CVN3 - Middle Ages AW (Byzantines)

CVN2 died a horrible, miserable death while I was away, so I thought I'd start a new SG now. The title says it all -- Middle Ages Always War as the Byzantines.

While I originally thought to leave the civ choice up to whatever people want, I realized that we probably don't want to play as any of the really crowded civs in Western Europe and want to start with significant military might. The Byzantines fit the bill nicely.

Difficulty is up to the players, but I think either Monarch or Emperor is best, though Emperor may be pushing our (or at least my) luck. We start out nearly surrounded in Middle Ages, so AW is harder.

Game Details:

CVN3 - Middle Ages AW - Byzantines
Host: Cuivienen
Version: Conquests 1.22
Civilization: Byzantines
Traits: Religious, Seafaring
UU: Dromon (2(4).1.3, @Byzantine Ingenuity, transports 4, requires Tar, triggers GA), Cataphract (4.3.2, @Heavy Cavalry, requires Horses and Iron)
Map: Middle Ages Conquest
Difficulty: Monarch
Twist: Always War

Roster:

Cuivienen
Admiral Kutzov
Detlef Richter
Open

Since the Middle Ages Conquest isn't very long, I think four players is enough. Emperor military victory or familiarity with the Middle Ages Conquest on Monarch/Emperor preferred. So, any takers?

Admiral Kutzov added from PMs. Also settled on Monarch difficulty. Two more slots.

Sign me in Cuivienen, sounds like a good warmongering.

Certainly. We still have one spot open, people!

please clarify rules - DoW required when civ pops up on F4, we get initial chance to trade (no gpt etc) and then we declare on the same turn? No peace with everyone right? or do we just have to be at war with one civ always?

minimal research to LRS, then rush to HC (after trading for HBR)?

Initial builds are settler somewhere in Greece, rax in Adrianople, archers/spears in Constantinople?

Always War means that you must contact the civ and declare war without closing the window the turn they first appear. Non-turn-based trades can be made. That rule doesn't vary, so it should be the same in any other AW games.

I think I agree with you on Science except that Castle Building is a higher priority than Heavy Cavalry for Walls. Growth is slow in Middle Ages, so Walls will be essential. I don't think we can count on being able to buy Castle Building.

Thus:

~ Min. on Lost Roman Secrets
~ Buy Horseback Riding
~ Max w/profit on Castle Building
~ Max on Heavy Cavalry

Cities:

~ Athens should build a Settler or possibly two, then lots of Workers.
~ Nicaea should produce only Workers to prevent it from interefering with Consta.
~ Adrianople, Ancyra, Caesarea and Larissa should build Barracks and then Archers and Spears with the possible Worker in Ancyra.
~ Corinth should build a Settler, then the above.
~ Consta. and Attalea (which we likely can't hold early on) should build Spears only. If it can, Attalea should build Walls as a priority.
~ Sinope and Ephesus can build whatever else we need. (Settlers to expand, Barracks/Spears/Swords otherwise.)

Expansion:

Build first along the coasts of the Aegean and acquire Iron. Then probably along the Black Sea coast. If we can, we should kill the Bulgars early on and settler their territory.

I have a dotmap with Resources marked attached. Red is highest priority, blue is medium priority and yellow is lower priority. White dots should be afterthoughts.

BTW, lurkers, we're still waiting for one you to join!

Non-turn-based trades can be made. That rule doesn't vary, so it should be the same in any other AW games.

Click to expand...

I've played some variants of AW, just wanted to be clear

great analysis. Food for thought:

1st build in Attalea is worker which disbands it. send the worker to Ephesus to work. We can't hold if the Abbasids and their UU show up. Why pump resources into a point failure source?

Like the idea of grabbing the iron to the NW. Consider putting city on river, build temple to expand border and have multi iron. would then put a city on coast & river (one SE of your red dot) between Larissa and Consta.

Much depends on who finds us first, Abbasids or Bulgars. Never had much luck trying to take Pliska with archers and swords (I'm speaking of SoD of 8+ units and still losing)

Like a worker 1st in Sinope to connect the dyes.

I've never built walls in this scenario, maybe that's where I go astray.

good discussion, I'll try to think of an "idea" for next time. PM me if you want the scoop on "ideas"

Wow, what was I thinking? Of course the red dot should have been off the hill on the coast. For some reason I thought both spots were 3 tiles from Consta. Hmmm

Walls are usually rubbish in the Middle Ages, but since this is AW, we'll be playing defensively most of the time.

On Attalea -- I don't think we'll meet the Abbasids early on unless we actively seek them (bad idea), in which case Attalea should be able to rush a few Spears and hold. It's on a hill, and two or three Spears and an Archer should be able to hold off initial Abbasid attacks.

did a few dry runs to gear up - Abbasids showed up 2 out of 5, whooped my spears. i' mellow will go with group think

Okay, I'm just going to start this and hope we get a fourth person eventually. I'll have the save up eventually, but I have at least one other SG to do before this one.

[1] -

Lots of troop rearrangement. I move our Spears in Athens and Corinth to Larissa. The Spear in Ephesus heads for Attalea. The Spear in Ancyra heads for Caesarea. Lost Roman Secrets at minimum gives us +33 gpt.

Builds:

Consta. ~ Archer
Adrian. ~ Barracks
Nicaea ~ Worker
Athens ~ Settler
Corinth ~ Settler
Larissa ~ Barracks
Ancyra ~ Barracks
Caesarea ~ Barracks
Sinope ~ Spearman
Ephesus ~ Barracks
Attalea ~ Spearman

[2] - Not much.

[3] - ZZZ

[IT] - A Bulgar Swordsman shows up near Larissa.

[4] - Consta: Archer --> Archer

[IT] - The Bulgar Sword, rather than heading for Larissa, heads eastward towards Consta.

[5] - Spears retreat into Larissa.

[IT] - Two more Bulgar Swords appear on the Mountains between Larissa and Consta.

[6] - Not much.

[IT] - A Bulgar Horseman and Sword approach Adrianople.

[7] - Consta. completes its Archer and begins another. The Archer attacks the Horseman and retreats it, no damage. Hurry a Spear in Attalea. Switch Adrianople to a Spear, complete next turn. Move the Sword in Consta. to Adrianople.

[IT] - The Bulgar Sword impales itself on our Spear in Adrianople. 1-0. The other Bulgar Swords move back across the Mountains.

[8] - Attalea finishes Spear, starts an Archer. Adrianople finishes Spear, starts Barracks.

[IT] - The indecisive Bulgars send their two Swords back across the Mountains.

[9] - Our Archers and Sword move to reinforce the area.

[IT] - The two Swords and Horseman move back net to Adrianople.

[10] - Consta completes its Archer and starts yet another one. Two Archers successfully kill two Swords, one promoting to Elite. 3-0. A Spearman kills the Horse, 4-0. Rush the Settler in Athens so it completes with growth next turn.

Nothing at all has yet happened in the east, where I hope we can build lots of Barracks and Spears before the Abbasids and Turks appear. Corinth and Athens will both complete Settlers next turn -- one should go on the Plains tile along the coast and next to the river between Consta and Larissa and the other on the Iron hill northwest of Larissa. Consta should probably skim off a Settler soon to put between Consta and Ephesus. Athens can continue building Settlers, but Corinth should start a Barracks, then military. The Bulgars have spent their four attack units given in the beginning, so they should be pretty quiet until they hook up their Iron.

Save and screenshot of the west attached.

Roster:

Cuivienen (Just Played)
Admiral Kutzov (Up)
Detlef Richter (On Deck)
~Open~

got it. I'll be back with any questions.

pre-flight - no changes

IBT:
sinope spear => worker
corinth settler => rax
athens settler => settler
Nicaea worker => worker

873 Settlers start the Iron Rush

876 Bulgars kill our elite archer (while it was on a hill!). Vet archer kills warrior.

IBT horses connected

879 zzz

882 Varna founded =>rax; Smyrna founded =>rax

IBT bulgar sword attacks Arianople, defeats reg. spear.

885 zzz

IBT bulgar sword with 2 bars kills another reg spear in Adrianople
Sinope worker => spear
Attalea archer => spear
Larrisa rax => archer
Consta. spear => archer

888 zzz

IBT bulgar sword finally dies

891 bulgars breeding like bunnies, 4 archers come out of the fog

IBT
Anayra rax => spear
Ephesus rax => spear
Consta. archer => archer

894 our archer kills theirs, promotes N of Consta.

IBT more archers coming out of fog.

897 zzz

IBT iron connected

900 elite archer kills bulgar N of consta. no GL

No screenie. Your plan is holding up.

Good job

Roster:

Cuivienen (On Deck if we don't get someone else)
Admiral Kutzov (Just Played)
Detlef Richter (Up)
~Open~

Pointing something out that I noticed on your turns -- always attack if possible. If the Bulgars have a stack of four Archers outside Adrianople, three Archers or Swords should attack them before they attack. Remember to juggle units between cities -- if there are no enemies near Varna, for example, it only needs one defender. We can reinforce cities from their neighbors with the CxxC build.

Detlef?

Got it, i try to post tomorrow.

always attack if possible. If the Bulgars have a stack of four Archers outside Adrianople, three Archers or Swords should attack them before they attack. Remember to juggle units between cities

Click to expand...

The archers that came out of the fog were all singles. I had to spend time juggling units between Andian. and Consta. until they commited.

OK, here we go:

It looks like a hard one, we have no really good unit stacks and the Bulgars build archers and spears like crazy. To our luck, they have no iron at the moment.

903AD: killed 3 archer near Adrianopel and loosed one sword

906: lost a sword against a spear

909: lost a archer

912: horse, spear and archer

915: nothing (the mountains and hills between our borders N hemms us
a little)

918: nothing (we need a good stack to capture theire capitol, after this
we have better chances against them)

921: lost sword and archer

925: nothing

927: Athen builds a settler next spear

930: nothing

Better luck at the mountains for the next better player.