TSG87 After Action thread

leif erikson · Jun 1, 2014

Welcome to the TSG87 After Action Report thread. In this thread you can post the results of your game. Please state victory date and score (preferably in the post title), as recorded in the Hall of Fame, and the most important: your path to glory!

STOP - Please do not continue reading this thread until you have completed and submitted your game.

Please use the Civ5 game submission page to submit your final, first play through, .Civ5Save file, saved AFTER the victory ceremony if you were not conquered (using the "Lemme play one more turn" feature.).

- How did you use spying to your advantage?
- Did the map type help or hinder victory and how?
- How did the difficulty level affect your game decisions?
- How did you take advantage of the advanced start?
- What did you learn from your defeat, should you be defeated?
- How long did your game last?

Players are encouraged to provide feedback on the game. Some players like to replay the game, and although we will not record the results from a replay, you can still post your new experiences (please state if the game is a replay). Please refrain from posting videos until the deadline for submission is over.

Would be interested to hear any thoughts on game setup.

Acken · Jun 1, 2014

Finished in 71 turns (so turn 396). Slightly better than my 2 test wins on similar settings so I'm happy with that result.

Spoiler :

Army wise:
So after first conquest on turn 371 it took me 25 to kill everybody else with XCOM stealth bombers and missile cruiser.
Since this is a continent map, being able to move around felt massively important making XCOM, planes and ships my go to strategy rather than trying to rely on artillery and tanks. I lost very little time going from one enemy to the next. Only annoyance was that on this specific map stealth bomber couldn't shoot from one continent to the next so I lost a bit of time until ship get there to give me a city and then get a new base for bombers.

My unit creation plan was relatively simple: Make some artillery until paratroopers, then mass paratroopers. Once Rocketery is researched upgrade artillery and start conquering. Add bombers as oil allows. Once rocketery is done, I go for robotics and XCOM. Once robotics are researched I usually have enough artillery and paratroopers to start my first conquest. I then make 6 missile cruiser and a destroyer. Then I complete with planes. XCOM usually comes not long after so I upgrade and go for stealth bombers. Since I attack late, the AI has anti-air so at that stage I prefer to rely on rocket, XCOM and missile cruiser. Then I usually get stealth bombers soon.

So I killed Gengis first and this army went down to kill China. Meanwhile missile cruiser are ready and take out Assyria. I then proceed to send the cruisers to Shaka. Meanwhile my second navy goes for Rome. Both fall easily to ships and paradroped XCOM. I use Shaka cities to relocate bombers. I will sadly lose 6 of them near the end to Rome atomic bomb.

Then I plan to finish as fast as possible by skipping Songhai and Egypt cities/armies and simply focus on taking their capitals and take them on the same turn. So with spies I'm able to bombard their capitals and paradrop XCOMs. I nuke Gao 3 times and then paradrop, I then just pray for the XCOM to survive the turn (was VERY close to cost me more turns for Egypt). They do survive and with a very careful usage of bombers to clear the way I take both cities and win.

Policies:
I started with exploration, 4 points in it. I did not take treasure fleet because in the early game I use 3 cargos into food and 3 into gold, so I do not feel 12gpt would be better than rationalism opener.
I also take rationalism opener. Since my strategy is mostly based on rushing science, the opener and secularism make a huge difference. By the way, food cargos are required to be able to use the scientist slots. Around 15turns into the game I'm able to take secularism due to the added culture from exploration and it's the same time I'm able to make specialists.
After that I go into autocracy. I was able to get 8 autocracy policies total this game. At tier 2 I take XP first, more ressource second and finally the happiness. Obviously tier 3 I get the damage boost.

I got all these policies by doing the following. First I have with exploration a bonus to culture of 4, allowing to get secularism exactly at the right time. Then I use most of my gold in the 50turns to ally cultural CS, which was perfect for this map since there were a lot of them. I got 3 in this game and 2 for most of the game.
Then I got 2 free policies. One with Prora, which helps tremendously with the happiness anyway and the other by getting silver in the world fair. Since I have CS allies early I'm always able to propose the fair, then mid game when it begins it costs only 2 turns in capital to get silver medal for a free policy. World Fair got me the damage boost from autocracy which started approximately after I killed China.
For Prora, I use a great engineer. I always start by running a specialist engineer, making it come 20 or 22 turns into the game and in all my test I always got it easily.
I also run the Writer's Guild and bulb culture. On grassland starts I was able to run the artist guild too but not here.

While that game ddn't have an annoying culture runaway creating unrest (since many used Autocracy). This plan usually makes my culture high enough to never get more that a little unhappiness due to ideology differences.

Science:
Around the time I get secularism I'm able to get a 7th cargos which goes to the capital to be able to run 3 scientists and later 4. Once of the expansions also run 3. The purpose is to get 2 Great scientists as fast as I can to make XCOM come sooner.
I usually get them a little sooner but in that game Genghis forced me to get extra units.

I use Oxford for plastics but build a lab only in capital, it's usually enough I prefer the expansions to start unit spam.

Politics:

I was a little afraid at first to get double DOW since I was the only autocracy guy surrounded by Order warmongers. But only Genghis came and like I said in the other thread I just defended waiting for rocket artillery. I bribed him to DoW China but he still attacked me. Assyria also DoW me but appart from a lonely ship that pillaged 3 of my trade routes I did not see him.
Once Genghis dead I was able to make peace with Assyria and he gave me a bit of gold. My ships arrived exactly 10turns later to DoW him again. I finished China completely since they had completed the Appolo program and I feared they might finish it if I let them live.
Meanwhile I just bribe people on the other continent to do whatever I can to weaken them all. Askia almost killed Zulus and Rome and Egypt were in a back and forth war around Memphis.

China completed Appolo early so I wiped her completely but let live Assur and Genghis with only one city. Only Askia started to chain the different part in the end, he got 3 at the turn of victory.

- How did you use spying to your advantage?
Visibility for XCOM and Bombers, stole a couple techs and killed a few spies at home.
- Did the map type help or hinder victory and how?
N/A
- How did the difficulty level affect your game decisions?
Didn't really believe in my ability to fight fast enough unless I had a good tech advantage
- How did you take advantage of the advanced start?
Already explained in opener thread
- What did you learn from your defeat, should you be defeated?
N/A
- How long did your game last?
71 turns

TheGrumpyBuddha · Jun 2, 2014

Turn 76 victory -- would have been 4 or 5 turns earlier except Egypt took Askia's capital -- and for some reason I thought when I took Thebes, I would get credit for it. Didn't the game work that way before?

Sloppy warring on my part but whaddya gonna do? Unlike Acken I went with a strat that involved not building any units at all until I reached X-Coms/missile cruisers, but that was easy to do because my buddies had Order. I threw a couple nukes around for fun and overall things went quite quickly, only real delay was at the end taking care of Thebes and then Gao (ugh!). Had to get stealth bombers over to Rome, a better player would have sent 3-4 Rocket Artillery to hang out north of Thebes, would have gone much faster.

Didn't really use the SP much other than the early Order boost, but no regrets there. After the free GS and GE (from the Kremlin free SP, I think) I took the Exploration opener and then the +3 prod. Didn't bother with culture otherwise, but didn't really need to. CS bribes/spying was for additional AL and to keep CS's out of my way during invasions.

Wish I had remembered to use Oxford, too! Best war play with my late war strat, a turn 65'ish win was absolutely possible. Assuming my social policy choice and non-war play wasn't optimal (i.e., it was wiser to start fighting earlier) ... is someone going to post a pre-60?!

EDIT: Wait, missile cruisers can carry nukes?! That makes a lot of sense. Yeah, I am guessing pre-60 is doable! Would have cut some turns off of rome/egypt.

DrakenKin · Jun 2, 2014

TSG87 IMMORTAL BISMARK MODERN START

Strategy : Hit early and hit hard, but a bit more interesting approach than arty zerg spam, which is probably the most stable strategy but after 2 tests run with it, i want to go a different direction and keep things interesting. I will be going very early air domination with ground support, which i hope will give a more original approach to beating this challenge.

Policy wise, the theme here is strategic resources, lots of them. In my 2 short test runs what was the biggest pain was the lack of key ressources, this time no room for luck! We shall be prepared. For this reason (and other synergies) we go third alternative (double resources) and up the patronage tree up to cultural diplomacy, which make CS give you double resources too. If we get some coil, and enough aluminum / oil / uranium all should go smoothly.

Build order and research :

Spoiler :

Build capital: Ironworks331, circus maximus334, (bought 2 workers at 70 gold each), NC, all XP buildings, auqueduct -> Military units for first attack.
Wonders :
* Pentagon, turn 375. (Before upgrading most arty to rockets.)
* Hubble space telescope, turn 383. 4 turns to make, 2 free scientists, adds hammers to city. Yes sir we'll take that, thank you very much.

Other cities: cargo ships, 4 for food, 2 for CS/money.
Research: Flight. Railroads. Ballistics. Replaceable parts(spy). Refrigeration(spy). Electronics. Radar(oxford). Combined arms. Rocketry. Satellites (for hubble's 2 scientists + jump to information era). Robotics(spy). Atomics theory + nuclear fission from 2 scientists. I see now where the uranium is, i raze cities that don't have it.

Manned the markets in all cities, goal is 3 merchants fairly soon.
We settle 3rd city in 5 tile range of AI capital (Genghis), since oil is available i am thinking early GW.bomber warfare, something I haven't tried in my 2 test runs but have been thinking about earlier today.

2 spies on 2 cultural CS (they are close for merchant too!), with consulate i will friend them ASAP at no cost. 3rd spy on first AI I meet, hoping to steal replaceable parts.

Culture :
3 points into autocracy (mobilization, espionage, total war) and 2 into patronage (consulates).
6th policy turn 345, philanthropy.
7th turn 354 elite forces. At this point i have 3 cultural CS allies.
8th policy turn 361 third alternative. I have 4 cultural allies.
9th policy turn 368, closing authocracy with clausewitz legacy. 25% damage to all military for 50 turns.
10th policy turn 376, scholastisism, getting +54 science from city states for a total of 263b (that's quite enough, overdoing science would be a mistake here).
11th turn 379 (yes, 3 turns after, i am in golden age triggered by world's fair, but 2nd place so no 100% culture unfortunately.), finally we get to the meat of it : cultural diplomacy, double resources and happiness from city states. That gave us 13 happiness, and we now have at least 20 extra of each resource. At this point we have 10 city states allies, and we could have more if shaka didn't go patronage and keep staging successful coups. Shaka, i shaka fist at you! :gripe:

12th policy turn 384, exploration opener, good timing, we just conquered our continent and are about to move to the other continent with the fleet.

Logic behind the patronage choice :

Spoiler :

Patronage is for allying cultural CS ASAP. Because your culture will be around 14, while a cultural CS gives 26. Allying them fast will :

* Give you more policies than you would get any other way. In my test runs i get at least 15 policies total. So you end up with the same policies you would have chosen without patronage, just delayed, and with all the benefits of patronage on top. It gives you a policy every 7 turns on average by the way.
* 20 from patronage + 5 from protection + spy rigging (while nobody has any techs to steal anyway) allies a CSS very early at no cost.
* Cherry on top : Bonus happiness from CS luxuries (so you can sell yours for gold), bonus resources, sometimes the only way to get coal, aluminum, or oil in some starts. It really stabilizes your strategy because of this.
* Extra firepower when you are at war with the AI. The CS are actually very strong and sometimes takes cities by themselves. They also serve as good distraction for AI troops.
* World fair gives +30 influence, meaning you can be friend with all CS when the world congress is voted. You can then spend gold to ally those you want, depending on ressources, luxuries, and strategic positioning vs your enemies.
* Bonus science. Bonus hapiness if you finish left tree. Double ressources. The happiness alone is worth having since you will be agressively taking in new cities and be able to keep more of them under your control while you research atomics. Once you reveal where uranium is, you keep cities that have it, raze the others. Having nukes usually shaves 10 turns at least in victory time, if done right.
* Bonus prod is nothing. If you have free influence with CS (which would be very expensive otherwise), you can cherry pick tiles to buy with money. Buying hills and forests faster because you saved CS-allying money results in more production and faster, even if indirectly.
* Fun fact : The 20 resting points get into effect right away and with all CS, even with those you haven't met yet. This is why you pick it on turn 1.

RNG : Barb captures: archer. Archer. That's it.

On my continent i am the only autocracy, with all 3 others order. Things started heating pretty fast with both genghis and assyria showing agression. First bribes turn 340. Chinese to attack Genghis, and then assyria. But also the other continent a few turns after so they start fighting and delay their science victory (you have to do it very early before they declare friendships and it becomes much more expensive to bribe), kinda broke the bank but was worth it. I could probably have waited more, but i was getting nervous Genghis would DOW me at any moment, the air superiority cake was still in the oven you see, i was not ready to receive any visitors on such a short notice.

World congress turn 353, unfortunately nobody has radio meaning no international games. (Patronage for consulates + IG = friend with all CS for free, strong combo when available.)

WARFARE

Turn 367 (turn42) I capture Karakorum (Genghi's capital) with an army of 2 machine guns (upgraded from 2 barb archers), 2 gw.infantry, 6 gw.bombers, 3 arty (mostly there to kill anti air if any), and a land ship. I take all his cities and eliminate him turn 373. Same turn i finish researching rocketry. I keep going south through china and assyria and manage to dominate my continent turn : 384.

Screenshot :

Spoiler :

Zulu lose capital turn 391 to our force of battleships, battlecruisers, two full carriers (8 bombers and 2 fighters), a submarine, and a few destroyers for coastal capture and detection.

Shortly after Rome, egypt, and Askia fall almost the same turn to a combined air, ground, sea, nuke, and xjetpack strike force. Total nukes used in the game were 8 or 9.

Finished at 401. Turn 76 win.

Spoiler :

Questions & answers :

Spoiler :

Game: Civ5 GOTM 87
Date submitted: 2014-06-02 03:20:57
Reference number: 31180
Your name: DrakenKin
Game status: Domination Victory
Game date: 975BC
Turns played: 76
Base score: 1141
Final score: 7606
Time played: 11:51:00 / left game open when going to bed, this is about a 4-5 hours play session.
Submitted save: Bismarck_0401 AD-1981winOMT.Civ5Save
Renamed file: DrakenKin_C508701.Civ5Save

Would have been at least 5 turns earlier if Rome didn't take thebes as i was about to take it myself, removing my spy thus having no visibility to drop xcom, waiting for spy to "establish surveillance" again for 5 turns was such a pain.

This TSG was a pack of fun, really really amazing. Thank you for organizing it!

DrakenKin · Jun 2, 2014

TheGrumpyBuddha said:
is someone going to post a pre-60?!

I think it is fairly possible.

If you look at my build, could have skipped pentagon for extra ships (had too much money anyway). Could have attacked zulu same time i was pushing the end of my continent instead of waiting, kind of overestimated what it would take to take a coast. I might have wasted 15 turns right there. Add those 15 turns to the 5 i lost because i bribed rome at the end to attack egypt and my spy got removed (I should have dropped an xcom nearby in case that happened to serve as dropping point), that's 20, but i feel I could beat my time by 10-15 turns at least if I did another test run with similar "favorable map" settings as this one.

The presence of close by CSS and ressources and AI is capital and makes things relatively strightforward, there is no real flaw in the map that can slow you down.

budweiser · Jun 2, 2014

Egypt launched on me in 1984 so I lost.

I should have played out at least one full game and listened to the people that were talking about X-Coms and Missile Cruisers. I researched those units but did not deploy them fast enough. But mostly I let the other continent develop by itself without any kind of intervention other than a half hearted bribe to Shaka.

Fayl · Jun 3, 2014

Sooo.. I've been lurking on these forums for some time and finally decided to actually register, play and submit a game.
As a disclaimer, I never played a game starting from modern era, so that was pretty new for me.

Spoiler submission details :

As for policies, I took commerce opener for big ben (which, in the long run was a bad idea, because I hardly bought anything in cities) and then full autocracy.
As for science, I wanted to get to bombers and XCOMs ASAP to have as big land coverage as possible, so I totally ignored top part of the tree, and went like flight->...->radar->satellites (for telescope) -> xcoms -> stealth bombers. I didn't research atomic theory until the very last turn of the game, so no nukes from my side. I stole some early techs from the top of the tree, so I could make great war infantry and subs.

At the beginning I settled the first city at the central spot, second between two wines on the right and third one to the left, as close to city state as possible (and grabbed their gems before they did) -- all coastal.
I got an unpleasant surprise quite fast, as at turn 15 I got attacked by both Mongols and Assyria. Genghis managed to capture my east city (2 turns after DoW), one turn before I managed to move my units there. I recaptured it immediately, but it was down to 1 citizen and lost most of the buildings, so it was hindering me more than helping. I proceeded to destroy Mongols with rifles and artillery, while handling assyria attack with one artillery in the city, helped by the battleship. After killing Genghis (around turn 50 iirc), I bribed china to attack assyria and then attacked them both (China cities with my g.w infantry, newly upgraded rocket artillery and bombers, and Assyria with battleships. During the attack I researched paratroopers so I started mass producing them and sending to the south to speed up taking assyrian cities. I finished clearing the continent around turn 75 (again, not sure abound the exact turn). I think I lost no units at all during these wars except some infantry after cities getting flipped several times. I kept producing paratroopers and when I researched XCOMs (2-3 turns after winning with Assyria), I sent a small fleet (cruisers and carriers) to Zulu and declared war on him at turn 80. Zulu had allied pretty much all CS (except 3 allied to me) so I got some of my unguarded cities attacked. The war lasted 3 turns, I got his capital that I could use as a base for my XCOMs and stealth bombers (researched at turn 82 using oxford that I forgot to build before

). Then I lost 2 turns waiting to move some of my units to see rome/songhai capitals, declared war on all 3 of them and then sent all my XCOMs (5-6 for each city) and took all three capitals at the same turn. It was a very close call, because both rome and songhai had 5 parts of spaceship completed.

Also right before taking on Zulu, I bribed rome to attack egypt and egypt to attack songhai and fortunately for me they ALL nuked each other's capitals, so my XCOMs had only half-health capitals to take.

So yeah, the result wasn't great, but since that my first one, I guess it's okay. Especially that I don't usually play on domination so that probably was the biggest army I ever used.

Spoiler questions :

leif erikson · Jun 3, 2014

Fayl said:
Sooo.. I've been lurking on these forums for some time and finally decided to actually register, play and submit a game.
As a disclaimer, I never played a game starting from modern era, so that was pretty new for me.

Welcome to Civfanatics and GOTM. :wavey:

Glad you decided to join the fun. Best of luck in future. :thumbsup:

Gamewizard · Jun 5, 2014

Turn 91 Domination victory. A really fun game, the first time I used X-Com as my main attack force. The extra production from Order and exploration allows your coastal satellites to pump them out 2 or 3 a turn while building nuclear missles in the main cities. I used 1 missle cruiser in the middle of the ocean as my launching point for the nuclear rain on Zulu nation and sent in the X-Com after the bombs dropped.

First I conquered Mongolia and China before swimming east to Egypt with an army of panzers and rocket artillery. I left Assyria for last because he was friendly and was trading for full. I should have prebuilt a war road from the beaches of CS to Thebes because the artillery were slow moving, so this mistake cost me many turns. Rome and Zulu (Songhai conquered by Zulu) started building SS parts rapidly after Egypt fell so I DOW'd both and slowly started chopping my way through a forest of atomic era units. Rome fell quickly but then unhappiness became a problem as Zulu started putting autocratic pressure on my socialist empire. A handful of turns in unhappiness created 2 X-Com rebels at the undefended capital. This was the biggest threat to my main empire the whole game. 8 or 9 nukes at the end won the game.

I enjoyed this game and the tension at the end. I think I will try the Freedom based "domination through diplomacy" strategy in my next modern era game.

Novalia · Jun 6, 2014

turn 64 win..

the game had an extremely deliberate build up but once i started warring it only took 13 turns before it finished..

i like these advanced era starts.. the days ahead of it are a huge learning experience testing which social policy direction to go.. its nice to play a game with some powerful toys.. missile cruisers are awesome.

Spoiler :

hambridger · Jun 6, 2014

Game: Civ5 GOTM 87
Date submitted: 2014-06-06 19:52:26
Reference number: 31194
Your name: hambridger
Game status: Domination Victory
Game date: 1600BC
Turns played: 60
Base score: 866
Final score: 7216
Time played: 2:53:00

Played a few practice games, with times as good as 50 turns. This game went from bad to worse and I almost gave up. Around turn 25, as soon as I met Assyria, he and Mongolia double DOWed me. Mongolia had a bunch of artillery and took Hamburg, my eastern city twice. The second time he killed several of my great war bombers that were helping defend. My city went from 12 pop to 6, then 3 and finally down to 1. So Hamburg didn't contribute much for the rest of the game (~3 Xcoms towards to end). So this hurt my science and military quite a bit. When I finally took Mongolia's capital he was willing to sign a peace agreement and give me 500 gold. I guess he felt bad about Hamburg.
Several turns later, I finally made it to my final army composition, Xcoms and stealth bombers. I quickly took over my continent and then transitioned over to the over one using mass Xcoms to take Gao. Sadly after I had sent my airforce over to Gao, I left an opening for a Songhai great war infantry to sneak in and take Gao, setting me back again. Eventually took Thebes and Rome on turn 60.

Policies: Exploration 3, Rationalism 2, Autocracy 3
Capital build order(founded on Wine): Ironworks, windmill, worker, cargo ships, aqueduct, factory, science buildings, military buildings
2 other cities: worker, windmill, cargo ships, aqueduct, factory, science buildings, military buildings
Used first Great Engineer for Prora, second for Hubble. Then used the two scientists to bulb to Xcoms and Stealth (well, in the test games I did). I came up a bit short on Science, so I had to wait another 5 turns to get Xcoms.
This was quite a fun scenario, as I've never used the late game war units before.

hambridger · Jun 7, 2014

Alright, tried it again. This time I bribed Assyria to attack Mongolia when I met them, before they could joint DOW me. This distracts my enemies and leads to a 51 turn finish. If only I had been that cautious the first time.

Novalia · Jun 7, 2014

I'm going to try this one again using freedom. Will every AI hate me?

Olodune · Jun 8, 2014

Game: Civ5 GOTM 87
Date submitted: 2014-06-08 00:01:57
Reference number: 31201
Your name: Olodune
Game status: Domination Victory
Game date: 1360BC
Turns played: 66
Base score: 1153
Final score: 8869
Time played: 4:56:00
Submitted save: Bismarck_0391 AD-1971.Civ5Save
Renamed file: Olodune_C508701.Civ5Save

Lots of fun mixed with a few "failure of late game knowledge" moments.

Spoiler :

DrakenKin · Jun 8, 2014

- Stealth Bombers don't fit on ships.

Yes but they can rebase almost anywhere on the map, same range as xcom drop I think. So all you need is a beachhead.

Nice times guys. :goodjob:

hambridger · Jun 8, 2014

Further refinements to warfare (turn 47 finish):
Took out Mongolia early with infantry and bombers while spamming paratroopers in all 3 cities. When I hit Nanotechnology (turn 41), I had 11 paratroopers to upgrade. Attacked Gao the next turn and took it in 2 turns, re-basing 6 stealth bombers there. Then I built more stealth bombers and X-coms to use for Assyria and China. I then took the remaining 5 capitals in the same turn. I've found it's important to not take the capitals early, as the AI has a bunch of artillery and can easily retake them, killing one of your X-coms in the process. You can try to guard the capital with X-coms, but this takes quite a few X-coms to block the AI from retaking.
This is quite a fun scenario to replay.

Olodune · Jun 9, 2014

hambridger said:
Further refinements to warfare (turn 47 finish):
Took out Mongolia early with infantry and bombers while spamming paratroopers in all 3 cities.

That is a stout finish time

Why kill Mongolia early? To prevent aggression from him or just because there was some "down time" while waiting for Hubble? I guess capturing 5 caps simultaneously is already a handful :lol:

I'm guessing you stayed with the Exploration/Rat/Auto hybrid. Solid. I underestimated the value of Rationalism in this setting.

hambridger · Jun 9, 2014

The 5 initial riflemen needed to stay home in case of Mongol aggression. So this is the only capital they can help capture, and I wouldn't want them to just sit around idle. So they were there waiting to attack the Mongols once they got bomber support (and money to upgrade to infantry). I wanted to put all my production into units that would upgrade into Xcoms and stealth bombers, so the attack force was limited to 5 infantry and 6 bombers based in the eastern city. I did have some paratroopers that could have helped, but I didn't want to risk them. You also want to attack them early enough that you can get a peace treaty (seems to be first available 5 to 6 turns after DOW) before you start attacking the world with Xcoms. Because Mongolia is so close, you need to slowly advance on his capital to avoid him getting into your land and pillaging. Also, since you don't have stealth bombers yet, you need to check for anti-air, as you don't want to lose a bomber.
Still using Expo/Rat/Auto Hybrid. I did try Order in some test games, but Total War (autocracy) is just too good. That third upgrade gets you air-repair for bombers and +50% vs cities for Xcoms.

Also, I just tested using Oxford for Plastics instead of Satellites, but this took 1 more turn to get to nanotech.

hambridger · Jun 12, 2014

Great person refinement (turn 45 finish): Instead of a great engineer for Prora, hard build Prora in Berlin and get a great scientist. This will help get you to nanotech sooner, leading to an earlier attack on Gao, albeit with fewer Xcoms. May be able to finish turn 44 or 43 with this method, but you do risk losing Prora to the AI, which would be quite a setback.

IronfighterXXX · Jun 24, 2014

I built 3 coastal cities, used first GS + Oxford for satellites, built Hubble and used two GSs for XCOMs and stealth, and in that point DV was only matter of time

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