Governments

I thought I'd post a thread about prefered governments. I have, in the past (civII), been a fan of communism (in the game, not real life). It doesn't seem to work as well in civIII though. In civII as a communist civ I could have huge army out killin' people, have marshall law to keep my cities in line, and still get a new tech every 3 to 4 turns (even with science at its maximum 80%). The best I can do now though is 9 to 10 turns per tech. I have tried democracy and republic before and found them to be a complete waste of time and resources. You have to spend WAY to much effort keeping your little cry babbies happy.

I prefer monarchy for war-torn worlds, and republic for more peaceful worlds. If a world is extremely peaceful, I may use democracy, but this is rare. I only use communism if my empire is extremely large, or I am fighting wars of conquest (pop rushing cultural improvements with conquered people is very useful).

Republic is probably my favorite government, as it produces a lot of commerce, and you can fight reasonably long wars without war weariness becoming too much of a problem. If you build universal suffrage under republic, war weariness is almost eliminated.

Originally posted by eyrei
Republic is probably my favorite government, as it produces a lot of commerce, and you can fight reasonably long wars without war weariness becoming too much of a problem. If you build universal suffrage under republic, war weariness is almost eliminated.

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It's my favourite as well. I usually go from despotism to republic, and then never change until the end of the game.
Although war weariness does kick in when you wage multiple wars, even with universal suffrage and even if you are the one attacked.

loki

See now, I switched to republic one time while at peace and all my peeps got all upity with me. I had to waste production making one of them an entertainer and was going to have to waste time building cathedrals. And I really didn't see that much of an increase in income. Monarchy, three troops and a temple is all you need to keep people happy for a long time. I ususally go right to monarchy as soon as I can and then to communism. There's less corruption in communism than monarchy. I'll admit, this is really just my civII strategy revisited, but I'm stickin with it for now.

You should probably build cathedrals before you switch to republic, and plan on putting 10% in luxuries. Add a colloseum and three or four luxuries, and your people will be pretty happy. Sometimes, your excess gold/turn may go down from what it was in monarchy or despotism because of troop costs. However, your research times will still be significantly better.

I've tried to use Monarchy & Communism but find it hard to keep up in technology. I find I don't generate enough $$ to either fund science or buy it. Any tips?

So, I've been usually a Republic, unless I see a big war coming, then Monarchy/Communism or no war coming at all, then Democracy.

I could usually keep up in funds by selling off resources, strategic to my buddies, luxury to anyone that would buy them. I was raking in enough doe this way to keep my science at 90% for a long time. Although I did run into a problem as I seemed to bankrupt the world. After a while it seemed that no one had any money except the english and the zulus (who of course I was at war with). Since no one had any money, I couldn't make any money and I eventually had to reduce my science to 60% and of course everyone caught up to me. I thought I found a gold mine but I may have shot myself in the foot. Dose the AI frequently run out of money or was this just a particularly bad game for entrepreneuring?

When the AI civs are doing a lot of fighting, they rarely have any extra cash. Occasionally, one will even declare war because they can no longer afford to pay you.

I sometimes remain in monarchy for most of the game, and keep the other civs from getting ahead in tech by constantly causing wars. They are forced to remian in monarchy as well. I really enjoy fighting wars in the middle ages, and this strategy keeps the entire world in the middle ages for a very long time.

I have tried Republic twice and both times it was a waste of my time and effort. I got nothing to speak of from it and the costs were outrageous.

the citizens were always in an uproar, the troops that were going to save their puny little lives [You can't handle the truth!]cost an arm and a leg and the money didn't cover this.

Money was wasted to buy cheap perfume for the masses and I ain't going back there again - you can't make me.

I do monarchy as quickly as I can and Democracy when I get there if I am not at war. Democracy seems to work very well, lots of money and happy people with little spent on luxuries if you have lots of lux resources.

Well, I have found out that republic and democracy are easily the most powerful governments. Simply because they bring a lot of money. Wars don't bother me. I can maintain huge peacetime armies, larger than under communism or any other, simply because I can pay for their upkeep. And with the huge armies I rarely even get any wars, and when I do they are quickly over as my huge and advanced(D. and R. make so much money that I can even pour a lot to research as well) army rolls over them. Kinda shame that they have made communism so weak...

But isn't all the unhappiness under republic and democracy a huge pain? You spend so much time and effort keeping your damn people happy. You have to build the happiness wonders when you could spend those sheilds on something useful. You have to waste time (and money, although maybe the monetary benefits would outweigh this) building cathedrals and such when you could be building banks and universities. One of the things I like best is wiping out some poor bastards that got under my skin earlier in the game. Can you really maintain such an effort with your army far away (possibly over seas) with all the war warriness? I've tried both govs and they just seem like a waste. I just whish they didn't screw with communism the way they did.

Republic is best for me, too. War-Weariness is very little but you don't lose much vs. democracy. With Suffrage and police stations you are able to be at war with the same opponent for 60-70 turns w/o break before ww gets crazy. In late total wars I prefer Monarchy over Communism, because your core cities remain intact and you can rush per cash.

I always shoot straight for Republic. If the world is peaceful, then I go to Democracy, if my empire gets huge and far-flung due to incessant warfare, then I will choose Communism, to give those distanct cities a fighting chance.

Of course, playing a Religious civ helps in all cases when choosing governments!

The truth is that there's enough money to keep the people happy. Only bad point is that when a some faraway civ declares a war. I simply don't bother with them, but war weariness starts to bother me. Well, it's good to have allies(which I have bought with tech and money)on my side to wipe out those pests.

I usually go from monarchy to communism, but I have played as a despotism all the way up to the modern era, and I have played as a democracy and a republic. I was not impressed by the republic, but a Democracy can research so fast that it is definately a good peace-time choice. I say, play as a religious civ if you want to use democracy, so that you can change to communism if a major war starts.

I was having major problems with the Republic switch myself until just recently. There are a couple main causes of a failed Republic (unable to keep the population happy or unable to support army).

The first cause of a failed Republic is the overuse of pop-rushing during Despotism. Now I never pop rush in any city except those specifically designated for churning out units. These farming cities find the largest bonus food source available and set up camp. Pop rush that granary first, temple, barracks, and then units to your heart's content. Usually one of my first 4 cities will be a pop-rusher, planted beside a wheat or cow square. This city will never rise above size 2-3 so take that into consideration during placement. One big "trick" I've discovered is the liberal use of flood plain. I've realised just how amazing flood plains are and treat them so. PACK cities, two spaces apart, all along the floodplain. Make sure to place the cities in the outlying desert since you want to be able to irrigate the actual flood plain to its full potential - no need to be on the river since it will not be larger than size 2-3. Jamming cities along an irrigated flood plain in Despotism equal <b>massive</b> unit pop-rushing. It's glorious.

The second cause of a failed Republic is not enough luxuries and/or a poor infrastructure.. If you haven't conquered 1-2 neighbors and taken their luxuries before the switch you're going to have problems (in my experience). I generally try for at least 3 luxuries with marketplaces in all core cities before switching. Even then you may have to up luxuries to 10%, but if you've conquered enough land/luxuries that shouldn't be necessary.

In a related idea, I generall have three waves of war. The first comes just after the research of Iron Working, hooking up my cities to an Iron source, and upgrading all my Warriors to Swordsmen. I try for about 10 Swordsmen for my first invasion on a Standard sized map. The second wave comes from Horsemen, which I research directly after Iron Working. Hook up that Horse resource to your Capital and pop-rush the hell outta those things. You should have a few pop-rushing centers hooked up by this point, especially if you've started near or conquered an area with flood plains. The third wave comes after the research of Chivalry. Upgrade all those horsemen you've been rushing and it's all over for the 3rd and 4th civ.

I play on Regent difficulty at the moment, so keep that in mind, but I thought the above may help those newbies out there. Actually, using the above strats, especially milking Flood Plains, Regent has been too easy. Monarch, here I come!

Peace

I am reposting a long post from the switch from Despotism thread. I have a few additional comments. I have come prefer Monarchy over Communism for a war time government because the capital and core cities produce more shields under Monarchy. For Republic and Democracy the key point is that you need 3 or more luxuries to make them go. For those who use slave labor, you can build a parallel city to use that land, and limit the slave camp to pop 2 later in the game.

To summarize my thoughts on Governments:

Despotism
Pros:good for war. Can rush projects using population. Four units per town. Two military police are useful for happiness.
Cons: limit to two production on many squares. Low gold. Low research.
Despotism is usually the government I stay in until after the first war phase is over. As to when to switch, I have found Republic, Monarchy and Democracy to be valid options depending on the game situation. If you can anticipate a period of peace and have three or more luxuries, Republic or Democracy are good choices. If war is expected and/or you have one or two luxuries, Monarchy may be the better option. Staying in Despotism has its merits, but you can not get three food or three shields from most of the map. I think the key in timing the switch is how well irrigated and mined your empire.

Monarchy
Pros: no war weariness. Full production from hill top mines and irrigated grassland. Three military police help a lot with big cities.
Cons: Higher corruption than other forms. Low gold. Low research. With Monarchy, it is near impossible to keep up with research the on higher game difficulty levels.
Monarchy is good for a very early switch if there is open land, because it does not take much tech to rush to Monarchy. Monarchy is the choice for wars using Knights. Monarchy can still be viable in the modern age depending on how an empire is constructed.

Republic
Pros: commerce bonus yields high gold and research. War weariness is a problem but less than Democracy.
Cons: No unit support means you need a lot of high pop cities with low corruption to pay for everything. No military police means you need several luxuries and/or wonders to boost happiness for big cities.
Republic is well suited for a time of peace after the Ancient age wars are over. With Universal Suffrage and Police Stations, Republic can be a good war time government.

Democracy
Pros: the best peace time government with high gold, high research, 50% production bonus, and the lowest corruption (though still very high in big empires).
Cons: War weariness is deadly. Same deal with happiness as Republic because of the lack of military police, so you need many luxuries and/or wonders to help.
Democracy is the place to be during peacetime. Mutual Protection Pacts are risky as War Weariness can set in very quickly.

Communism
Pros: Four military police. Some unit support. No war weariness. Superior spying.
Cons: Blanket corruption is often 66% in large empires. Police stations and courthouses are required in every production city. Gold and research are very low compared to Republic or Democracy.
Communism is decent for modern warfare or if a player lacks enough luxuries for large cities. It is difficult to keep up with tech and gold on higher difficulty levels.

What do you mean by "slave labor" and slave labor camps"?

"Slave Labor" means whipping the population within Despotism to hurry production. "Labor/Slave/Farm Camps" are those cities which you use "slave labor" (almost) exclusively to pump out units. For instance, a city located on/near a foodplain will have lots of food available but very little production. And since foodplain can yield 3 food in Despotism after being irrigated, they are a perfect slave camp.

Billchin, I have to agree with you about Communism. It simply shuts down my productive, core cities. Corrupting (more than) half of my core production is not a good thing. Actually, if I've yet to research Sanitation for Hospitals, I switch back to Despotism during war so I can pop-rush improvements and units in newly conquered territory.

And during times of war, I always set my taxes to max. That coupled with the unit support of Despotism allows me a good cash flow, pop-rushing ability in newly conquered cities (which are rather large by the time Knights/Cavalry come around, meaning I can rush a <b>lot</b> of improvements/units), maintained production in core cities, and no war weariness.

I've come to love Despotism.

I like the slave labor idea (again in the game only, not in real life - see the above comments on communism), slaves are, after all, a real (be it unpleasant) part of human history. Can you pop-rush under governments other than despotism? I THINK I tried to do it under communism in on of my first games and though it would have let me it was going to take up 12 pops in a 14 population city or something like that. Has anyone tried that with captured enemy cities? Rather than raze the city (and get everyone pissed at you) capture it, install a gov, and then pop rush attack units to support your war effort. Sounds nice and evil.