Is BNW a success? The true test.

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bpower

Chieftain
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Sep 18, 2011
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Have you found yourself finishing off more games than before, especially loading up that save in the late game rather than start a new game? How about playing on even when it looks hopeless?

I've been finishing more games for sure.I think the main reasons are late game politics and wars, tourism/culture cant be ignored and is a lot of fun.

So how about you, has BNW succeeded at its stated aims, making the end game more complelling?
 
I actually haven't been finishing my games. Mostly because I have limited time to play, and still haven't tried all the new things yet. I will end up playing games to the finish, after I've explored everything there is first (still haven't played some new civs...)
 
Yes, yes, and yes. BNW is an enormous success in my mind, mostly because I no longer feel the game is over before industrial. The runaway and snowballing problems of all previous Civ version have been addressed in interesting ways.

I am finally having some games with a competitive modern era, which is just awesome. It's more difficult to just slam dunk your lead into an obvious victory, and more plausible to orchestrate a comeback.
 
I agree with the OP. I've finished all of my BNW games, because the game winner is still in doubt until the late game now.
 
Culture/tourism infographics have really sucked me in. And theming bonus' too. And I just learned how to grow a semi-wide semi-tall empire (use no growth option!). Civ 5 is the game I continually fall back on whence I get bored of my other games (COH2 is on of them; bought it a few days ago and it pales in comparison to the depth of Civ 5 design).
 
I finish perhaps 1 out of 5 or something now. It used to be 0. I like the BNW exp.
 
I know I am loving it. I find myslef still hurrying to do this or that in the 1900's!! Good stuff and it feels like a real Civ builder now rather than just a war game that has civs in it.
 
I seldom finish any games. It hasn't changed since vanilla. The only difference is when I abandon my games. I used to do it much earlier and usually around the middle of industrial era the game was resolved. I'm slightly beyond this point in my current game and Shoshone is giving me serious trouble by befriending many city states. To top that, my allies who owe me their existence as I defended them against Huns, denounced me even though we had perfect green-carpet relationships. Strange. I'm about to launch an offensive against chief Annoying Ass and if I succeed, the game will be resolved. This will happen before the end of modern era.

tl;dr
My games go 1-1,5 eras longer.
 
My problems with not finishing games is not to do with BNW itself but more to do with my fussiness over just the right map and situation - if my suspension of disbelief is affected by some glitch (I use many, many mods) I tend to dump the whole thing and start over. I also shoot myself in the foot by playing huge/giant maps on epic so I tend to get frustrated with the slow development of things. All these issues are my own doing, for the most part. But I do love the game and keep coming back to it. And there is hope - some new BNW TSL maps have just come out that may keep the juices flowing, and faster too, so I keep on starting new games and see what happens. So is it a success? Yes, BNW is a success, and I intend to keep it on my HD until Civ 6 comes out.
 
I still experience some endgame tedium. Diplomatic victory, in particular, seems to be very much decided when I'm the first to get ideologies like Treaty Organization - and then it's just beelining to information era to unlock the Master of Orion vote...

Of course, this means I should increase my difficulty level, but King used to be more challenging than this in G&K!
 
The middle/late game is a lot more fun with World Congress/UN.

Ideologies is interesting. AI can either take it very seriously and DoW you as soon as you adopt a different ideology (usually when you are a weak third-rate power) or they tolerate you (if you're stronger).

I'm very satisfied. bugs/issues aside.
 
Culture and diplomatic are much, much better. They are completely different now that the former systems seem really bland and simplistic. Technology victories are still the same which I don't have a problem with, but domination victories right now are ruined. Overall it's still superior to G+K
 
I actually dislike science victory. It feels like the "leftover victory" now, and is a bit like old cultural victory - just wait and turtle and wait and turtle until the spaceship is ready. Culture victory and diplomatic victories force the player to adapt a lot, if someone else is also pursuing them with much effort, but science victory is just... boring.
 
VainoValkea said:
I actually dislike science victory. It feels like the "leftover victory" now, and is a bit like old cultural victory - just wait and turtle and wait and turtle until the spaceship is ready. Culture victory and diplomatic victories force the player to adapt a lot, if someone else is also pursuing them with much effort, but science victory is just... boring.
Click to expand...
Yeah, it really does need a similar update where it gets its own unique system like tourism. Simply spamming science buildings and building spaceship parts has no depth.
 
I guess I'll be the dissenting voice but at this point, I have more or less lost interest in playing again.

I like all of the new concepts and units and whatnot, but the AI is just completely passive in my experience.

In 5 games (4 on King, my G&K level and 1 on Emperor) I was not ONCE attacked. Not one time. Little to no army, telling everyone to bugger off for many things, voting against them in the Congress and cruising to easy Diplo or Science wins and nothing...not even a measly declaration of war to kill off my (unprotected) trade.

So that has taken the fun/challenge/interest out of the game for me to the point where I don't even feel like firing it up again. :/

I truly hope they identify and patch a bug with this (soon!) because I can't imagine that this is the intended behavior or if it is, they solidly removed all interest from at least the first 100-200 turns of the game.

In any case, IMO, BNW is a conceptual success, but so far, a failure for execution when it comes to the AI.
 
poopfeast420 said:
Yeah, it really does need a similar update where it gets its own unique system like tourism. Simply spamming science buildings and building spaceship parts has no depth.
Click to expand...

It does have some burden of history though - getting a spaceship to Alpha Centauri has remained, with only minor alterations, a VC in all Civilization games. Even if it's a boring system that needs to be brought up-to-date, there's going to be resistance to the changes anyway.
 
I have been finishing off way more games than before. I used to get to a certain point and then quit because "well, I won". Now there's a lot of uncertainty and the ability to switch strategies even late into the game if it's not going to work. It's rekindled by Civilization addiction and shows no signs of stopping.
 
bpower said:
Have you found yourself finishing off more games than before, especially loading up that save in the late game rather than start a new game? How about playing on even when it looks hopeless?

I've been finishing more games for sure.I think the main reasons are late game politics and wars, tourism/culture cant be ignored and is a lot of fun.

So how about you, has BNW succeeded at its stated aims, making the end game more complelling?
Click to expand...

I've finished couple of marathon games with BNW so yes, it's been a massive success with me :D
 
I finished most of my pre-BNW games but I find I'm invested longer and would agree that the winner isn't clear cut nearly as early now. particularly because of Ideologies, I find the game flips on its head in late eras. Also WC has played out very differently in all my games so far (admittedly only like 5 cause my games are longer)... about the only thing I haven't seen from it is a Civ boycott.
 
Uncle_Joe said:
In 5 games (4 on King, my G&K level and 1 on Emperor) I was not ONCE attacked. Not one time. Little to no army, telling everyone to bugger off for many things, voting against them in the Congress and cruising to easy Diplo or Science wins and nothing...not even a measly declaration of war to kill off my (unprotected) trade.
Click to expand...

Oh, I know what you're talking about. This isn't really the case, by my experience - the problem is not that the AI won't attack... more like the peaceful AI's are too passive, while the warmonger AIs are not worth co-operating with at all. It feels like the "schizophrenic" AI has been replaced with two depressingly predictable extremes - those who WILL declare war on you and those who WON'T.

Even the peaceful AI's should pursue their victory through military means when they have the opportunity (a culture giant with no army, for example).
 
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