Barbarians

Barbarians should change with the times and become more powerful as well.

I find it silly and distracting sending a tank up a against a Barbarian that is armed with a club. Don't you?

How about making that barbarian in modern times be a Rebel armed with guns not swords!

or terrorists and their unit could be a guerilla (4.4.1 - all terrain as roads) or something like that..

IMHO, there is a fundamental difference between barbarians (who are simply groups of people living outside the boundaries of civilization) and rebels, terrorists, etc. (who can very well be living within civilized societies but who are opposed violently to the status quo). I like the current barbarian system: I've never had to send a tank against a club-wielding barbarian because all territory has been claimed by the modern age, so barbarians stop showing up. I think it might be cool if there were ways to put rebels, etc. in the game, but I do not agree with making them simply more advanced barbarians. They should appear by a completely different mechanism, such as rebels appearing when many of your people are unhappy. It seems to me to be a contradiction to have "barbarians changing with the times" - if they advance to embrace new techs, they're not really barbarians, are they?

I agree with Judgement. Barbarians coming from the sea in civ2 was absolutely stupid. This was especially true when you had all sorts of ships patrolling the seas. Rebels and terrorists need to have their own rules. I believe that if you want evolving barbarians, then put lots more civs in your game and treat them all as barbarians (the way Theodora does). For that matter, I often play with sedentary barbs on a huge map because their are so many other civs involved.

Think about it: who, in the middle ages, considered the Vikings civilized? Ditto with the Tartars (Mongols).

I've had Barbarians pop up in modern era after cities were destroyed. This created an absence of borders on the map. Call them what you will (barbarians, nomdas, terrorists), it's unrealistic seeing a club wielding barbarian attacking your tank in modern times. Give them modern weapons if they are going to appear in the later stages of the game. With better weapons they'll pose a more significant threat.

Just think of Iraq today. Technically they are not even a country right now. They have no self government. There are "terrorsists" trying to get control of that land. It would sure look funny if these "terrorists" were coming at US tanks with clubs. Instead they have RPGs and AK47s.

I don't even think there should be barbarians that late. My problem is not that they are having clubs in modern times, the problem is that are there at all.
I must agree with judgement. In modern times there could be terrorists but in another way that barbarians are.

BTW I've seen the barbarians with cavalry where I was in industrial age. So I have seen them following the time. I think i must have been a bug though.

what about the concept from (i belive civ2) that when you conquer the enemys city than a few units of guerilla showed there..

I have the same prob with barbs I don't want to capture any mor citys by the mid industrial age and barbs show up every-where with flint axes and horseman (just more than a stumpy club) I think the terorist idea's the best. So I sugest when you raze a city a cirtin percentage of the pop should turn terorist out of anger of losing there homland heratige and culture and they should have the same tech as when they where destroyed. This makes sence since they could verry well use left over tanks, guns, artilary and genral equpipment. One could asume that they piced these together with spair parts and such, this would explain why they exist in a anarchic sudo-society of there own.

Oh yah btw I like doing this so I can up my scientifc spending and luxuries and not wory about losing a little gpt (god per turn).
so I also sugest uping the gold from barb encampment's with each erra as well.

a terrorist could even be a stealth unit like assasin in c3c .. especially if there will be religious factory and loosing of homelands..

shr00mz said:

or terrorists and their unit could be a guerilla (4.4.1 - all terrain as roads) or something like that..

Click to expand...

Yes. And possibly you could bribe them into attacking your foes (to simulate state-sponsered terrorism.)

I believe too that Barbarians can develop into the modern ages. And even perhaps into civilizations themselves?

If for instance the Barbarians capture a city, there should be a possibility that they adopt that culture and themselves become a civ.

But I totally agree that it looks stupid when horsemen attacks modern units. Barbarians could get hold of "modern" weapons through armsdealers or whatever. But I also agree that they shoulden't become terrorist though, they should be seperate.

Terrorist should also perhaps appear from time to time, out of unrest, religious differences and such.

Partisans as it where in Civ 2 should also find their way back to Civ, when a city of yours in conquered there should be some Partizans fleeing off to the mountains to fight off the invasions. Not always, and dependent on how the people are satisfied with you, what population that city has etc, but from time to time it could happen.

You should be able to negotiate with barbarians. For example, I could allow barbarians to live within my boarders, and in exchange they wouldn't attack me and they would side with me in any war.

I can see it now, one of those stupid barbarian stacks of death bearing down on an enemy city.

What are our own civilizations if not barbarians until we make contact (join the rest of the world) with other societies? Even people who live outside the boundary of civilization have advanced, are advanced and will become more advanced with time, not just with exposure to other societies.