Nobles' Club 142: Hatshepsut of Egypt

Pangaea

Pangaea

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The Nobles' Club series started out as a way for Noble-level (and below) players to improve their game. Most of the original participants now play at much higher levels, so this has become a way for advanced players to help others learn to play better. You can play your own game at any level and with any mod, but it would be nice to comment on the games of other players and give them advice.

Our next leader is Hatshepsut of Egypt, whom we last played in NC XCII; we last played the Egyptians under Ramesses II in NC CXXIV. The Egyptians start with The Wheel and Agriculture.
  • Traits: Hatshepsut is Spiritual and Creative. SPI means no anarchy when changing religions or civics (easier diplo), and double production speed of Temples (and Cristo Redentor, but don't go there). CRE gives +2:culture: for every city (meaning you don't have to worry about getting resources in the inner ring), and double production speed of Library, Theatre and Colosseum (especially the cheap library is nice early on).
  • The UB: The Obelisk, a Monument that can turn 2 Citizens into Priests.

  • The UU: The War Chariot, a Chariot with 5:strength: instead of 4, which is Immune to First Strikes. A fantastic rushing unit...

And the start:

Spoiler map details :
Continents, with random opponent AIs.
Spoiler edits :
No edits were made.
Finally, a cut and paste of our standard doctrine:The WB-saves are attached (zipped; they are bigger than standard saves). To play, simply download and unzip it into your BTS/Saves/WorldBuilder folder. Start the game, and load your favorite MOD (if you use one, if not, check out the BUG MOD), select "Play Scenario", and look for "NC 142 Hatshepsut Noble" (or Monarch, etc., for higher levels). You can play with your favorite MOD at the Level and Speed of your choice. From Quick-Warlord to Marathon-Deity, all are welcome! We stuck with the name "Nobles' Club" because it has a cool ring to it.
Spoiler what's up with specific difficulties :
In each scenario file you can select your level of difficulty, but that doesn't give the AI the right bonus techs by itself. Use the Noble save for all levels at and below Noble. The Monarch save gives all the AI Archery. Emperor adds Hunting; Immortal adds Agriculture; Deity adds The Wheel.

For players on Monarch or above, you should add archery as a tech for the barbarians (if you don't, the AI will capture their cities very early). This cannot be done in the WB save file and must be done in WorldBuilder as follows:
Spoiler how to add techs to the barbarians :

  1. Zoom in all the way so you can't see the rest of the map.
  2. Use the CTRL-W key (or the menu) to enter the WorldBuilder. Avoid looking at the mini-map in the lower right corner.
  3. By default you're in "player" mode (look in the box in the upper right; the icon that looks like a person should be selected). You'll get a drop down menu labelled with your leader's name. Barbarians are at the bottom, so cover the rest of the list with your hand if you don't want to see who else is on the map. Select "Barbarians".
  4. Select the "Technologies" tab in the box on the left.
  5. Find Archery (the arrow head icon; 8th row, 3rd column from the right) and click it.
  6. Exit the WorldBuilder.
  7. Zoom out again after the map fades, and start playing.
Spoiler huts and events :
Note: The standard saves have no huts and have events turned off. If you want tribal villages and random events, choose the saves with "Huts" in their names. If you want huts but no events, select the Huts saves and use Custom Scenario to turn on the option that suppresses events.
 

Attachments

  • NC 142 Hatshepsut.zip
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Reserved.

(Hopefully everything above turned out allright, but if not, give me a shout.)
 
That's a crazy good start in my opinion, keeping in mind that there will be horses nearby as this is noble's club. Warrior NW, SIP if nothing exciting revealed. Tech AH for pigs, find horses, hook them up and whip/chop a ton of war chariots. Then we are in cottage heaven for later game.

Production a bit low with only 2 hills visible, but who knows what goodies hide in the fog.
 
So far with NZ here SIP. I'll give this a shot on Monarch nhne. I'm still feeling down after losing with Augustus (I mean come on). If there is agi food where I settle then mine>BW, otherwise AH first. Standard worker opener. Depending on scouting I'll either war chariot rush someone or chop out Oracle.
 
3 riverside hills that all appear to be green. One suspiciously unforested, also 2 unforested tiles to the southwest. Maybe copper, maybe horses. This is a perfect bureau capital start.
 
can't ever go wrong with Hatchet
 
Prince / NHNE / Marathon 2060BC

Spoiler :
Izzy's dead, 1 turn quicker than Suleiman last time :)

Founded Hinduism and Judaism in Thebes as well as building the Great Wall and Stonehenge. Now to expand - loads of great sites to choose from as well, cracker of a map!
 
Immortal/Normal/No hut/events/or espionage

SIP. Upon a little scouting I've decided with an opening tech order of Hunt > AH > Min > Wrt > Alpha > Math > Currency > CoL > CS (projected to be very early) > Aesth > Lit > Music.

@ Noble
Spoiler :
Izzy's dead in my game too ^^. At 1120 BC I've got 6 cities (7 workers), 1st GS half way done, tech leader with Whl/Agr/Myst/Min/BW/Pot/Wrt/Alpha/Math/IW and saving gold as we speak for when I get my Academy (Currency soon). Should get CS w/out Oracle before 500 BC. Looks like enough land to grab 20+ cities and conquer another 20+.
 
Such green forested flatland starts are those I usually struggle with. That's why I'll go Monarch/Normal/NHNE. Not many other options here but to SiP.
 
17 riverside tiles! That's an amazing starting position :)
 
rfcfanatic said:
Such green forested flatland starts are those I usually struggle with.
Click to expand...

ha..no offense rfc, but many of your comments around here are just completely opposite of the way I think about the game. I guess your a casual player anyway, but let us know if you want to up your game.:)

anyway...this map is

Spoiler :
redonkulously good...I mean crazy freakin' spectacular and I'm not just talkin' about the start. I'm teching Edu in the BCs with 12 to 14 cities (forget) with GPs coming in all over...and so much more good land to settle. have to figure out what I want to do though. Guess I'll go kill some more
 
2 east.
Can see the edge of 2 hammer hill, helping you jumpstart everything else.
 
Monarch / NHNE / Marathon 1860 BC

Spoiler :
Settled 1 NW for the Ivories. Teching order was Pottery > AH > Mining > Bronze working > Myst. > Med. > Priesthood >Writing.Next one will be hunting. I'm currently trying to build Oracle. Managed to rush Izzy, who had found buddhism. I have only three cities as of now, but after Oracle I'll settle more.
 
I love playing Hatty. In fact so much I normally have to limit myself or I'd play her all the time.

I normally play Monarch, but as this looks such a good start I'm going to try at Emperor level.

Spoiler :
Moved warrior 1NW and couldn't see any reason not to SIP. After SIP the start looks even better with the river corn!

Will do standard first build of Worker/warriors.

Teching AH for the pigs and to find those all important horses for war chariots. Then beeline BW to get chopping/whipping. Then pottery unless map show some strong reason otherwise.
 
Immortal/Normal/NHNE 1800BC.

Spoiler :
SIP, went AH->Hunting->Mining-BW->Pottery->Writing. Stole a worker from Izzy then killed her with War Chariots. Now just a case of worker/settler spamming whilst getting to Currency.
 
immortal/normal 600BCish
Spoiler :

SIP, double gold, horses, *WC, oracle->MC, CoL, IW, *settlers.

1 WC can pillage and stall an AI. I sent 3 WC scouts out and held the northern AIs to 3 cities each. Since Dom looks possible I took everyone out. Hopefully this works.


 
Monarch / NHNE / Marathon 1502 AD Domination victory

Spoiler :
I capitulated everyone except Zara Yagob, who had already acquired Oromo warriors. Luckily I didn't have to fight him.

The map was quite easy and had two easily rushable opponets. I didn't have any real problems, expect for barbarians, who were a real annoyance (I usually play without barbarians and haven't properly learned how to deal with them).
 
1AD Monarch nenh normal

Spoiler :
After wiping out Isabella I've settled into building up my empire. I made a few misplays since I forgot I was spiritual on civic swapping but doing ok. I CS slingshot mid 1000s. Now I'm trying to grab up the remaining land.

Two questions: 1) should I steamroll my continent or settle in for culture and if so when should I attack Vic?

2) Where would people suggest putting my epics? Wall Street will obviously go in Madrid (double holy city)
 

Attachments

  • Marasai NC 141 Augustus AD-0001.CivBeyondSwordSave
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1675 AD Domination victory (Monarch/Normal/NHNE)
Spoiler :
Spoiler screenshot :
Score:
Spoiler score :
Izzy was very close for a War Chariot rush and so I did it after I had settled 3 cities. Once Izzy was gone, I noticed there were no other AI closeby enough for another War Chariot (or HA) rush. Instead, there was a lot of land to settle. By 1 AD I controlled 10 cities (have to admit that checking Lymond's spoiler motivated me to set a higher goal than the usual 8 :p Although I was far away from teching Education in the BC times :p). Before going into the war mode again around 1400 AD, I had settled 17 cities. Plus some 3 cities captured from barbs.

After 1400 AD it was basically just a Cuirspam.
Spoiler statistics :
Spoiler power graph :
Didn't even need to use Slavery to get the Cuir army produced. The sheer number of cities and a series of golden ages did the job. I have a question - is it useful to whip when you can produce a Cuir in 4-5 turns in most of your cities and when your cities pop is well above 10?

I hoped to deal with Victoria once I had finished with Hammurabi, but she declared on me a turn after I had declared on Hammurabi (she was bribed in by Hammurabi I guess). Nevertheless, I had enough Cuirs to deal with both of them at once. By 1580 AD I had cleared my continent of all AI rivals. Meanwhile I had prepared a bunch of Galleons for another continent. I chose Alex as my target in order to reach the Domination limit.

The bureaucratic capitol Thebes turned out better than I expected. Some 600+ beakers (golden age though):
Spoiler Thebes :
Other cities:
Spoiler top 5 cities and wonders :
Madrid had some good production so I used it for building a bunch of wonders. I actually do find some benefits in Divine Right. Both wonders it provides are helpful for funding a large empire.

Finally, an overview of civics:
Spoiler civics :

Pangaea, thanks for the great map!
 

Attachments

  • NC 142 Hatshepsut AD-1675.CivBeyondSwordSave
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