Article K: Principle

Please vote on which direction Article K should take.

Here is the discussion.

Poll will be open for 4 days.

Turn Chat only!

DP Discretion - a turn chat should not be an absolute requirement for a forum-based game.

Such a requirement artificially introduces limitations upon the President. To be a citizen - just register at CFC! To be a President, or the DP should the case be needed - that's just not enough! Nooo, you must have 3-6 hours uninterrupted for the turn chat. What's next? Poll taxes? Voter quizzes?

This is somethat that should be a campaign issue for each candidate, not mandated in some misguided, foolish law.

Should this unwarranted requirement pass, the impact on me personally is I shall be barred from even considering a term as President.

That is the choice you are making. Do you allow anyone to run for President, or do you introduce this unwarranted restriction?

-- Ravensfire

I would like to make turn chats strongly encouraged but allow for exceptions. The first option on this poll doesn't allow for exceptions, and the 2nd one makes it "personal preference" which is a little too broad for me. Furthermore, I like the idea of doing pre-turns and individual trades in a well-documented but private session -- no need to schedule a time for that. That makes the 1st option troublesome because it eliminates such streamlining opportunities.

How about "Game sessions must be played during a publicly accessible turn chat, unless an offline session is announced at least 24 hours in advance. The DP must announce reason(s), if any, for an offline session. Any citizen may object to an offline session, and an online session may be mandated by a majority vote of a poll for that purpose."

Now, all of this is way too long for a constitutional article, so how about the simpler:

"Game play sessions shall be conducted in a manner prescribed by law"

and put the more complicated stuff in the CoL?

In the meantime I'll wait to vote until some clarification is made...

Turn Chats, best to have publuc opinion before a president does something that is crazy or requirig some opinion on it as it would be a major deal, such as alliance-making or wars.

DP's discretion. I like turn chats, but see no reason why they should be compulsory since, contrary to popular belief, they do not make the DP any more accountable to the citizenry as a whole than does an offline play session. They are also extremely time & labour intensive, and not all citizens' PCs are up to the task of running Civ, maintaining an internet connection and running a chat application at the same time. Make it a campaign issue. It's not as if we're overburdened with those as things stand at present...

I am in favor of making turnchats mandatory, and my reasoning can be found at length in the discussion thread.

Tough choice.

I noticed there wasn't an abstain choice here.

I would really like to allow private pre-turn game-play `cause that makes sense to me.

I am reluctant to give the DP the power to decide what is appropriate, even if he states his intentions during campaigning.
We need to weigh the limited (insufficient?) information we have on the incumbant when we choose them for President office. In term 5/6 of DG3, I voted for names I recognized, not on any in-depth character assessment.

I am also understand the time-commitment impact of being required to conduct a turn-chat; I certainly couldn't do it.

That is why I voted for DP-decision.

There are aloso times when a quick off-line trade or something can help with forum discussion. By drafting a constitutional clause demanding turn chats we make this sort of thing unconstitutional. That would be a very unwise thing to do.

I respectfully disagree, donsig.

In the event that something must be done at a time prior to the next scheduled turn chat, the President could very easily schedule an impromptu chat (with a minimal advance notice to be determined by the citizens) so that the actions can be taken in a public chat.

This clause does not prevent the President from taking action between previously scheduled turn chats. It merely requires that the citizens be given an opportunity to be present for those actions.

Originally posted by FortyJ
I respectfully disagree, donsig.

In the event that something must be done at a time prior to the next scheduled turn chat, the President could very easily schedule an impromptu chat (with a minimal advance notice to be determined by the citizens) so that the actions can be taken in a public chat.

This clause does not prevent the President from taking action between previously scheduled turn chats. It merely requires that the citizens be given an opportunity to be present for those actions.

Click to expand...

I'll refer you to future judicial reviews.

I voted for that Turn chats should be a mandentory thing for the demogame. That way we can see what the DP is doing and so that IF the President cant make it to the turn chat, that he/she cant blindly snatch the save and play it offline (IE refer to the terms when I was the Vice President to Donsig)

Originally posted by Sarevok
Turn Chats, best to have publuc opinion before a president does something that is crazy or requirig some opinion on it as it would be a major deal, such as alliance-making or wars.

Click to expand...

I caution that for the demo game, those decisions should not be made in turn chat. Those are decisions that have to be forum based.