GM-2 Masters of AWE?

For GM-2 we will try a random start AWE game. I will take the first start that has at least one of the following: fresh water, bonus food, luxury; and is not in the middle of a jungle. As the majority of starts fit this description it will most likely be the first start I generate. If we get wiped out by our neighbors early we will continue with another start in this thread until we at least reach the IW and HB techs.

For settings I am thinking: small map, 4 opponents, low water%, pangea, no barbarians, random climate and age. This is based on discussions in the CB1AW thread and is subject to change if desired by the players.

I haven't thought about the civ to use yet, maybe Egypt? I haven't played them in a while, greece has been overused in AW games (although they do have major advantages), I am playing the Otto's in my other SG. Korea is another possibility, any other opinions?

So far two players have indicated interest: Sirp and Skyfish. I would like to go to a four man rotation for this one so that leaves one open spot - assuming both Sirp and Skyfish would indeed like to play.

I will generate the start as soon as we have 4 players.

I'd sign up in a minute, if there was space but with summer coming on I have too many other commitments. I'll be watching though cause I have not given up on my AW theorizing. China is a good solid AW performer. UU is a little late for AW but very workable.

Too bad, I was hoping to get you on the GM-2 team. Feel free to use this space as a sounding board for your theorizing.

China, Industrious&Militaristic vs. Industrious&Religious for Egypt - China wins that one hands down. Riders are good too, three movement is huge in the humans hand. I was thinking that without the hoplite a nice cheap horse would be good too. I'd say Egypt gets the push there but only by a little. So it's China by a nose.

Korea has the Scientific&Commercial greatness and I was thinking that the Hwacha might actually come in handy in AW with its reliance on bombardment.

One thing about Egypt is that you could run Republic for at least part of the game, if things go well.

[edit] On second thought, that might be wishful thinking.

I had the same wishful thought, the problem is that WW starts building up even as a despot, just doesn't exhibit. Without any periods of peace you would start out w/a ton of WW on your first turn as a republic. I made this mistake in an AWD game once before and it was "game over man, game ove".

How about no China for us Epic 27 players?

I'm wondering how the Aztecs would turn out in AW...no-one has tried that before I don't think. I think that on one hand, jags might have a too-high casualty rate to be usable, they could be used for an offensive rush early, and then provide fairly good defense when combined with catapults, and later upgrade to swords, of course.

Another option would be Japan: probably not the 'best' civ for AW, but a decent one. They'd even offer a glimmer of hope if we have iron but no horses.

A third option is the Zulu. Expansionistic is of highly dubious usefulness, but militaristic is great, and impi will be arguably better than hoplites I think. I really would like to get that pillaging thing that we missed in the last game going

I'm in, but I am going on a 3 week vacation in about 3 weeks.

-Sirp.

lurker's comment:

I'd like to play, perhaps another time when my skills are better. Sirps proposal is exactly the play style that first caught my civ imagination. I can provide you the reports URL, however, you may not want to read it until after the game. Good luck.

Hmm, only Sirp checking in and no other game players. Maybe this is too much too soon?

@Sirp: I generated a start as Korea this morning. I took the first map generated as it had flood planes w/wheat and thus fresh water, some jungle too. All in all a pretty typical start (maybe a bit on the good side) and it looks like we're near the center of the Pangea. I'll post a screenie for your perusal. If you would rather play the Zulu I'm game for that too but expansionistic will be a hit. If we go that route I will turn on the barbarians to at least sedentary so we can at least pop a few huts.

Yeah it might be a little too much too soon. We've had lots of high-war games lately.

The start looks good (although in the middle of a pangaea? Yucky...), however please not Korea! That's basically Greece with a crappy UU. The Greek traits are pretty mediocre for AW, it's only their UU that makes them good. I don't mind someone just 'ok' for AW, but not a civ that's kinda bad for it

Yeah the Zulu are expansionist, but their UU is cooooool, and militaristic makes up for it alot. Also popping some early huts could be good

I just loved how in the initial AW game they got a settler on the other side of the continent, had to settle it, and got a city that they inexplicably managed to hold for the entire game!

-Sirp.

I think the timing is just bad at the moment.

I would like to play, but with the PC problems I just had (and still recovering from) I just can't commit at the moment. That issue, along with several SG entering the war mongering point is just to much.

, there goes another player I was hoping would be on board.

@Sirp: All right, if this game does ever collect enough players we'll do it as the Zulu. The world will tremble at the feet of our mighty Impi!

I'm going to keep this thread alive for a few more days just to see if anyone else chimes in. I'll post a Zulu start tomorrow.

I remember that city! It popped a leader fairly early, too, which became an army, so that we got the Epic early. Once we had a full army there, the AI basically ignored it. Eventually even became productive!

I *have* to limit my SGs to one at this point. Life is moving rather rapidly in a few different directions and I'm in the middle, tied to it in all directions. I don't want to add pressure, which is what a second SG would be.

Fun idea and once things calm down some, I'd probably be interested in another AWE game (I've been dying to try Aztecs in AW, personally, as I love jags. But I'm also a bit burnt out on them.) Japan might be a lot of fun, too. Mongols UU would be fun to play with, as the difference between 60 and 70 shields is much more pronounced than I would've expected. Have the expansionist dilemma again.

Good luck whatever happens!
Arathorn

Gothmog,

As I mentioned in CB1, I am interested, but would also like a short break before diving back in again to another AWE...

JMB

OK, two more of my CB1 compadres are sidelined.

@Arathorn - I understand and have just gotten back to two SG's myself. I agree about the mongols, and don't forget about their resource needs being less. This could be huge in a random AWE setting.

I don't mean to threadjack, but a jag/horse or imp/horse AWD on a small map maybe winable. Luck is a requirement and scouts can get there sooner. I would play in a minute, if not, I could shadow.

I would be interested. One thing to note: you may want to reconsider the random-condition for the climate and chose a dry world to avoid a mess of jungle (or is the game designed to face such situations? ). In one of my AW games I learned to hate wet worlds. I prefer the industrious trait for AW games, so China, Egypt, Persia or Rom (all with good UUs) are definitely options, well, just a few thoughts.
And one last thing: I'm European, so if 1.14 is a problem, I'm sorry.

Captain, would you have room for a Chieftain level player with no warmongering experience....me ?

OK a bit more response, hello to CoffeeCup and Belisar. I always enjoy playing with new people.

@CoffeeCup - this is going to be a AWE game, so if you think that it is winable as an AWD game then you'd be first pick on my team. Seriously, if you would like to play and at least feel comfortable playing typical Diety games you are welcome to try with me. I encourage communication between team members and hope that any important strategic decisions will be by consensus.

@Belisar - the jungle works both ways, as long as our start isn't in the middle of a jungle forest we're going to try it. The point of this game is to win a typical start AWE game. As I said to CoffeeCup, as long as you feel comfortable playing typical Diety games you are welcome to try with me. This will be at the latest patch though, whatever that is. Skyfish lives in France and he is able to play w/us somehow. Maybe he or some other European player could help you (I know anarres is from England and also has converted, Sirp lives in Australia).

@both CoffeeCup and Belisar - realize that any weakness in your game will be highlighted in this beyond Diety level game. Please assess yourselves honestly. Sirp is a well known training game leader and have no doubt that I will have him bust out the on you for public floggings .

We haven't heard from Skyfish yet, don't know what that means. If he hasn't posted here by tomorrow morning I'll PM him.

@JMB - you are more than welcome to play in this one with me. GM-1 vets always have first dibs on any GM game. It is a small map and should go even quicker than CB-1. So if you reconsider and want to play post here by tomorrow.

Edit - ah there's Skyfish simul-posting with me. Glad to have you on board Sky.
Also we're going to try the Zulu on this one, although I do like industrious too (that's why Egypt was my first feeling).

Edit2 - we're going with a four man rotation. I'll post a start and the team in the morning. Proven vet's get precident over unknowns, first come first serve after that.

Damned, I liked Industrious !

@Skyfish:
Do you play 1.14 or 1.21?
And if 1.21: Where did you get the patch for the Europ. version?