TSG107 Opening Actions

Welcome to the TSG107 Opening Actions thread.

STOP - Please do not continue reading this thread until you have completed at least 80 to 100 turns in your game.

This thread is used to discuss the game once you've started playing through your first 100 turns. Apart from normal decency, the only posting restrictions are to please not post videos until the deadline is finished and to use the spoiler tags for screenshots. Here you can post questions related to the game and share your achievements/anger/frustration/victories while you play. Please remember that we are running a family friendly site, so express anger or frustration with this in mind.

Please use this thread to discuss your goals for the game and your opening moves through the first 100 turns. Anything after that should be posted in the After Action thread once you have completed your game.

- What did you think about before starting the game, what was your approach to this game?
- Did you spend much time doing reconnaissance before settling?
- Where did you settle and what did you build first?
- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?
- What were your initial priorities?
- What tech path did you follow and why?
- What Social Policies did you choose and why?
- Has it been peaceful? Did anyone start a war?
- Did you go for early Faith to gain an advantage? If so, how?

turn 107, I'm pretty pleased with things so far.

I decided before the game, that I was gonna take a stab at the GL-NC start, and then expand after that, since Emperor is about the highest level you can usually grab the GL if you want it.

I did very little scouting early - just enough to decide how many other cities I was going to drop once the NC was done. (I decided on just 1 for now, a coastal city to the west with the river and mountain, and a bunch of salt and corrals) I think I just now finally built a scout and have started sending my trireme out exploring, until now, I was working hard to protect my cargo ships and land from the 4! barbarian camps that spawned within 10 hexes of my capital.

I settled in place. Teched Mining, pottery, writing, calendar and built worker, monument/granary, great library, national college, shrine, settler, trireme, cargo ship. Bought a couple archers, and stole a 2nd worker from one of the city states. I went full tradition because I like building a few big cities. Didn't start religion until late, but got earth mother for my pantheon, so caught up quick. went with Tithe and faster growth.

As of turn 107, Paris is size 13, Orlean is size 8, and I'm almost finished with Education, got my religion a few turns ago, and have added the Hanging Gardens and the Oracle to Paris. The big question now is whether I want to drop a few more cities, or whether I want to relax with my cities.

- What did you think about before starting the game, what was your approach to this game?

My main thought was to try & find as many City-States as possible in order to ingratiate myself to them, to set myself up for future victory.

- Did you spend much time doing reconnaissance before settling?

I settled in place, without any reconnaissance beforehand. Once I settled, I set about building a monument, a scout & a worker. In hindsight, I wish I'd focused on building more settlers, as I'm now feeling hemmed in on all sides ;-).

- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?

Seeing what lay around my starting city, I felt that Mining & Masonry were important starting techs, followed by Animal Husbandry to build trade routes to neighbouring City-States. I learned pretty quickly that I had close neighbours-& a number of barbarians-which pushed me in certain Social Policy Directions.

- What were your initial priorities?

As I said above, my first priorities was to research techs & prioritize my build list to best exploit my local resources, & to best search out my local area. When I realized how many barb camps there were, I quickly prioritized Archery to tackle them.

- What Social Policies did you choose and why?

Seeing how hemmed in I was, I quickly decided to prioritize the Tradition Tree, followed by the Honor opening (to deal with the barbarians), then Piety to get myself a leg-up on religion (though some AI Civs have clearly exploited faith even more ruthlessly).

- Has it been peaceful? Did anyone start a war?

No wars to date.....I think we're all too busy eliminating the barbarian threat right now. However, given that we have 4 Civs in such close proximity....& given that it's The Celts & Assyria, I suspect war is inevitable.

- Did you go for early Faith to gain an advantage? If so, how?

I did go early Faith, largely by getting pottery fairly early (between mining & masonry)-to build shrines-& by purchasing two Piety Policies.

Aussie_Lurker.

strake said:

turn 107, I'm pretty pleased with things so far.

I decided before the game, that I was gonna take a stab at the GL-NC start, and then expand after that, since Emperor is about the highest level you can usually grab the GL if you want it.

I did very little scouting early - just enough to decide how many other cities I was going to drop once the NC was done. (I decided on just 1 for now, a coastal city to the west with the river and mountain, and a bunch of salt and corrals) I think I just now finally built a scout and have started sending my trireme out exploring, until now, I was working hard to protect my cargo ships and land from the 4! barbarian camps that spawned within 10 hexes of my capital.

I settled in place. Teched Mining, pottery, writing, calendar and built worker, monument/granary, great library, national college, shrine, settler, trireme, cargo ship. Bought a couple archers, and stole a 2nd worker from one of the city states. I went full tradition because I like building a few big cities. Didn't start religion until late, but got earth mother for my pantheon, so caught up quick. went with Tithe and faster growth.

As of turn 107, Paris is size 13, Orlean is size 8, and I'm almost finished with Education, got my religion a few turns ago, and have added the Hanging Gardens and the Oracle to Paris. The big question now is whether I want to drop a few more cities, or whether I want to relax with my cities.

Click to expand...

Quick question, but what does NC stand for?

I am happy to report that I was able to grab The Temple of Artemis and The Great Mausoleum, but I did miss out on The Great Library sadly . With luck I'll be able to pick up The Oracle & Stonehenge.

Aussie_Lurker.

NC = National College. See http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=540944 for more acronyms and terms.

Browd said:

NC = National College. See http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=540944 for more acronyms and terms.

Click to expand...

Thanks for that Browd .

Aussie.

Aussie_Lurker said:

I am happy to report that I was able to grab The Temple of Artemis and The Great Mausoleum, but I did miss out on The Great Library sadly . With luck I'll be able to pick up The Oracle & Stonehenge.

Aussie_Lurker.

Click to expand...

Quick update. I grabbed The Oracle, but missed out on Stonehenge by absolute miles ;-).

Aussie.

It's turn 100. My plan is to befriend city states, partly with money, so Great Lighthouse and Colossus are important. I've also got Great Library and should have Oracle in a few turns.

I moved the warrior south, then settled in place. I skipped the scout to get a second warrior accumulating experience for the musketeer upgrade. Fishing was my fourth tech so the trireme could start scouting the ocean, and that made me first to the western city states.

Policies were Liberty and Patronage, plus one step in Honor just to speed up dealing with the barbarians. I have two more cities to the east, using the Liberty great engineer for Petra in the closer one. The other is by the bison on the river north of Cerro de Potosi. Theodora got to that first.

Now that the early wonders are in place I should start building the military. Turn 100 says I'm in the middle of the pointy list with two swordsmen and a horsemen. Boudicca is ahead but not so far she can wipe me off the planet. I'm also neck and neck for the tech lead, so it's important to get Education.

I settled on flood plains east of the lower salt when I saw the gold in 3rd tile range. 3 lux capital? Please yes. But no. As soon as I settled I saw the gold was for a city state. Pfft.

I scouted east and south. Found Celts, Assyria and Byzantium. Boudica always hates me so I forward settled her. I figured I needed war after the last "no war" game. Also forward settled Byzantium and Assyria. They didn't care. Final city was sw on the coast for pearls and crab.

Barbs were raging like crazy. I lost one settler and a worker. Got them back. Also picked up 3 more workers captured from other civs, so I guess it worked out.

I convinced Celts to DoW both Byz and Assyria, then denounced and DoW'd her. Took her capital and razed Cardiff.

Now it's on to education and to find the wonder mongers across the ocean. I lost 3 wonders by 3 turns or less to this player. I have a large army and lots of iron. I will race to astronomy and kill whoever it is!

Oh wait. I need to win by diplomacy???

But I thought I would try it out.

- What did you think about before starting the game, what was your approach to this game?

Knew immediately that the focus had to be cash. Will be my focus throughout the game. The more money - the more I can buy CS.

- Did you spend much time doing reconnaissance before settling?

I very rarely move my settler. Moved the Warrior to see a bit more, briefly debated going off the coast and onto the lake and then decided to go for the coast.

- Where did you settle and what did you build first?

See above. I usually always start with Scout, then monument and then shrine after I research pottery. Thats is exactly what I did this time.

- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?

I almost always play Emperor, so this was right up my alley. The near desert almost tempted me into pushing there and a Desert Folklore, Petra push. When I saw Boudica was so close and the Silver Mountain. I decided to go there instead. Much easier to defend and I am on a big cash basis this game. I chose Earth Mother instead because of all the Salt and hoping for decent Iron.

- What were your initial priorities?

Locate decent initial city sites, farm some Barbs, and have a detterent army while building up trade routes. And a couple Wonders along the way due to all that salt and the marble in the capital.
- What tech path did you follow and why?

Very broad - no bee-lining. It is my usual course.

- What Social Policies did you choose and why?

Almost alway a Trad opener and focus with one branch off into honour to prevent barbs and farm a bit after archery.

- Has it been peaceful? Did anyone start a war?

Boudica asked me to go in with her against Theodora. I have agreed in now about 5 turns. This will be handy as now I will have a common foe with the Celts and may avoid war with them for awhile. Theodora will come around after. I will not be pushing, just grabbing some stuff if I can.

- Did you go for early Faith to gain an advantage? If so, how?

Faith will be important in this game, because of the .25 reduction with CS. I have pushed it up higher than normal. But all that Salt and Earth mother I should be able to get the preachers which will really help.

On Turn 107 now, and things are going swimmingly.

I founded Paris on the first turn and sent my warrior south to explore. Didn't even try for the GL. When I stumbled upon Cerro de Potosi, I immediately trained a Settler and founded Orleans next to it, on the coast. Assyria and Byzantium have both complained about my land grabbing. I've told them both to kick rocks, and founded three more cities since, to monopolize the continent's salt trade.

My large standing army, funded by the Cerro, has dissuaded anyone from attempting an invasion so far. Since the goal here is a diplomatic victory, I've successfully built the Great Lighthouse and Colossus for the strong naval and trade bonuses.

So far I have three CS allies that are providing culture bonuses. For policies, I took the Honor opener to help snuff out the barbarian hordes around me. I blew through the whole Liberty tree, then took a Great Engineer to rush the Oracle on the turn after finishing the Mausoleum of Halicarnassus. Currently halfway through Patronage. I'll probably dip into Commerce between finishing Patronage and starting my Ideology.

MarsupialRogue said:

Assyria and Byzantium have both complained about my land grabbing. I've told them both to kick rocks, and founded three more cities since

Click to expand...

Sorry, but that is just too awesome not to comment on.

Early exploration showed we were isolated from the troublemakers to the east and could likely proceed with a small military. Built GL and NC like many indicated above but lost the race to several wonders later on. Used four coastal cities and concentrated on gold. Did get to banking first and built that wonder. I probably won't finish the game but, as always, will read others' results and wonder how they could do it so fast

Thanks for the game.

Currently at Turn 114. Overall position is solid, and I'm confident of getting a Diplomatic VC. But probably won't set any speed records.

What did you think about before starting the game, what was your approach to this game?
Thought about how I planned to ignore the French UA since the victory condition is diplomacy rather than culture. For a fast diplomacy win, it's about science even more than gold. You have to get to Telecommunications as quickly as possible to trigger the world leader vote. So, you want to increase population and focus on science buildings.

Did you spend much time doing reconnaissance before settling?
Very little. Moved my warrior southeast. Thought about moving to the river; decided it was better to stay on the coast, and settled in place.

Where did you settle and what did you build first?
Settled in place. Built scout-scout-shrine-worker-library-settler.

I currently have three cities, room to expand further, and no real threats from my neighbors. I settled my second city, Orleans, on turn 57 along the river three tiles from Cerro de Potosi. Not the optimal site (which would have been adjacent) since I was scrambling to get a city settled before either Assyria or Byzantium claimed it. Used scouts and other units to hinder the movement of their settlers, and had to buy the tile when Assyria settled two tiles away. Interestingly, only the Celts complained about my settling too close. And so I settled my third city, Lyon, in their face as well on turn 81 (on a hill next to cows and two tiles from the cotton).

How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?
Since its a continent map, wanted to push out scouts to explore, meet CS, etc. Met the Celts on turn 8, Assyrians on Turn 13, and Byzantium on turn 23. My other scout found Lhasa on turn 19, which with the shrine gave me the second pantheon (Earth Mother) on turn 24. I then manged to found the second (after the Celts) religion (tithe + pagodas) on turn 75. This may have been a bad thing, however, since it made me think I might get to establish a strong religion. Of course, all three neighbors on my continent went piety first....

What were your initial priorities?
Stake out enough space to expand. Grow population. Start science rolling. I'm currently 1st in population, 3rd in science (with some easy techs to backfill, so probably really in the lead), with three cities founded and a settler headed toward a fourth spot. So, those were probably achieved. I suspect, however, that delaying the NC for more cities and the ToA and HG will eventually cost me time and delay the World Leader vote.

What tech path did you follow and why?
Pottery - Mining (to work the salt tiles) - Writing (duh) - Archery (defense) - Calendar - Masonry (marble) - Animal Husbandry - Philosophy (because I should try for NC early) - Wheel - Trapping - Mathematics (to build Hanging Gardens) - Construction - Sailing - Horseback Riding - Drama and Poetry - Bronze Working - Theology.

What Social Policies did you choose and why?
Opened Tradition on turn 25, oligarchy on turn 33, legalism (with free monuments) on turn 48, landed elite on turn 64, monarchy on turn 76, and finished with aristocracy on turn 93. Again, this gives fastest growth of the starting SPs, and we want a big population to get ahead in science. Plan to start Patronage next (since it's a diplomacy VC), and eventually move on to Rationalism.

Has it been peaceful? Did anyone start a war?
I mentioned above that I forward settled the Celts twice. After founding Lyon, I could see the Celts collecting troops near my border. So, I did the only sensible thing: On turn 86, I bribed them to attack Byzantium. The Celts have been at war with Byzantium ever since (and captured two of their cities). Assyria hasn't done anything. This gave me plenty of time to develop my empire. Which tempted me into building the Temple of Artemis (turn 93) and the Hanging Gardens (turn 102) in Paris before finally getting around to building the National College (turn 112).

Did you go for early Faith to gain an advantage? If so, how?
Well, sort of. Built an early shrine, got Earth Mother pantheon, and established the second religion. But the Celts are pushing missionaries and pressure at me already, and both Byzantium and Assyria have also founded religions, so I don't expect much to come of it.

- What did you think about before starting the game, what was your approach to this game?
I did a couple of test games and won them fairly easily in the end with good diplomacy and avoiding wars. I went Tradition/Patronage/Rationalism/Freedom in those games. So my plan was to go down that same route with this game. My initial thoughts with this map is there’s lots of flatland so not much production for the capital. Lots of salt though which will be good for faith with Earth Mother.

- Did you spend much time doing reconnaissance before settling?
I had read in the announcement thread that there was a river down south so I looked there first to see if I’d like it better than the starting location.

- Where did you settle and what did you build first?
I did like it! River, lots of floodplains and that gold! So I settled East of the southern most salt in the opening picture. Was not happy when I saw the CS Kiev down there about to take the gold I still have a lot to learn and wasn’t sure if I could beat Kiev to the gold. I didn’t, they got it on turn 13. Probably impossible to beat him unless I had the gold to buy the tiles.

Build Order:
Scout - find CSs/land/other civs
Monument - this did not help with getting the gold
Shrine - to get Earth mother and maybe have a religious game.. depends on the other civs and if they’re going Piety or not.
Worker - to mine all those delicious salts for faith, gold, production and lots of food!
Archer - protection/barb killing

Wonder wise I got Hanging Gardens and Temple or Artemis. I was tossing up between Stonehenge and Artemis. Two CS wanted me to build Artemis so I went with that. Plus the fact that I’ve got some aggressive Civs around, quick archer units might come in handy. Plus happiness wasn’t an issue so more growth the better! I have given up on a religious war given everyone is a 'Pious' and going Piety.

At turn 103 I am only now just building the NC which is 9 turns away from completion. I have 3 cities though and I’m top in score vs civs on this continent. 3rd in science and 7th in soldiers. That’s my next focus.


- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?
Well I explored the west side possibly too late. I went east first because of all the flatlands for faster movement with my warrior and saw a couple of nice city locations. I didn’t like that Assyria (that seem to be in 90% of the games I play :|) and Celts were close by. Didn’t like it at all! I had settled my 2nd city a city on a riverside hill to the east that will get 2xsilver, gems and marble. The Celts didn’t like that I settled there, even though I was closer to Byzantium and Assyria. Cheeky Assyria built their 3rd city inbetween Celts and and Byzantine’s capitals. I bought a couple of tiles to secure the gems to the east of Orleans, my 2nd city. Assyria didn’t seem to care I bought that tile right next to his borders. Nice!

I built a 3rd city to the west once explored next to the mountain river with 3 salts to be in its borders. Excellent! Needed a coastal city too. I had initially planned for my 2nd city to go near Cerro de Potosi but Byzantine beat me to it. I would have like to build a city north of where I eventually built my 2nd city but the Celts weren’t happy with where I built my 2nd city and I didn’t have many units and don’t want war! So that’s when the 3rd city to the west came about.

I’m not sure if I could build a 4th city down south on the jungle hill with crab and pearls. Thoughts? Is it too late to go a 4th city now?

- What were your initial priorities?

Religion
I was thinking I could own the smallish continent religion wise if I focus on it early. Unfortunately all the civs on the continent are focusing on religion/piety so that went out the window fast. I was thankful to get Earth Mother.

Worker stealing
I was going to steal from Kiev but then Byzantine were protecting it so I stole from Kyzyl to avoid them hating me. Don’t like all the hostile CS around. I lost the worker I stole then an archer trying to get it back *facepalm*. Eventually a newly created archer got the stolen worker back. Sheesh! I saved a worker of Kuala Lumpur but decided to keep it for myself.

Settling good land
I want to go tall so I wanted to scout the lands nearby to see where I would settle my cities.


- What tech path did you follow and why?
Pottery - wanted an early shrine until I met other civs and that exercise was pointless. Plus I wanted that gold tile and I thought going monument before shrine might get me there. I’m learning
Animal Husbandry - I thought an early trade with the extremely close Kiev would be good as there would be no barb threat. I was growing fast too so horses nearby = more production if I’m lucky.
Mining - salts!
Archery - protection/barbs
Bronze Working - find iron and to help with 2nd city placement
Writing - need science!

- What Social Policies did you choose and why?
Tradition. I was allies/friends on and off with the cultural CSs so that helped. Have fully finished tradition. Currently turn 103.

- Has it been peaceful? Did anyone start a war?
As peaceful as it can be. Celts are mad I took lands they covet but they’re over that now (no red diplomacy notes). Assyria is slightly mad I have lands they covet but it’s not bright red (bright red is the worst, right?). I have a DOF with Byzantium, lovely.

I can get Celts to war with Assyria for 3gpt marble and 2 iron. Should I? They just built Terracotta Army too. It seems cheap.


- Did you go for early Faith to gain an advantage? If so, how?
I had planned to, so I could dominate a continent religiously but then everyone was going Piety and that’s not in my strategy so I opted out of it.

I managed to found the 4th religion in the world. I went for Papal Primacy (15 influence resting state with CS following the religion) and Swords into Plowshares (15% faster growth when not at war). I figured with the Temple of Artemis, and Tradition completed I may as well just go crazy with food growth, right? I don’t plan to go into any wars if I can avoid it. Pagodas etc were already taken.

I’ve only built 1 shrine in my capital, all faith has been from the glorious salts and a little from the religious CS.


————

Despite what my score says I’m not overly confident with this game as I were my test games. I’m fairly sure I won’t be able to avoid a war with Assyria and Celts nearby. I wish I didn’t build that 2nd city of mine to the east and just built 3 cities to the west, hemmed in by city states and more easily defendable than Orleans which is stuck right in the middle of all the other civs. I got sucked in by all the amazing resources to the east.

Should be a fairly interesting and for me, challenging game! Next step is to decide whether to build a 4th city and build some comp-bows for protection to get at least mid range in soldiers score. Need to get to education pretty quick too it would seem then hopefully first to banking for the Forbidden Palace!

- What did you think about before starting the game, what was your approach to this game?
Wonder Spamming was actually possible and helpfull for city of lights, if people have crazy tourism pressure, i can manipulate them much esier
- Did you spend much time doing reconnaissance before settling?
moved the warrior south, but thats all, didnt want to lose the marble
- Where did you settle and what did you build first?
I decided to settle in place, (totally abnormal for me), but idid move my warrior first. Monument>Scout>Granary>GL>Colossus>Shrine
- How did the terrain and map settings affect your early decisions?
With the marble nearby, I knew I was Going for the GL, however, I also went for the Collosus because of the discount on wonders.
With so many city states, I decided not to build a worker, and nabbed one from Lhasa
- What were your initial priorities?
Great Library, Great Library, GREAT LIBRARY! but seriously, GL gives 2 slots and a theme bonus when filled, so it was high in the list, The Colossus for that gold to feed the diplo victory, then writers guild to start preparing for the theming bonus, with National epic to speed things along.
- What tech path did you follow and why?
Straight for writing, then mining and bronze. GL gave me Iron working(Poor planning, i know) and made me first to classical.
- What Social Policies did you choose and why?
Full Tradition, Bland, yet sensible
- Has it been peaceful? Did anyone start a war?
Assyria covets my land, and the Celts are a little worried about my expansion, (But still friendly, hmmmmmm) but no real war
- Did you go for early Faith to gain an advantage? If so, how?
I actually waited awhile, but still got Earth Mother, but religions not a priority this game.

Initial stuff:
Monument Worker Scout Settler
Animal Husbandry, Bronze Working

T0: Settled in place. Salt + Coast are attractive enough.
T8: Monument built. No ruin so scouts can wait
T20: Worker built. Salts are best improved early and AI takes time on Emperor to make workers
T23T26: 2 scouts built. Need to find additional workers and finish exploring (warrior is home guarding the worker)
T35: Settler
T37: Capture a celtic worker
T43: Settler
T48: Granary
T53: Spearman
T55: Earth Mother Pantheon
T64: GL built
T70: Cargo ship
T78: NC
T82: Settler
T91: HG
T95: Guild
T99: Market
T104: Stable

I'm playing this one now. About 200 turns in. I'm not gonna mention anything off of the starting continent. Settled in place. First expo by Cerro de Potosi (just beat Byzantine and Assyrian settlers to the location.) Waited a long time to settle the 2nd expo to the SW (after NC and guilds) I got lots of free workers because Theodora kept sending out unescorted settlers and I left a barb camp over there until I was ready to settle it myself. I had to build my first worker though, because all those hostile CS's around me took forever to get theirs out.

Boudicca founded the World Congress the turn before I captured Edinburgh, so everybody is suspicious of my warmongering. I proposed the Worlds Fair, and they seem to like that; time to settle down into a peaceful game. I'm dominating my continent. Boudicca had previously been on a rampage (I wish she had captured Assur for me too) and I captured all of her cities (both original cities and puppets) except for Dublin. I was going to use Dublin for target practice until a CS captured it, but it was protected by several galleasses, a castle, and a crossbow. Decided that a CS wouldn't be able to take it and I didn't want it, so I offered a white peace.

Poor ol' Theodora didn't found a religion; I've never seen that. Not sure if she opened Piety or not (I know she went Tradition.) Constantinople had some juicy wonders. She denounced me after I sacked Edinburgh, but she hates Boudicca and she's still paying me a fair price for my luxuries. I think I need to spread my religion (ironically, it's Eastern Orthodoxy) to her cities.

I went Honor opener, full Tradition, Aesthetics opener, full Patronage. I haven't opened Rationalism yet. I was hoping to get the Three Musketeers achievement during the Celtic War, but my musketeers (I had lots of them) didn't kill anything but cities. On the demographics page, I'm #1 in every category, but with only a slight tech lead.

I plan to take the Freedom ideology and abuse Treaty Organization. Should be an easy diplomatic win. So far I'm not getting anything out of City of Lights (I got beat by one or two turns on several key wonders) but I'm getting plenty of mileage out of chateaux.