 hammer city tile. Opening with AH reveals nearby horses, and we have a close neighbor, so time for a horse archer rush. I skipped worker techs besides mining and wheel, got writing as my 4th tech and HBR as my 5th. Creative library scientists allow for a pretty early turn 57 HBR despite the lack of special commerce. A barb city spawned right in my face, so I grabbed it with my first few HAs while waiting for the rest to build.

War on wang lasted from turns 87 to 97. He had iron but not many units. I captured 6 cities, burned 2 of those (AI city placement fail), and lost one back to Saladin before buying peace.

Spoiler :
iu60_1.jpg

Spoiler :
iu60_2.jpg


Immediate priority, settle Copper Cows and Silver Beavers before Wang gets them, and get lots more workers to deal with all this unimproved land.

Everyone on the map can research Feudalism, and I'm sure Saladin is rushing there right now so he can enjoy his favorite hobby, spamming CG3 longbows. I'll probably just go liberalism -> cuirassiers and stomp the map that way.
 
@TMIT

Spoiler :
With the Teams I'm hoping 1) Harder for an AI to just give up or get land screwed, and 2) hoping to see how it effects tech trading due to you basically trading a tech to 2 civ for one trade's worth
 
So I'm thinking Ag/worker start settling on the stone. I guess another worker tech to follow to give the worker something to do? Or should it be a workboat start? I'm always rushing through the start so I'd like to see what an intelligent start can do for my game.
 
Wulf38 said:
450 BC
Spoiler :
Teamed AIs, interesting :)

1E turns out to be a good idea, it gains grassland sheep in addition to the 3 hammer city tile. Opening with AH reveals nearby horses, and we have a close neighbor, so time for a horse archer rush. I skipped worker techs besides mining and wheel, got writing as my 4th tech and HBR as my 5th. Creative library scientists allow for a pretty early turn 57 HBR despite the lack of special commerce. A barb city spawned right in my face, so I grabbed it with my first few HAs while waiting for the rest to build.

War on wang lasted from turns 87 to 97. He had iron but not many units. I captured 6 cities, burned 2 of those (AI city placement fail), and lost one back to Saladin before buying peace.

Everyone on the map can research Feudalism, and I'm sure Saladin is rushing there right now so he can enjoy his favorite hobby, spamming CG3 longbows. I'll probably just go liberalism -> cuirassiers and stomp the map that way.
Click to expand...

I played it the same way and have a question,

Spoiler :

got rid of Wang around the same time. My question is (and this seems always my problem with rather early rushes) - how do you recover in time after the rush? I limped to currency building research, but my bpt is still so low, I am not sure I will get MT/Cuirassiers early enough to stomp the AIs? As you can see in the second save, research is aweful and I am depending mostly on building wealth :sad:
 

Attachments

GenerallyGreat said:
So I'm thinking Ag/worker start settling on the stone. I guess another worker tech to follow to give the worker something to do? Or should it be a workboat start? I'm always rushing through the start so I'd like to see what an intelligent start can do for my game.
Click to expand...

I went workboat, worker then I think warrior, workboat. Teched Ag, Ah
275AD
Spoiler :

Civ4ScreenShot0040.jpg

I figured that a rush would be troublesome with AI partners and there seemed to be enough land available peacefully. (I have 8 cities) Tech trading for important techs was tough as the teams weren't really getting along and therefore hording. I had to tech Alphabet myself too which is weird. I won Music, bulbed Philo because nobody was trading it and then teched CS. It's later than I would've wanted but I'm switching to Caste now to gets some scientists up. I won't get the Pacifism bonus though as the religion situation is too tricky to adopt a religion. The only wonders I've built have been the Pyramids and Great Library. Great Wall would probably be a good play in this setting for the Great Spy.
 
1AD
Spoiler :

Settled on the stone. I decided to go with a peaceful start this time. I built the Mids and Hanging Gardens. As for economy, I hadn't built a single cottage and was relying on rep specialists entirely.

Civ4ScreenShot0308.jpg


Liberalism

Spoiler :
I abused fail gold from Stone wonders and launched a Golden age to farm some specialist (I got GS and GM as planned).
I finally got MT from Liberalism in 860.

Failgold.jpg


Civ4ScreenShot0310.jpg


1870 Diplomatic Victory

Spoiler :
I was expecting a blitzkrieg against Wang/Sal. Not gonna happen! It's sooo hard fighting vs 2 AI's at once. I even had to stop the war in the early 1300s as it was becoming a stalemate and they just wouldn't cap! They finally gave in after I cleaned Sal of the mainland and left Wang with couple of cities in the north. I think I had about 5x their power rating in the end of the war...

Roosy/Cyrus was a similar story. I massed about 40 cavalry at Rosy's border and declared. They got Rifling during the war so it became a huge grind and I was spamming units like crazy. Did I mention my war weariness vs. Wang/Sal? Well it was even worse here. I had to stop the war once again as they even got infantry(!!!) and tech for nukes. Nukes did the job pretty well, I completely destroyed Roosy and left Cyrus with 4 cities.

I built the UN in the meantime but I still lacked couple of votes. So I decided to nuke Genghis/Hammy on the turn the voting took place and suceeded:

Civ4ScreenShot0313.jpg


Huuuge grind...I'm glad it's over :lol:
 
Spoiler :

Liberalism after a brief stop at Guilds to speed up Taj Mahal.
Civ4ScreenShot0041.jpg

I took MT and followed up the Economics line for the merchant who I used with a scientist for an extra golden age then teched to rifling. I declared on team Saladin shortly after Khan did and took most of Korean cities before they capped to team Khan. They now have a team of 4 and 44% of population and land. The other alliance is useless and would fold 3-4 turns into any war with the superpower. I really didn't think a team of 2 would cap so easily and certainly not to a team that had done a lot less damage than me.
Civ4ScreenShot0042.jpg

Nothing else I can now but take on all 4 of them. I have biology so I'll whip my people to death and maybe do a bit of drafting. I have a spare GG so I'll make a superhero to defend against the masses. It's going to be like an always war game from here. :sad:
 
I like how NOBODY else

Spoiler :
Had Roosevelt + Cyrus declare on them 900 BC while rushing wang/sal


I'm so lucky.

Anyway, quit with a winning position around 1800 AD:

Spoiler :


Chariot rushed korea successfully; really didn't lose much either. After that roosevelt declared as I said above. I was able to fight that off and take a city off of each. I got out of war with sal by settling a city + giving it over for peace. Did the same thing with cyrus except gave him his own city I'd just taken back, netting me 1 extra city from their DoW. Very close to strike but I didn't.

From there Sal permanent ally vassaled to GK/Ham for a 3 AI team. I responded by swapping hindu (to give me only 1 risky front) and massed espionage on sal (using the city I gifted over and had culture pressed! Haha!) which, since the gayballs AI peacevassal'd him, they'd give him tech. I even moved my palace next to my steal target city; was getting around -75% modifier on espionage after stationary spy. Basically a theft cost me less than 1/2 the amount of espionage as the tech had in beaker cost easily. More like less than 1/3 IIRC after a while.

This vaulted me ahead of the roosevelt/cyrus alliance and I was even able to trade them some thefts. Meanwhile I had about 20% world land. Sal eventually broke free, only to see me use a combination of rifles, cavalry, and airships + spy help to beat him down (he never researched steel). During this war I flopped back into buddhism to win points with gk/hammurabi + have a strong AP presence. With over 30% of the world's land, GK/Ham hating on the other team and liking me, and carrying a small tech lead over the now-smaller roosevelt/cyrus team, I called it a game. Nobody but sal was near culture, nobody near space, and GK/Ham could always have been handled via nukes but it would have taken a while.

 
DanielTorrence said:
I played it the same way and have a question,
Spoiler :

got rid of Wang around the same time. My question is (and this seems always my problem with rather early rushes) - how do you recover in time after the rush? I limped to currency building research, but my bpt is still so low, I am not sure I will get MT/Cuirassiers early enough to stomp the AIs? As you can see in the second save, research is aweful and I am depending mostly on building wealth :sad:
Click to expand...

Spoiler :
Usually I can lib MT on immortal even after a rush. I started cottaging that floodplains city NE of the capitol during the rush, and moved Athens back to running scientists after I had enough HAs (it had an academy already because I used scientists to get HBR in the first place), so I got to currency before the war even ended. I was really behind in improvements after this rush because I quickly went from 3 to 8 cities with only 4 workers, so the new cities took a long time to get online. But it's nice to be Phi/Cre, because it's easy to hire scientists everywhere and farm more than enough GS to bulb philosophy and education.

Unfortunately it didn't work out as planned in this game. My research was just a bit too slow, and teamed Roosevelt/Cyrus researched much faster than I expected, so I was forced to lib nationalism instead of MT just to win the race. Still I got cuirassiers in time to take 6 of America's cities before they got magic rifles. I think I have enough cities and crippled the AI enough to be in a winning position at this point, but finishing this game is going to be a grind.
 
Wulf38 said:
Spoiler :


Unfortunately it didn't work out as planned in this game. My research was just a bit too slow, and teamed Roosevelt/Cyrus researched much faster than I expected, so I was forced to lib nationalism instead of MT just to win the race. Still I got cuirassiers in time to take 6 of America's cities before they got magic rifles. I think I have enough cities and crippled the AI enough to be in a winning position at this point, but finishing this game is going to be a grind.
Click to expand...

I totally agree,

Spoiler :

after I took out Wang I got declarations from Cyrus/Roosevelt repeatetly, so even my little research vanished, could not recover. Tried a different approach with Mids and Rep, that worked out better, I was able to lib Rifles, selfteched MT and went after Cyrus and Roosevelt, which had only Longbows and Muskets by that time.
Unfortunatly when Cyrus had only three cities left he pulled rifles, so I could not eliminate him. Vasselled him and went after Sal/Wang, which still had no rifles by that time and capitulated them. Then Cyrus broke free for whatever reason and vasselled to Gengis/Hammi. But the Gengis/Hammiblock was a monster by then, basically they formed one strong AI teching with 16 cities and I was still short of 5% land for domination by then. They had artillary and antitanks and I was not in the mood for this kind of grindhouse, so I resigned. Could have won probably in the late 1800s or early 1900s. It was still interesting to see that you can get enough research just with Rep, didnt build a single cottage, but after I started warring I was bleeding money bad for a long time. Good thing I had two GM for trade missions.
 
TheMeInTeam said:
I like how NOBODY else

Spoiler :
Had Roosevelt + Cyrus declare on them 900 BC while rushing wang/sal


I'm so lucky.
Click to expand...

Well, seems this is inevitable. In my attempt

Spoiler :

they attacked me shortly AFTER I finished rushing Wang, close to strike of course and with no real research. I gave up after that (tried couple of times to reload, with settling a blocking city, switching into their religion, but it happened over and over again). I quit and tried the Mids/expansion approach which worked great, libbed rifles, but I found it quite hard to keep up with Hammi and Genghis even with 22 cities. Hit industrialism in 1820, but by then Hammi had tanks as well and all the media wonders build. I am probably doing something wrong, AZ has usually tanks with this number of cities around 1700.
 
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