ASW Helos and Frigates

I think there should be two new units a frigate and an ASW (Anti Submarine Warfare) helo. These should come with advanced flight, a tech sometime after adanved flight or with their own tech in the modern era. The firgate should have stats like 15 attack, 8 defense, 6 or 7 bombard strength, 3 bombard range, 2 rate of fire, and 1 air defense. It should have flags like radar and detect invisible. It should have a transport capacity of 1 or 2 and it would carry the ASW helo which would be used to destroy subs. I read a book about sub hunting a while a couple of years ago and they talked about frigates and ASW helos. What would happen is if the frigate or a nearby friendly sub picked up an enemy sub on radar or heard it on its sonar the firgate would launch a helo or two which would dip a sonar into the water much like how a sub drags a towed sonar array behind in the ocean. Then the other helo would drop sonobuoys in a circle. Then the bouys would ping the area and pinpoint the enemy sub so the friendly sub or helo could launch a torp at the enemy. Of course theres the fact that there is already a unit named frigate so either my frigate would need a completely new name or the old unit would get a new name. Or there could be frigate (old unit) and modern frigate (my new unit). Any thoughts, questions, or comments?

There are already frigates in Civ3... also, it would require far too much time to make art for every unit possible (and too cumbersome, too).

Love the idea! Would add a lot of extra fun and realism to seabattles!

Originally posted by Chieftess
There are already frigates in Civ3... also, it would require far too much time to make art for every unit possible (and too cumbersome, too).

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Not really. I have a steam frigate, a late frigate, and a modern frigate in my game. Only probelm was adjusting stats.

Originally posted by Chieftess
There are already frigates in Civ3... also, it would require far too much time to make art for every unit possible (and too cumbersome, too).

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Those frigates are 17th/18th century ships!

What we are talking about here is a frigate for modern times! This unit combined with chopters would really add much more fun and excitement to seabattles!

Subs are already weak to begin with...unless you want to create faster, more powerful attack submarines, there is no need for ASW units.

Subs are too vunerable right now IMO, because unless you are attacking from a stack of other ships, or from a coastal city, subs are sitting ducks for destroyers. (A '5' defense rating (or is it 4?) )

Now subs can choose their target in a stack, so it can hard to protect your transports. This frigate unit should come late in the modern age, and by then it shold also be possible to build better subs!

By the way, I think it should be possible for subs to only bombard to, instead of direct combat. Afterall they have torpedos.

Protecting your transports is as easy as sending out destroyers ahead of the stack containing transports. Keeping a destroyer or 2 out front, and one on each side of yoru stack should do the trick.

Subs have such limited movement that they are sitting ducks for destroyers.

Originally posted by starrider
Protecting your transports is as easy as sending out destroyers ahead of the stack containing transports. Keeping a destroyer or 2 out front, and one on each side of yoru stack should do the trick.

Subs have such limited movement that they are sitting ducks for destroyers.

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Yes I know, but these frigates would be cool anyway, in modern times!

I think wev need a special unit which has low values in attack or defense- except against a certain unit- ASW helos against subs, minesweeper against mines and so on. This includes more units.

Adler

Originally posted by Philips beard
Now subs can choose their target in a stack, so it can hard to protect your transports. This frigate unit should come late in the modern age, and by then it shold also be possible to build better subs!

By the way, I think it should be possible for subs to only bombard to, instead of direct combat. Afterall they have torpedos.

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I thought of this too, but consider this:

the width of a square is in most cases over 100 miles, i doubt subs can fire torpedos from much further then 1 mile.

you could think, well, subs, they fire and run, without being able to be caught. no sub expert, so i can't have an opinion on this

Actually, modern subs CAN fire torps from well in excess of 30 miles, depending on their weapons.... (they usually like to get a BIT closer though).
What I have found is that subs in this game are unreastically weak. Any sub would be immune to attack from any surface vessel that employs sails, up to about an ironclad. Surface ships of these types simpy do not have the weaponry, or the speed to engage a sub. As well, a sub generally attacks when submerged. For the surface ships, the first clue they have that a sub is in the area is when the torp hits!
I have had battles where caravelles or frigates have sunk a nuc sub...in reality impossible.
I love the idea of an ASW helo! You could also add an ASW patrol aircraft (CP140 Aurora), and could also add a PATROL FRIGATE (look at the Canadian Patrol Frigates (Halifax Class) in real life..they are awesome and as a rule carry CH124 Sea Kings...your potential answer to the ASW helo idea.)

I saw an idea somewhere that certain naval units can fire 1 or 2 cruise missiles every turn with out have them brought from the city- kinda like part of the battle/AGIS/destroyer/sub. These can be an ability after the discovery of the cruise missile.

Concerning the use of ASW and helicopters, I think it should be an upgrade that extends the LOS of destroyers, and gives a better attack versus subs (+1). I agree that subs need to be beefed up a bit too to be more effective. Something that they could include in Civ4