5 Most Fun & Addictive Leaders - 2012 Edition

Pick your 5 favorite leaders!

  • Alexander - Greece

    Votes: 4 12.1%

  • Askia - Songhai

    Votes: 4 12.1%

  • Augustus Caesar - Rome

    Votes: 7 21.2%

  • Bismark - Germany

    Votes: 5 15.2%

  • Catherine - Russia

    Votes: 9 27.3%

  • Darius - Persia

    Votes: 4 12.1%

  • Elizabeth - England

    Votes: 9 27.3%

  • Gandhi - India

    Votes: 5 15.2%

  • Genghis Khan - Mongolia

    Votes: 6 18.2%

  • Harald Bluetooth - Denmark

    Votes: 4 12.1%

  • Harun al-Rashid - Arabia

    Votes: 7 21.2%

  • Hiawatha - Iroquois

    Votes: 2 6.1%

  • Isabella - Spain

    Votes: 5 15.2%

  • Kamehameha - Polynesia

    Votes: 5 15.2%

  • Montezuma - Aztecs

    Votes: 5 15.2%

  • Napoleon - France

    Votes: 6 18.2%

  • Nebuchadnezzar - Babylon

    Votes: 6 18.2%

  • Oda Nobunaga - Japan

    Votes: 4 12.1%

  • Pachacuti - Incas

    Votes: 7 21.2%

  • Ramesses II - Egypt

    Votes: 11 33.3%

  • Ramkhamhaeng - Siam

    Votes: 3 9.1%

  • Sejong - Korea

    Votes: 3 9.1%

  • Suleiman - Ottomans

    Votes: 1 3.0%

  • Washington - America

    Votes: 11 33.3%

  • Wu Zetian - China

    Votes: 3 9.1%
  • Total voters
    33
  • Poll closed .
Thalassicus

Thalassicus

Bytes and Nibblers
Joined
Nov 9, 2005
Messages
11,057
Location
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Vote for 4 to 6 leaders you find most fun and addictive to play in the Vanilla Enhanced Mod! :goodjob:

It is not necessarily about buffs/nerfs or overpowered/underpowered. Fun and favorites are a more complex. If a leader simply had +50% production and nothing else, that'd be powerful, but probably not as fun as some cool bonus that changes gameplay in a more interesting way. I like characteristics that let us play differently instead of just better.
 
I'm playing my first England game in quite some time and Longbowmen are both powerful and fun. I'm still not sure if they're overpowered or not, but range 4 indirect fire longbows are terrific fun to play with.
 
Sejong is still brutally good. It is hard to lose with him.
Siam is still a BEAST at culture games, and again easymode.

I still find the Ottomans boring.
 
I was thinking about the Ottomans the other day and realized why they're boring.

attachment.php


The trait fits historically, is powerful, unique, and so on... but is on the far left on the fun meter. The best option is to fill any Ottoman specialist slot in all circumstances, so there's no decision-making involved. It's basically a boring passive +yields to cities based on development.

What if we split the German barb effect into land/sea versions, buff both, and put the sea version on Suleiman?
 
I say we get rid of the Artist and Merchant slots from EVERY Ottoman building and replace them all with Minister specialists that are 2:c5culture:2:c5gold: and produce a GP that can both culture bomb and do the merchant mission. The Improvement could use the Merchant graphic and be some manner of Ministry.

On top of that rather wishy washy ability, we add the unique Ottoman events which occur every time a Great Minister is born which allow us to choose some manner of policy for the city they come from.
 
Nope. The only aesthetic issue would be in the Civ selection screen where it might choose the wrong two uniques to appear. Given that mods like CCTP have close to quadruple vanilla buildings, I am quite positive if there is a cap on buildings, we are nowhere near it.
 
I think having an entirely new GP and Specialist as a UA for one civ is a bit much. Maybe something more along the lines of a UU replacement for one GP, ala Genghis, would be more appropriate? Or maybe every Specialist building increases the chance of a Great Person more than usual?

I do agree with black213 that having Suleiman related to Barbs would take a lot of the unique-ness away from Bismarck.

More on topic, Arabia is still my favourite Civ to play, as it has been from the beginning. Great fun trying to grab resources, his desert start always makes for interesting city development, and the extra gold is always good fun to play with.

Lizzie and Askia still have boring UA's in my opinion, Lizzies mainly being due to the ineptitude of the AI to use its navy well. Sejong is still easymode for science, and in my opinion, Monty's UA still completely lacks direction: The early culture gain, even when fully invested in honour, does not really aid that much with a conquest victory, which is what Monty should be geared towards.
 
Denmark is more oriented towards conquest culture, since the Jelling Stones give a large :c5culture: boost from each city captured. Monty's bonus focuses on the units.
 
I find it weird that Persia has only 0 votes. It's odd considering the somewhat recent big change to it's Satrap's Court and them getting a lot of votes previously.
 
Persia also still falls sadly under the Ottoman umbrella of civs that really don't force decisions upon you as the bonuses are either passive or simply force a style of play.
 
For the Ottomans, adding the sea part in a lowered form in addition to their governance bonus might be a solution and go back to vanilla. Many think, Bismarck is too strong anyways.

Otherwise, if you want a payoff, you could change the specialist bonus a bit: Every specialist gives +2 to his yield (or one more than atm, i'm not sure what that is), but also costs more food or money (the ottomans were famous for their gold problems, not)?

Ok, what about a combination: The ottoman specialists are better, so you want to fill every slot of them. But that's hard, because they cost gold for the Ottomans. To finance them, they need to wage constant war as their second ability gives them small amounts of money for killing units or they have to use the captured ships to pay for them.

That gives the player the challenge to balance the specialist with waging war. And since the two unique units of the Ottomans are war units, and one even has a pillaging bonus, they'd fit together more. Not sure what to do about Merchants though...

I don't like the Danes atm, I liked them better when their two unique units built upon each other...
 
I very much like the Danes at the moment, to be honest. Their unique wonder is one of the best alterations to a Civ that has been made in VEM, in my humble opinion.
 
Thalassicus said:
What if we split the German barb effect into land/sea versions, buff both, and put the sea version on Suleiman?
Click to expand...

I'm all in favor of this. I don't think it makes Germany problematically less unique - it's what vanilla has. The problem there was that it didn't deliver much. As is, Germany is very popular in MP. Having played them a lot in VEM, I can attest that the fleets may be even more fun than the army. Playing with a swarm of ships - which is what the Ottomans had with their galleys - could make them a blast to play with, and absolute killers when their UU's came around. If both countries were buffed as per Thal - maybe an automatic promotion? - I would be dying to play with the Ottomans. There would be nothing like it (the Germans can only have so many ships because their army is so huge).
 
Americans are alot of fun to play with the sight bonus, then the overpowered Musketmen with the recon promotion. If you have a barracks and an armory, then Musketmen can get the march (heal every turn) promotion immediately without Brandonburg gate.
English are fun with the fast water transport for all units, the Steam Plant, and of course those deadly longbows.
Both of these civs got 8 or 9 votes so far - no surprise there.
 
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