Proposal for Foreign Affairs activity, 5/7 chat turn

Shaitan · May 7, 2002

First, my apologies for posting this poll so late. Family visitors prevented an analysis of the latest save game until this morning.

The following proposal is being put up for citizen approval. Due to time constraints it is being presented as a whole and will be accepted or declined as a whole. If citizen response is positive it will be played in the next chat turn.

Background Status:
We have embassies with Aztecia and China.
We are at war with Babylon and Egypt.
We have a military alliance with Aztecia against Babylon.

Proposal:

Immediate: Establish a Right of Passage with China.
Upon ending our anarchy: Establish an embassy with Rome. Establish ROP with Rome.
Upon the termination of our military alliance with the Aztecs: Establish ROP with Aztecs. Establish peace with Babylon.
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Reasoning:

ROP's - Our relations with our neighbors are tense. A Right of Passage is an active agreement that will boost their opinions of us by a full level (furious to annoyed). Rome, China and Aztecia are all powerful and right next to us. China will be pumping out their UU now. ROP carries a much higher penalty for violation that a peace treaty so these civs will be far less likely to declare war on us. The Aztec opinion of us will degrade when we get rid of the military alliance.

Embassy - We can afford only one embassy at this time. Rome is a strong civ and right next door to us. It is more important to begin improving relations with them than any other civ that we don't have embassies with.

Peace & ending military alliance - This is a carry over from last turn's plan. This will leave us at war with only 1 civ and greatly decrease the chance that other civs will be brought in to make Domino, part 3.

Details

All of these deals are straight (ROP for ROP, no cash exchanged) except for peace with Babylon. That will net us close to 60 gold and 1 gold per turn. ROP with Rome may net us some small amount or cost us some small amount - we won't know until we establish the embassy. This proposal includes the flexibility to pay up to 20 gold for the ROP with Rome.

eyrei · May 7, 2002

I certainly support ROP agreements with our neighbors. Further, to help establish these, I will grant the foreign ministry the use of all funds gained from upcoming peace treaties to add to it's budget (I think I can do that :confused:

), as peace is very important especially if we become a republic.

Eklektikos · May 7, 2002

Seems like a good plan to me. The ROP agreements should not only help boost their opinions of us, but also serve as an early warning if they decide they DO still hate us enough to want to fight us. They'll have to formally end the agreement before declaring war unless they don't care about their reputation, which should give us a turn or two to prepare for an attack. So that's a big :goodjob:

from me, for what that's worth.

donsig · May 7, 2002

I voted yes since this does not involve us in any deals where we pay gold/turn.

Shaitan · May 7, 2002

Originally posted by eyrei
I certainly support ROP agreements with our neighbors. Further, to help establish these, I will grant the foreign ministry the use of all funds gained from upcoming peace treaties to add to it's budget (I think I can do that ), as peace is very important especially if we become a republic.

You certainly can. The Domestic Department is responsible for the treasury. Thanks!

allhailIndia · May 7, 2002

Good proposals, but we should be very wary of the Chinese as they have a powerful unit know, something to match the strength of Immortals, with greater speed :eek:

Daaraa · May 7, 2002

I voted yes. I think the ROPs are a great idea. My concern might be if we have traded our map. If we have the other civs might want to fill in our blank spots. I could see ROPs involving small ( >20 ) sums of gold.

Shaitan · May 7, 2002

I've never seen such overwhelming support for a proposal before! 9-0 in favor at this point. I'm tempted to vote against it so it won't look liked I rigged the results. :lol:

Daaraa · May 7, 2002

Naw, you just made a great suggestion. :goodjob:

Cyc · May 7, 2002

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by eyrei
I certainly support ROP agreements with our neighbors. Further, to help establish these, I will grant the foreign ministry the use of all funds gained from upcoming peace treaties to add to it's budget (I think I can do that ), as peace is very important especially if we become a republic.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Eyrei, please clarify just what upcoming peace treaties means. Just for this next turn, this chat session, the rest of shaitan's term, etc. Its just a little vague for me.

chiefpaco · May 7, 2002

What about Greece as well? Also, can we get gold for our ROPs?

Shaitan · May 7, 2002

Originally posted by chiefpaco
What about Greece as well? Also, can we get gold for our ROPs?

We don't have an embassy in Greece yet. They are the next on my list after Rome.

All of the ROP's are straight deals. We can't get any money for them.

chiefpaco · May 7, 2002

Originally posted by Shaitan

We don't have an embassy in Greece yet.

We do. Established during the May 2 chat.

Shaitan · May 7, 2002

Originally posted by chiefpaco

We do. Established during the May 2 chat.

How the heck did I miss that? Thanks for the catch, chiefpaco.

Yes, Greece would also get an ROP. Support for these is overwhelming at this point so there's no need (or time) to repoll for tonight's turn.

eyrei · May 7, 2002

Originally posted by Cyc
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by eyrei
I certainly support ROP agreements with our neighbors. Further, to help establish these, I will grant the foreign ministry the use of all funds gained from upcoming peace treaties to add to it's budget (I think I can do that ), as peace is very important especially if we become a republic.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Eyrei, please clarify just what upcoming peace treaties means. Just for this next turn, this chat session, the rest of shaitan's term, etc. Its just a little vague for me.

Until further notice. Probably just for the next turn, though, but possibly into the one after that.

Grey Fox · May 7, 2002

I voted Abstain, as a protest.

I both like this Idea, and Dislike it. Has our people already forgotten who declared war against us when we were weak? Have you already forgotten their treacherous actions?

I will not stand by an attempt to give these nations the ability to walk freely through our lands. The ability to betray us again.

But as this poll seem to have support from the people, I have to follow it...

punkbass2000 · May 7, 2002

But, Greyfox, as enlightened people, must we not practice forgiveness? Is this not what is taught in our temples? Is there no room for compassion within our borders? I say "No!"

Grey Fox · May 7, 2002

Originally posted by punkbass2000
But, Greyfox, as enlightened people, must we not practice forgiveness? Is this not what is taught in our temples? Is there no room for compassion within our borders? I say "No!"

We are enlightened enough to know that they will betray us if they get the opportunity.

Chieftess · May 7, 2002

I'm 80% for it, but I'm iffy on China and the Aztecs... So, I abstained... The Aztecs are inching closer, and China has their UU now...

chiefpaco · May 7, 2002

I don't trust China that much. They are closer to some of our newest towns than our homeland is. I would not be surprised if they declared war with or without a ROP, or use the ROP for a sneak attack. Rome & Greece are ok by me though.

Proposal for Foreign Affairs activity, 5/7 chat turn

Do you aprove the Foreign Affairs proposal?

Yes

No

Abstain

der Besucher

Deity

Eponymous

Low level intermediary

der Besucher

Deity

King

der Besucher

King

Looking for the door...

Emperor

der Besucher

Emperor

der Besucher

Deity

Master of Points

Des An artiste

Master of Points

Moderator

Emperor

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