More Pantheon Beliefs!

[OmniPotent42]

I find the current selection of Pantheon beliefs too limiting and almost as much of a gamble as Spain's UA. I really don't like the ones that are specific to resources (like the one that grants +1 and +1 for every gold and silver). I've probably used that belief once.

I think pantheons should be more about tile improvements than the actual resource provided. There aren't any beliefs that enhance bronze or salt luxury resources. I would work out a pantheon belief to be like this:
+1 and +1 per mine on a luxury resource.

Other ideas welcome in this thread.

[Gucumatz]

+1 culture and +1 faith is op compared to the other pantheons out there or at the very least too copyish.

Why not God of the Earth: Hills take 50% less culture to expand to. + 1 gold when worked.

God of Merchants: The further a city is from the capital (and connected) gives it a percentage modifier to gold and faith. (1-10% gold, 2-12% faith)

Order of Chaos :: Razing cities provides faith and double gold.

Mortuary Cults :: For every citizen growth - add + 1 faith base production to the city.

Exiles of Return :: Allied city states produce missionaries every so many turns for you

Return of the dead :: Units killed in your territory have a chance(10%) of respawning nearby your nearest cities.

[OmniPotent42]

Return of the dead? 0.O

[Gucumatz]

What you no like ? Plenty of civs/early civs had interesting afterlife beliefs. If you want to make it more modern call it zombieism

[Gucumatz]

If I wanted too, I could come up with a hundred different ideas for additional Religion concepts. I don't think its really needed too much though as the system is mostly fine as is in my opinion.

A new concept like disease is what I personally favor.

[OmniPotent42]

I guess this thread has a misleading tile...it was more about fixing the situational pantheon beliefs to be more inclusive, or to create other beliefs that would prove to be useful in certain situations.

[extract]

You might try this mod, it may or may not be what you're looking for.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfile...s/?id=89101638

[Dentalfury]

Originally Posted by Gucumatz

+1 culture and +1 faith is op compared to the other pantheons out there or at the very least too copyish.

Why not God of the Earth: Hills take 50% less culture to expand to. + 1 gold when worked.

God of Merchants: The further a city is from the capital (and connected) gives it a percentage modifier to gold and faith. (1-10% gold, 2-12% faith)

Order of Chaos :: Razing cities provides faith and double gold.

Mortuary Cults :: For every citizen growth - add + 1 faith base production to the city.

Exiles of Return :: Allied city states produce missionaries every so many turns for you

Return of the dead :: Units killed in your territory have a chance(10%) of respawning nearby your nearest cities.

I agree that the +1 Culture/Faith bonus might be a bit over the top.

As for your concepts, they all seem interesting.

However,

God of the Earth: Hills take 50% less culture to expand to. + 1 gold when worked. (I'd do one or the other, seems OP if you had both. Imagine getting this on a Highlands map)

God of Merchants: The further a city is from the capital (and connected) gives it a percentage modifier to gold and faith. (1-10% gold, 2-12% faith) (Same thing, should pick one or the other)

Order of Chaos :: Razing cities provides faith and double gold. (Sounds fine, doesn't happen often enough to be abused. Imagine if Attila picked this up!)

Mortuary Cults :: For every citizen growth - add + 1 faith base production to the city.
(Might be OP as well, I'd change it to be a 1 time +10 Faith when you experience pop growth. Maybe even a -10 Faith for Starvation for balancing)

Exiles of Return :: Allied city states produce missionaries every so many turns for you (Seems interesting, can't see how it would be OP so long as they obviously follow your religion. Imagine if the CS in question actually sent the missionaries out for you!)

Return of the dead :: Units killed in your territory have a chance(10%) of respawning nearby your nearest cities. (Lol, sounds OP. Funny though, all I could imagine was the ghost army from LOTR. I would make it a 10% chance to survive a "killing blow" or even a 10% chance of a slight auto heal per turn with a cool down built in.)

Here are a few thoughts of mine,

Spirit of Peace - Your cities generate passive faith for as long as your not at war. Must have met other Civs and been at peace for x amount of turns. Bonus grows over time.

Carnival of Life - Your cities generate bonus faith whenever they experience a "We love the King Day".

Idolatry - Your cities are 20% more resistant to foreign religions.

[Lordleoz]

God of Wisdom: Shrines and temples each grants one and one scientist specialist slot.

[sukritact]

Exiles of Return :: Allied city states produce missionaries every so many turns for you

Wouldn't this be better as a Founder or Enhancer belief? Otherwise, it's difficult to determine what religion the missionary should spread. And then we could call it Sainthood or something.

Anyway, more pantheon beliefs:

Demigods: ranged and melee units receive +5% combat strength

Mythical Beasts: Mounted units receive +10% combat strength

Sacred Legends: +10% combat strength on friendly territory until the Renaissance era

God of Justice: Courthouses produce +1 Culture and +1 Faith

God of Wisdom: Scientific buildings produce +1 Culture

Goddess of the Arts: Cultural Buildings produce +1 Faith

Goddess of Agriculture: +3 faith in cities with at least 3 farms

God of Riches: +1 Faith on mines

God-King/Imperial Cult: Each Citizen in the Capital produces +1 Faith

[sukritact]

Originally Posted by Lordleoz

God of Wisdom: Shrines and temples each grants one and one scientist specialist slot.

Well, that was coincidental... Almost at the same time...

[Lordleoz]

Originally Posted by OmniPotent42

I find the current selection of Pantheon beliefs too limiting and almost as much of a gamble as Spain's UA. I really don't like the ones that are specific to resources (like the one that grants +1 and +1 for every gold and silver). I've probably used that belief once.

I think pantheons should be more about tile improvements than the actual resource provided. There aren't any beliefs that enhance bronze or salt luxury resources. I would work out a pantheon belief to be like this:
+1 and +1 per mine on a luxury resource.

Other ideas welcome in this thread.

Although I seldom adopt beliefs that are specific to resources, I found that those beliefs are nice and make the game more balanced. Also, Spain's UA won't be a gamble if you use it properly.

[Naokaukodem]

So much penny pitching in all that... Very exciting...

[Gucumatz]

Your right - Return of the Exiled probably should be named Sainthood and be a follower/enhancer belief.

Idolatry would work/be interesting but - would it fight your own religion?

As for Imperial Cult I love it - I think there need to be more beliefs/benefits for tall empires in general. If Goddess of the Arts ever came to be - I would think they would need to improve the culture rates on follower beliefs of amphitheaters

Goddess of Agriculture is an intriguing idea - But perhaps make it so that it requires that 3 farms are worked to get the faith.
-----

Other Ideas:

Cult of Doomsday: All units take damage within 3 tiles of city (15 Damage) when at war.

Elemental Worship: +1 Food base in city

Dark Magic: May cause a loss of last promotion earned when you attack

Wraiths of Pestilence: When attacking may cause disease promotion (10% chance). Disease causes -10 hp per turn and spreads to friendly adjacent units at end of turn.

God of Frost: Units produced in these cities gain promotion: Razing a tile turns the terrain beneath to snow

Feeding the Gods: Farms improve tile by +1 faith rather than +1 food (Subsequent technologies improve faith yield - not food).

Sacred Connections: 10% Faith generation for you and your friend, when signing a declaration of friendship

Center of the World: When another city grows - 20% chance it raises Capital's population rather than that city's.

[Gucumatz]

What is penny pitching? - Not familiar with the expression

[awesome]

it's a phrase that basically means that someone doesn't spend very much money because they're stingy, so it basically doesn't fit into this thread at all, unless he's suggesting that the bonuses are weak, but pantheon beliefs aren't supposed to be very strong because of what they are. it's like saying that warriors should be as strong as swordsmen.

anyway:
holy mountain: +1 faith and +1 happiness from mountains

[Dentalfury]

Originally Posted by Gucumatz

Idolatry would work/be interesting but - would it fight your own religion?

I imagined it as resisting foreign religions (Going back to the Ten Commandments story). Your own religion would not be affected. It's sort of a gamble though because the bonus would be entirely useless if you don't end up getting a religion yourself.

Cult of Doomsday seems way OP though. Would make cities even harder to take than they already are (Especially before later era units). Maybe tone down the damage and impose a limit of 2-3 units per turn.

I could re-imagine the bonus as Spirit of Resistance - Your people do not yield to conquerors, -10hp to enemy units when within 3 tiles if your cities. Limit 3 units at a time per city.

Wraiths of Pestilence would make for an interesting way to make your units more threatening. Especially to battle-hardened Civs.

The rest seem pretty interesting.

[isnorden]

I could use a few more beliefs for the Nordic modpack project I'm working on; the Idolatry belief fits the sagas' description of Swedes as incorrigibly pagan. To adapt the idea to more religions, though, I might rename it as Tenacious Faith; there are plenty of monotheists who resist conversion too!

[Gucumatz]

Originally Posted by Dentalfury

I imagined it as resisting foreign religions (Going back to the Ten Commandments story). Your own religion would not be affected. It's sort of a gamble though because the bonus would be entirely useless if you don't end up getting a religion yourself.

Cult of Doomsday seems way OP though. Would make cities even harder to take than they already are (Especially before later era units). Maybe tone down the damage and impose a limit of 2-3 units per turn.

I could re-imagine the bonus as Spirit of Resistance - Your people do not yield to conquerors, -10hp to enemy units when within 3 tiles if your cities. Limit 3 units at a time per city.

Wraiths of Pestilence would make for an interesting way to make your units more threatening. Especially to battle-hardened Civs.

The rest seem pretty interesting.

The thing with Cult of Doomsday - I envisioned it would damage everything and everyone at war around that city. Including Defenders. Meaning it ought to draw battle/war away from the city. Tactically retreating behind the city has to be done carefully because one will take damage. It would be a highly mixed bag pantheon the way I am envisioning it.

[Naokaukodem]

Originally Posted by awesome

it's a phrase that basically means that someone doesn't spend very much money because they're stingy, so it basically doesn't fit into this thread at all, unless he's suggesting that the bonuses are weak, but pantheon beliefs aren't supposed to be very strong because of what they are. it's like saying that warriors should be as strong as swordsmen.

anyway:
holy mountain: +1 faith and +1 happiness from mountains

I'm indeed not fond of "very small bonuses to keep the so-called game balance", I prefer much more the big effects of Civ2 wonders. Other than that, I don't have God and Kings and I don't care.

I'm just amused how people can entertain themselves with so petty things when they could come up with groundbreaking or inventive ideas. (and a little pissed off too, I admit)