TSG88 Opening Actions

Welcome to the TSG88 Opening Actions thread.

STOP - Please do not continue reading this thread until you have completed at least 80 to 100 turns in your game.

This thread is used to discuss the game once you've started playing through your first 100 turns. Apart from normal decency, the only posting restrictions are to please not post videos until the deadline is finished and to use the spoiler tags for screenshots. Here you can post questions related to the game and share your achievements/anger/frustration/victories while you play. Please remember that we are running a family friendly site, so express anger or frustration with this in mind.

Please use this thread to discuss your goals for the game and your opening moves through the first 100 turns. We are going to try something new and limit your game description in this thread to the first 100 turns. Anything after that should be posted in the After Action thread once you have completed your game.

- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?
- What were your initial priorities?
- What tech path did you follow and why?
- What Social Policies did you choose and why?
- How did the game options impact your strategy?

I thought I would play this out for some fun but it was more of a pain. My problems came from my own choices. I went liberty thinking Ill get out a ton of cities and that plan fell apart when I had alot of early gold problems. I guess playing most of my games from the ancient era hurt some of my choices. I should of went Tradition as usual for monarchy. I ended up with only 3 cities and got lazy for the expansion. So basically Im playing a 3 city liberty start . I put the cities next to the mtns and on a lux if possible. I crawled my way into the lead on all demo's except for land. I guess it could of been worse we could of started where Paris was with all tundra and 3 salt!! Anyway things go pretty slow and by turn 100 I manage to be making some gold.

- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?
Made me kinda lazy since I knew the AI would never get to me through all these mtn's and hills
- What were your initial priorities?
I wanted to play like my normal deity/ancient era starts but this start needed another approach.
- What tech path did you follow and why?
I went Civil Service first for Itza. Maybe focus on gold buildings first was better.
- What Social Policies did you choose and why?
I went Full Liberty (Mistake) Mixed Tradition/Full Ratio/6 into Order.
- How did the game options impact your strategy?
Kinda hurt my game since Im used to Deity and a better BO.

Fluphen Azine said:

Kinda hurt my game since Im used to Deity and a better BO.

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I always liked sandboxes and this is the definition of a sandbox game. So many, many build options ... so little time. Did I focus too much on hammers at the expense of early growth? Only time will tell.

Went Liberty -> (Worker Tenant) -> (Free Settler) -> Trad -> Monarchy -> Meritocracy.

The AI is totally useless - no gold, no trades, no beakers, no barb defense. The one early Lux trade I landed got pillaged away in Morocco.

I chose the Religious Idol Pantheon, but I think Sun God or Fertility Rites is probably superior. Tithe and happy temples added.

Early GPT and happy are hard constraints on Rexing. At least it's nice to be able to self found a religion and see splash screens for wonders I almost never build (So many potential hammer sinks .... )

Trying to decide whether to finish Liberty and/or Monarchy, or just push on into Rationalism. Probably the latter. Piety and Commerce looked kind of attractive, but, as usual, the opportunity cost is just too high.

cap BO: granary - 2 caravans - HG - market - library - NC - HS
2nd city: granary - library - petra - CB - 2 settlers later.

settled 3rd city (NW of cap, on top of iron) and 4th city (SE of cap, where 2 wheats+3 sheeps+sugar+lots of terrace farms) after tradition completion.

SP: full tradition - rati until univ policy - order

I could get 2-3 tributes, but could not get one more to rush buy a worker - also, I missed one CS (left side of the map) by 1 tile and missed that crucial 30 gold to get a worker. That would have been a big help. Stole one worker from Morocco, but forgot to get one from CS...

My scouting also sucked - I could not even meet 2 civs and 2-3 CSs for a long time.

Barbs were painful - when I lost 2 caravans at one turn due to unexpected 3 barbs coming in, I was like...

AIs were totally useless. All of them were running deficit, so I could not sell/exchange gold. Happiness was critical for all time, and gpt was a problem too. I had to build market before library so that I do not lose spt...

religion: fertility rites, swords into plowshares + tithe, religious community + religious texts. my fpt is abysmal too.

techs: civil service, education, astronomy, and beeline to sci theory and plastics.

I stayed unhappy for 5-6 turns (this seldom happens...) b/c stupid AIs did not renew the resource exchange deals or got pillaged by barbs and deals got cancelled.

Made lots of mistakes and suboptimal plays, and have no idea how to play endgame (after plastics) as I have not played easy level SV for a long time and with advanced start techs are cheaper to research.

glory7 said:

2nd city: granary - library - petra - CB - 2 settlers later.

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Petra, eh? In the desert just east of the start? I guess Petra + Terrace Farms could result in some amazing tiles, but I was thinking Machu Picchu or Notre Dame would be better (until I see your results, I am sure )

[...] and have no idea how to play endgame (after plastics) as I have not played easy level SV for a long time and with advanced start techs are cheaper to research.

Click to expand...

There is a lot of balancing going on in the SV -- tech, hammers, timings (my Apollo was annoyingly late, too many beakers, never found a slot for my pre-built Oxford, etc). This game does show how altering the game balance (Prince + cheap techs) throws a wrench in the mix.

With all those issues I think you might only beat my time by ~20 turns this time around

This has been interesting for me so far: new to GOTM, pretty much new to BNW (played it some but never finished a game), new to non-Ancient starts, new to Highlands. Probably going to end up with some shockingly late time, but i doubt the AI is going to beat me there...

- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?

I definitely should have looked at the settings more carefully before diving in, but the only similar thing I ever did to this was Nobles Club in Civ4 where they didn't tell you map details, so I didn't look. Scouted for a long time before I realised there were no large oceans to speak of :/

- What were your initial priorities?

I was just trying to push out cities but ran into happiness issues. Scouting sucked, i didn't build a scout for ages and I still don't have the right side of the map. My grasp of good science victory strategy is shaky, since i've played mostly with tutorials etc on higher difficulties where the AIs let you gold-rush a ton of stuff. Here, I was just floundering, haven't been on Prince in a while. Founded a religion for happy, been trying to spread that a little further.,

- What tech path did you follow and why?

Beelined Education, then schools, then astronomy (totally forgot about observatories even though I placed cities for them, shows how much I was concentrating/micromanaging this game), now heading to labs. Just going for science buildings, had no military problems other than lost caravans. I went leaning tower -> porcelain tower, because that's what i'm used to, which was stupid because i have signed 0 RAs. the endgame is going to suck if I don't get some, the last techs will take forever to pop.

- What Social Policies did you choose and why?

Went tradition, because I always do. Seemed to be the right choice, because I was happy/gold constrained anyway and my current tally of six cities, while perhaps could have been pushed to a seventh because I didn't properly use a happiness bump from notre dame, is more likely about as well as i'm doing right now. Opened patronage because hadn't hit renaissance yet, have right side of rationalism, and the 2 free order tenets atm. I don't know which ideologies tend to be good, but i foresee gradually expanding outwards to more cities and order will help me do that.

- How did the game options impact your strategy?

They didn't really, because I didn't look at them. Played inca occ before on deity, but this is way different. forgot to use the UA properly, and built roads as normal.

Zedseayou said:

This has been interesting for me so far: new to GOTM, pretty much new to BNW (played it some but never finished a game), new to non-Ancient starts, new to Highlands.

Click to expand...

Welcome to GotM! Thanks for posting and good luck!

HR

I scouted with my spearmen following hills in three directions. First tech was Civil Service to promote to pikemen. I've just finished Education, now working through Compass for observatories for two cities.
I looked for water for the cargo ship trade bonus and got on the Ethiopia side of the eastern desert which gave me several trade partners.
I've attacked Morocco to guard my southwest. Now my small army (2 trebuchets, crossbow, pikeman) is heading for Abyssinia for the eastern harbour and the silver, since my pantheon is Religious Idols.
I took Honour for barb kill culture, then Liberty for the Great Engineer to build Petra.
Usually I'm struggling to win, rather than studying how to win fast, so I'm used to AIs still being equal to me in the Medieval era. Pachacuti builds on hills for free and this map has lots of hills.

I didn't play these settings before. Turns out that cities come with a Monument and a Shrine, but are still size 1. There are many tiles to improve, so our first priority is to get four Workers, two for each city.

Cusco is settled on the hill at the mountain, where I think everyone put their capital. There is a bit more choice for Tiwanaku. We planted the second settler just across the river east, with horses and sheep in sight but also some opportunities for terraces.

The three Spearmen are all sent out to explore, initially north, not too far apart. Two of them will return home soon to fend off barbarians. In the meantime, they manage to extract gold from Hanoi, Manila and Monaco.

On their way home they discover four natural wonders (King Solomon's Mines; it says one of 6 so we look for and find 2x the Great Barrier Reef; Lake Victoria). Cool - but now no city state asks us to find them, so no easy influence. The one exploring Spearman will eventually find Krakatoa, too (T174), but the sixth is still hidden.

The policies we pick at the start are Tradition, Liberty and Citizenship, with Republic to follow soon. There is no point going for a very early third Settler because we don't have sufficient happiness.

With all those desert tiles, we pick Desert Folklore as our pantheon, hoping to generate enough faith to score extra happiness from Pagodas and eventually get some Great Scientists.

Workers
From the Medieval start (to Tiwanaku)
From Citizenship (chops Cusco forest first)
Built in Cusco
Bought for 220g in Tiwanaku

Money is scarce, despite the 3 sources of Gold. Even with many a 30g from newly discovered City States the budget deficit is killing our technological progress. The AI will not trade for much since they are mostly in the red, too. This was expected. We decide not to care and keep building up. Building a road between our two cities is a top priority though; with 3 turns a tile this is another reason why we wanted 4 Workers asap.

The early part of the game is all about growing the capital and founding our empire, while securing happiness and building up production. There isn't even time for a Library in the capital until T174, let alone the National College.


Cities
125 Cusco (3 Gold, Spices, Horses)
127 Tiwanaku (Horses), on river, desert east
151 Machu (Dyes, Iron), north on the iron hill
163 Ollantaytambo (Sugar), south, on river hill, with five sheep in the city radius
169 Corihuayrachina (Incense, Horses, Iron, King Solomon's Mines), desert north of Morocco
183 Huamanga (Incense, Iron), desert east of Tiwanaku, coastal
191 Vilcas (Salt), northeast of Morocco (we traded with Morocco for Salt first, but that got pillaged by barbarians)

They are all at a mountain (plenty of those available), for Observatories.

The policies and religion reflect our priorities, until we hit science-mode on turn 200 (75). :

Social policies
125 Tradition, Liberty, Citizenship (Medieval start)
129 Republic
148 Collective Rule
173 Aristocracy
189 Meritocracy
200 Rationalism (Oracle)

Religion
132 Desert Folklore
176 Taoism (Tithe, Swords into Plowshares)
195 Taoism enhanced (Mosques, Religious Texts)

Sadly Pagodas were already taken by all-tundra France.
Tiwanaku got converted by missionary on turn 198, Ollantaytambo on turn 200.


With internal trade routes we eventually generate sufficient income, and science begins to boom. Nicely on turn 200 (75), we pick Rationalism from the Oracle the same turn we discover Astronomy and enter the Renaissance. Secularism is due in a few turns, too.

Technology
149 Civil Service
164 Metal Casting
176 Theology
186 Education
192 Compass
200 Astronomy

Cusco


Wonders
182 Hanging Gardens (Cusco)
187 Chichen Itza (Cusco)
194 Hagia Sophia (Tiwanaku)
200 Oracle (Cusco)

T200
Cities: 7
Pop: 50 (16,11,8,8,3,2,2)
Per turn: 110s, 4g, 56c, 42f, 0t
Allies: 5 (Almaty, Jerusalem, Mogadishu, Monaco, Wittenberg)

T200 Map

I'm playing some of the old TSG games; just started this one last night. I'm a little over 100 turns in. I went full Tradition, opened Commerce and Rationalism, and I plan on going Freedom for my ideology. I'm already far enough ahead in tech that I'm not sure whether to go full Rationalism or full Commerce.

The first thing I built was a Temple (not enough pop to really use a library), and I set my worker to building terrace farms and improving the gold tiles. the first tech I researched was Civil Service. I have 3 cities so far, and may settle a 4th if I find some coal. There is lots of room to settle more cities, the AI's are not expanding much. (maybe I should fill the map with cities and go Order instead of Freedom?) They are also broke, and have nothing to trade for; it's pathetic. The turn before I went to bed, I killed 5 spies at the same time. There's still 2 civs that I haven't met yet.

I haven't built any military units, just upgraded my spears to pikes, and received a horse (now a knight) and a landsknecht from a CS I was friends with. That's still enough to give me a comfortable 2nd-place military. When I get my free foreign legions, I may go kill one of my neighbors and build trading posts everywhere.

I can't really use external trade routes for much because of the barbs. Maybe I should have at least opened Honor for the notifications. I'm using my knight to guard one trade route to that CS that gave me the units.

I'm prioritizing terrace farms and pastures over everything else because they give food and hammers from the same tile (and more than a lumbermill). I don't remember all the wonders I've built, but a few significant ones were Hanging Gardens, Notre Dame, Alhambra, Macchu Picchu (sp?), and the Leaning Tower. I just got my 3rd great prophet and need to figure out where to send him; probably to one of the irreligious AI's rather than my own cities or CS's.