K-MOD Immortal Pangea

Yamps

Yamps

Deity
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
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Location
Zagreb, Croatia
I've been playing around with K-mod lately and decided to share a game here. K-mod has improved AI, you can find more details in this thread: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=10094243

In my experience from two Emperor games, it builds more units and researches faster. Also it's not so prone to suicide stacks at bad odds. Your neighbor is likely to attack you if you're weak even though he is at war already. Taking a vassal doesn't average relations anymore, yay for that. There are many more subtle changes to the game, best to check the change log.

The settings for this game:

Surry of the Khmer on standard Pangea:

Spoiler :

f7e9b1fa202cd25fe69e3d137cad4034a25e3ae4583425ac55ea92c4933a4fe66g.jpg



Start:

Spoiler :

85183b9faaac320f1f558988fe0d1ea7ee15f66aa88592994d24243ad450c9996g.jpg


Surry is Creative and Expansive. Cheap workers, libraries and granaries. Starting techs are Huning and Mining. The GLH looks interesting here, but note that it costs 300 hammers instead of 200.



I've already started playing, I'll be looking forward to your shadow games. :)

Download link for K-mod: http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=16331
 

Attachments

This might be quite hard. Depending on who neighbors are, it has a small chance of being harder than standard deity, because if a warmonger AI gets it into his head that he wants to choke it's going to be very hard not to get slowed down too much.
 
TheMeInTeam said:
This might be quite hard. Depending on who neighbors are, it has a small chance of being harder than standard deity, because if a warmonger AI gets it into his head that he wants to choke it's going to be very hard not to get slowed down too much.
Click to expand...

I have found Kmod Deity is near impossible for that reason. At least for me.
 
If i get chance I'll shadow, Immortal K-Mod is about 50/50 for me so should be fun :)
 
Out of curiosity, does IMM and deity gets the same bonuses as BUG (BTS unmodified gameplay). If not, I think this is making the game way unfair.
Deity gets to another new level...return of CivIII SID level. :lol:

I really hope Karadoc softened the AI bonuses.
 
Tachywaxon said:
Out of curiosity, does IMM and deity gets the same bonuses as BUG (BTS unmodified gameplay). If not, I think this is making the game way unfair.
Deity gets to another new level...return of CivIII SID level. :lol:

I really hope Karadoc softened the AI bonuses.
Click to expand...

I asked Karadac that question and the answer was he did not change the bonus'.
 
T1 3960BC and starting tech discussion:

Spoiler :
56222fb3abcd5d699c6c4c78c253865ca457c4ebe63891d9cbc02bd43474fd126g.jpg


I opted for the plains hill. Yum, another food resource! :yumyum:

3393fa0e7aefec817c488408ec0280a0a396b70979f567f6a2b9bf677ef33ab36g.jpg


Now, why is a there a warrior in the queue? :huh: The first three techs I want here are Agriculture, Fishing and BW. It takes 10 turns for Agri, 7 turns for Fishing and 17 turns for BW, at the current rate. Agri->BW and worker first would leave the worker with nothing to do for many turns. And I'd like to have Fishing earlier. Agri->Fishing has he same problem with idle worker. Therefore, Fishing->Agri->BW. No need to build the worker just yet in this opening. Growing to size 2 while waiting for Fishing, warrior->WB.

 
1160 BC

Spoiler :

27b88c46d7c1d025e2b630765f1c5b8541371fd1fa5b426f740deabbadbf5fc96g.jpg


So, Fishing->Agri->BW->Archery (expecting trouble ;))->AH->Wheel->
Sailing->Masonry

Attempted the late GLH and lost it. 4 cities settled, 5th one on the way for the island spot. Time to finish Writing with the 72 fail gold from GLH. Only settlers, workers and archers thus far. Neighbors are Genghis Khan to the west and Joao to the southwest.



The war begins, 200BC:

Spoiler :

728513f1f6ce8f7427fe5e0916a332042d7cc433476bb5e07f376b324fe3e61e6g.jpg


And so comes Genghis Khan, as expected. After the war with Joao, he needs another target. Note that there's no war fist notification in K-mod, you have to check manually. Also, you can't see how many cities they have, not in the trade screen either.

Tech path after Writing was HBR -> Alpha (partial, trade)->IW, Pottery (trade) -> Mathematics (partial, trade) -> researching Construction.

I was lucky to grab the late Pyramids in 425BC, running Representation. I wasn't planning on building them, but the AI didn't go for it so I chopped them rapidly instead of getting just some wealth. Research to HBR was from scientists in all cities. After that, I shut down research and whipped infrastructure while waiting the AI for Math.


Current situation, 150AD:

Spoiler :

a1dcb0132c829f1586e4b7a9679c1c20802fbed93b55b04b3bfc39669df8a1cb6g.jpg


180e7d1b38c3ce8605af732b20b82ed20ffa77e6f0cfee7890d84cc9ca3488af6g.jpg


c47bc68fac7696ea3236acb13b627dda1101a99f7e55c2a5e62c9f3a2641ff196g.jpg


The AI is much smarter tactically. Genghis Khan didn't attack my border city, he'd lose if he did since it was heavily reinforced. Instead, he moved around and pillaged. He also put my other cities to risk and disrupted my lines of reinforcement. Things got pretty scary a few turns ago when another stack entered my land. So, with some ~25 units moving around, I payed for peace with Currency.

Time to regroup and to keep mass whipping catapults. Overflow to axes and swords. Genghis also has war elephants, this is not going to be easy at all. I'm planning a switch to Buddhism to get Joao to Pleased, possibly we'll fight Genghis together later on. It's all or nothing here, I have to move in with 15+ or better yet ~20 catapults + supporting units.



T150 AD save attached, so you can chip in with some comments. This is a live save, I haven't played further. Next set tomorrow. :)
 

Attachments

Good luck ;)
Btw, you can re-enable some notifications in the BUG-Options (ESC -> BUG-Options). Display number of (known) AI cities is definitely in there, although I have not found the war fist yet. Karadoc just set the "vanilla" options as default.
 
That tech picture + #cities with said tech picture looks pretty dismal for immortal, especially since in kmod the AI can plot on people it has a peace deal with so khan might be eyeing you again already.

You can probably survive it if you sell out, but how will you keep up with Joao and Darius in tech rate? I'll be very interested to see if you can pull it out. If you do, definitely tell us how, because when I find myself in these kinds of positions I usually lose. Maybe if GK declares on someone else you can try to follow him and snipe the cities he targets yourself?
 
K.Murx said:
Good luck ;)
Btw, you can re-enable some notifications in the BUG-Options (ESC -> BUG-Options). Display number of (known) AI cities is definitely in there, although I have not found the war fist yet. Karadoc just set the "vanilla" options as default.
Click to expand...

Ah, I missed that option. Still, it's not possible to see the cities in the trade screen anymore if the AI isn't willing to trade them. Therefore the scoreboard indicator only shows the numbers for those cities that you actually see on the map.


TheMeInTeam said:
That tech picture + #cities with said tech picture looks pretty dismal for immortal, especially since in kmod the AI can plot on people it has a peace deal with so khan might be eyeing you again already.

You can probably survive it if you sell out, but how will you keep up with Joao and Darius in tech rate? I'll be very interested to see if you can pull it out. If you do, definitely tell us how, because when I find myself in these kinds of positions I usually lose. Maybe if GK declares on someone else you can try to follow him and snipe the cities he targets yourself?
Click to expand...

GK can't be left unchecked, he'd be too dangerous otherwise. I've played a bit further, pulling out of the box.

475 AD:

Spoiler :

So, I kept whipping until my finances couldn't support it anymore. While GK was busy in the southwest with Joao...payback time comes from the east! :viking:

f1a3062a74ceccb8e5abafea407f86bd13d86648ac7eb3235ef2fc573c1760286g.jpg


1095dd8949451479edd703fefeb7d0a9895c13f89e125188361fb4b84a00543c6g.jpg


I had to put my cities to build wealth not to go broke. Some research coming from Rep scientists.




700 AD
Spoiler :


07a9a0ef181de7bf14bc25767453afbd4ad88255592209e98ce744761f435bb36g.jpg


GK had some forces going for Joao, but he still had a big stack back home. Also, he got to Feudalism the turn after I attacked. :( No turning back though. His city was lightly defended and I took it. I set up a stack killing zone there, allowing him to retake his empty city a few times only to lose it again after CR bombardment. He lost around ~30 units there, with very few losses of my own. When he had enough, I pushed forward for the next city.

Next target is Beshbalik, I need those war elephants on my side.



Current tech situation:
Spoiler :

29d059c1e36ef032693d22e10a8604349f4f0553b50190d4bda720433c25a3e86g.jpg


My tech path after Consruction->Currency was CoL->MC (partial, trade)->Meditation->Priesthood-> Poly+Monarchy (trade) -> bulb Philo

I've just traded Philosophy away for Feudalism to see if GK would capitulate. No just yet. He's still in war with Joao. I could stop that war to prevent possible cap to Joao for the price of Philo, but I guess that Joao might DoW him on the next turn like in normal civ. I have to think about it some more.

I'm researching Compass atm. I had a backdoor plan to bulb Machinery, but I should get that in trade. I also have to trade for Aesthetics to clear the bulb line, if I decide to get Machinery that way. I won't be going for Liberalism here. I just need those phants and Engineering for trebs to push more to the west. My biggest problem is economy, but with GK's cities I'll recover. Hmm, maybe I should switch to Caste now to farm the GM for cash.

5a7645e349d2e6e563c73a0229c68edf4d489eb1da41cfc1c3a6b34d40d4ed216g.jpg


d6d054501c75ad636a0baef0c0c6c2f28e645cc8900cc51550fe7aa39685cfd26g.jpg


The AI tech pace doesn't feel too fast. They are warring a lot and I haven't traded with tech leaders so far.

 
Yamps said:
1120 BC
Spoiler :

27b88c46d7c1d025e2b630765f1c5b8541371fd1fa5b426f740deabbadbf5fc96g.jpg


So, Fishing->Agri->BW->Archery (expecting trouble ;))->AH->Wheel->
Sailing->Masonry

Attempted the late GLH and lost it. 4 cities settled, 5th one on the way for the island spot. Time to finish Writing with the 72 fail gold from GLH. Only settlers, workers and archers thus far. Neighbors are Genghis Khan to the west and Joao to the southwest.

Click to expand...

Why didn't you try to settle a city by the river? (by the wet rice)
IMHO agriculture was a mistake, you want to work the seafood for commerce anyway -- faster start to go fishing-bw-archery.

Will have a look at this mod, it sounds promising.
 
Rusten said:
Why didn't you try to settle a city by the river? (by the wet rice)
IMHO agriculture was a mistake, you want to work the seafood for commerce anyway -- faster start to go fishing-bw-archery.

Will have a look at this mod, it sounds promising.
Click to expand...

Spoiler :

Rice is too close to GK, I couldn't defend there.

I'm not sure if you're right about skipping Agriculture. My first settler went north and got to use the capital's corn immediately. The western stone city also needs it for wheat.
 
Yamps said:
Spoiler :

Rice is too close to GK, I couldn't defend there.

I'm not sure if you're right about skipping Agriculture. My first settler went north and got to use the capital's corn immediately. The western stone city also needs it for wheat.
Click to expand...

Spoiler :
Yeah, should work if you get a quick settler and settle the safe city without fogbusting.
I got some archers and went west for my 1st city -- had agriculture the turn I settled wheat.

Rice city felt defendable to me, but I'll never know for sure seeing as GK went for Joao in my game.

Was supposed to be a shadow, but not much point comparing now seeing as GK didn't attack.
 
Rusten said:
Spoiler :
Yeah, should work if you get a quick settler and settle the safe city without fogbusting.
I got some archers and went west for my 1st city -- had agriculture the turn I settled wheat.

Rice city felt defendable to me, but I'll never know for sure seeing as GK went for Joao in my game.

Was supposed to be a shadow, but not much point comparing now seeing as GK didn't attack.
Click to expand...

Spoiler :
^Heh, in my game Genghis went for Joao first as well, he came after me while in peace treaty with Joao.
 
1000 AD, 10 cities:

Spoiler :


Genghis is almost defeated, down to two cities. Joao is already marching towards his capital with a big stack of trebs and supporting units.

b7ce0e4ef1a5a6548a01a029f46a494cbed2feb6af28382c755a1dc48caa44f56g.jpg


Closer look:

eb5d6daacf8b6971d129816bbac24cd80a1ac9d0bc3b76790af1182e3a13d4d36g.jpg


My cities are small because of all the whips and I also have some scientists hired to get some research. You can see some war elephants marching, got them in a trade:

924542caa94637cba1a5ed396b1b52c1496e473d37856ed8e4b22b4f17be436c6g.jpg


Lol, should have done this much earlier. I have my own source now so I'll cancel this trade.

14eaa8e9914309c1762fcc27f09873430d6f2598dc7abce43f6ba4cff5ea01e86g.jpg


Mostly outdated units, but they did they job.

Diplo:

ce49113e47ef55cfb37d136970deaa6e472bd47bf18cfa4700cbc4a4c4dd38916g.jpg


I'm worried about Joao here. Normally he doesn't attack at Pleased, but this is K-mod so I don't know. With GK out and him being friendly with Darius, I might become his natural target.

Tech:

e62d21cc0993e97b464736e623ae62bb4126d8f156694c65ed7f06cd3bca01da6g.jpg


F9:

2fb98399fca31dbf3d018cb82d90edcb741fb77292ac13908640b46d973ffc366g.jpg


As expected, still a difficult situation. I'm not sure how to proceed from this point. I was hopping for a GE on 40% chances to bulb Engineering but I got a 60% GS instead. My economy is weak and the AI is ahead. The big issue is Joao, am I safe from him or not? I still feel that my best bet here is to use sneaky treb war tactics: lose a city on purpose and destroy the AI stack with CR bombardment.



Live save attached. :) I'd be interested to hear some comments on how to proceed from this point.
 

Attachments

Farm everything, suck up to everyone and hope for a Diplo win? I don't really see you taking on Joao - Ghengis was fighting a two-front war, and you barely won.

Btw., some AI's can now declare at friendly. Although karadoc has not specified which...
 
Htadus said:
Nice progress Yamps, BTW doesn't Joao become your natural target next? :p :)
Click to expand...

Hehe, yes he does. :)

K.Murx said:
Farm everything, suck up to everyone and hope for a Diplo win? I don't really see you taking on Joao - Ghengis was fighting a two-front war, and you barely won.

Btw., some AI's can now declare at friendly. Although t karadoc has not specified which...
Click to expand...

Nah, I'll play for conquest or domination. ;)

The AI is still weak against siege. It's possible to trap their entire stack in some city with CR, it's much easier after that. It was tough against GK, yes, but that's early in the game. My biggest problem there was that I had to stop building troops and build wealth not to go broke. It's easier with a larger empire.


Short recapitulation:

I started a golden age with my GS after some city growth and switched to caste to farm GM. This move got me 2 GM. Good luck there, ~70% and ~50% due to GS pollution. On the military side, I took peace with GK when I saw that Joao is about to take his capital. He gave his last city plus Drama and Theology. :mischief: On the next turn, it's Mongolia eliminated. I gave that city to Joao as a gift, being paranoid about him. Also, a tactical beg while I prepare:

Spoiler :
3d6fd96d99b9e7ad868428de271ef10bc8787b513e72ebac712997739e30b0476g.jpg


Overview:

Spoiler :

9f025196e016a435982fe2f80aa50ae8264a18c9e51f0c4092c772273d32e2636g.jpg



Funny thing happened, Louis took Karakorum from Joao through AP! I didn't expect that. Karakorum had French religion and somehow got a lot of French culture. Also, the French DoW Darius. The city was a sitting duck and mutual war bonus is good to get Darius to friendly eventually so I took Karakorum after all, hehe. :) Louis will use the AP to get it back though, not sure if I should actually bother with missionaries to prevent that.

Diplo:

Spoiler :

9e5efece184ae1f28089a418696ec0010e3451869b0da12d7e113113395286706g.jpg



I switched to HR + Theocracy at the end of my golden age. Joao is friendly now and he's only cautious towards Louis because he took Karakorum. Hopefully that's enough for him not to make trouble before I'm ready!


Tactical situation:
Spoiler :

f1b072adb1f93c58a398a900b8ca28db8b265010603a7e391edc3bf8b48b46716g.jpg


I'll have the trade route gold on the next turn to upgrade those units. Also, I'll switch back to slavery for massive whipping. I need ~15 trebs + ~15 more elephants to get going again. The plan is to sneak attack Joao from Persia and to remove his stack on the first turn. I'll also flank his cities through Persian land.


Tech situation:

Spoiler :

b96a1c6a55ba629d72cb4d50d1fb7fdd8e117ab2e42ba5ff37aef6c3db4ff9c76g.jpg


Louis just got Nationalism from Liberalism. There's not much time left before they get to Rifling, I have to hurry to cap Joao before that.

 

Attachments

Rusten said:
Why didn't you try to settle a city by the river? (by the wet rice)
Click to expand...
That city would have been a disaster. The culture modifications would have driven that city to build only culture buildings. From the moment you settle that city would have had some Mongol culture. You do not get any culture benefits even within the inner 9 tiles.

Yamps said:
Spoiler :

Rice is too close to GK, I couldn't defend there.

I'm not sure if you're right about skipping Agriculture. My first settler went north and got to use the capital's corn immediately. The western stone city also needs it for wheat.
Click to expand...

I think fishing would have been better too for the commerce gain.
 
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