Citizen approval poll for the New Constitution

Poll goal
This poll is to adopt a new Constitution for Phoenatica. This poll will approve only the new Constitution. The new Code of Laws and new Code of Standards will be developed and polled separately.

Definitions for clarification

• The Articles of the Constitution are the framework of the game. These are the game concepts and ideas, plus the individual rules that must be considered permanent for the game to function. These will be very difficult to change.
• The laws in the Code of Law are the enforceable rules of the game. These are the general rules and regulations that must be followed for the game to function efficiently and allow the participants to enjoy themselves in a community environment. These will be easier to change than articles but are still relatively static.
• The standards in the Code of Standards are the mechanics, procedures and minutiae of the game. Following these standards will allow the game to flow smoothly and greatly reduce clutter and confusion. These will be relatively easy to change.

Discussion Thread
This document was developed over the past month in this thread and seriously debated and refined in this thread.

Implementation
If approved, this document will not immediately be in effect. This document will become active when the new Code of Laws is approved.

Poll duration
This poll will be open for 48 hours, ending at 11:45 GMT on Sunday, June 30.

Proposed New Constitution

• All Civfanatics Forum users who register in the Citizen Registry are citizens of Phoenatica. Citizens have the right to assemble, the right to free movement, the right to free speech, the right to a fair trial, the right to representation, the right to demand satisfaction and the right to vote.
• Governing rules shall consist of the Articles of the Constitution, the Code of Laws and the Code of Standards. No laws shall be passed that conflict with an article and no standards shall be used that conflict with a law or an article.
• The government will consist of the Executive Branch, Legislative Branch and Judicial Branch.
• The Executive Branch is headed by the President, who shall be the designated player of the game, and shall include a council of leaders, each of whom heads a department that is responsible for one major facet of the country. These departments are Domestic, Foreign, Military, Science, Culture and Trade. Each of these departments will be generally responsible for the items found under the respective Advisor in the Civilization III game and esoteric aspects that fall under their department name.
• The Legislative Branch will be formed of two houses. The Senate will be formed of the Provincial Governors, each of whom are responsible for the care, management and use of the cities and lands of a province in addition to legislative responsibilities. The Congress will be formed of the entirety of the citizenry.
• The Judicial Branch will be formed of three leaders, one who is tasked with upholding the laws (Judge Advocate), one who is tasked with defending the citizenry (Public Defendant) and headed by the Chief Justice, who will have the power and authority of both lower offices.
• All offices will be filled via election with terms lasting one calendar month.
• No person shall hold multiple positions of leadership (President, Department Leader, Judiciary, Provincial Governor) simultaneously.
• The number of votes cast in the most recent presidential election shall constitute a census of citizens (the Congress). A majority of the Congress shall be required to amend the Constitution. A 2/3 majority of the Senate shall be required to ratify said amendment.
• Elected officials must plan and act according to the will of the people.
• Game actions will be played out during a public turn chat.
• The constitution, laws and standards of Phoenatica can never be contrary to the rules and regulations of the Civfanatics forums. Moderators may veto any such amendments, laws or standards.

Yup, I like this.

Thank you, Shaitan.

All citizens voting in here should also take part in the discussion about the book of laws. This is the second part to the constitution, and IMHO the wording and details there are even more important for gameplay and satisfaction, as this goes into more detail.

I am voting no to this poll.

This is a wonderful document and alot of hard work has gone into it.

And the effort is all for nothing because we're afraid to implement it until we approve a code of laws!

We undertook this process because we realized there are flaws in our current constitution. I have repeatedly called for a stand alone constitution that we could have up and running for the coming term. There is no reason why this constitution cannot go into effect without a code of laws. The code of laws does not have to be approved and passed en masse. Any measures deemed necessary to run the government can be passed seperately.

I am extremely disappointed that the implementation clause was inserted into this poll. I feel now that we would have been better off to spend our time fixing the old beast rather than creating this new beauty. As the person who has been subjected to the most investigations I know full well the flaws of our constitution and I am apalled to think that the term four president will also be faced with the same old problems.

I urge everyone to vote no in this poll and do so quickly so that we can start a new approval poll that will allow for the implementation of the new constitution upon approval.

(BTW, just what constitutes approval?)

Originally posted by donsig
I am extremely disappointed that the implementation clause was inserted into this poll.

(BTW, just what constitutes approval?)

Click to expand...

It wasn't just inserted, donsig. It's been there in every list of the implementation and was in the proposed poll as well.

Precedence indicates that we need the majority of citizen responders as well as a majority Council Vote to approve this document.

Originally posted by Shaitan


It wasn't just inserted, donsig. It's been there in every list of the implementation and was in the proposed poll as well.

Precedence indicates that we need the majority of citizen responders as well as a majority Council Vote to approve this document.

Click to expand...

This is the implementation clause I'm talking about:

Implementation
If approved, this document will not immediately be in effect. This document will become active when the new Code of Laws is approved.

Click to expand...

This little sentence in effect cancels out our whole month's work on this project. I have repeatedly called for a stand alone constitution that can be put into effect for the coming term. By tying the new constitution's activation to the passing of a code of laws we remain on hold and with the old constitution and its problems for who knows how much longer!

I am voting YES to move the project along.

I would have also prefered though to take the approach of implimenting this constitution first, then building the code of laws next.

Bill

it is not possible to view this as standalone document. all other rules will be deleten then, as they now are in the constitution. we will be a nation without rules. this document standalone is too vague (well, this was intended, as the details are defined by the laws and the standards).

Originally posted by disorganizer
it is not possible to view this as standalone document. all other rules will be deleten then, as they now are in the constitution. we will be a nation without rules. this document standalone is too vague (well, this was intended, as the details are defined by the laws and the standards).

Click to expand...

Disorganizer, you old anarchist, perhaps you should join the PPO!

Here's one of their discussions about minimalizing the rules.

Well, you should ;-)
I want to have the laws in effect with the constitution to clarify it, you dont. So thats miminalization. But a bad one. Some things are not clarified in the constitution at all.
Not to mention that most of the offices are not explained nor defined or the areas of influence written down.

Originally posted by disorganizer
Well, you should ;-)
I want to have the laws in effect with the constitution to clarify it, you dont. So thats miminalization. But a bad one. Some things are not clarified in the constitution at all.
Not to mention that most of the offices are not explained nor defined or the areas of influence written down.

Click to expand...

Well, I proposed listed the powers in article D and the idea was not accepted.

Enacting the new constitution without the laws is not bad. We could continue doing things as we have been in term three without going against the new constitution.

Would those who have voted 'no' please post their reasons for doing so? If the no votes were made (as mine was) due to the desire to see the constitution approved and activated before the code of laws is approved then noted that here may help to speed the process towards our new constitution along.

If the no votes are due to disagreements with the document itself (or part of it) it would be beneficial to know where the disagreements lie especially since the possibility exists to rectify disagreements via the passage of laws after the new constitution goes into effect.

Originally posted by Bill_in_PDX
I am voting YES to move the project along.

I would have also prefered though to take the approach of implimenting this constitution first, then building the code of laws next.

Bill

Click to expand...

I also voted yes for the same reasons and agree whit what he said.