Current: The founder belief Council of Elders reads "When a City adopts your Religion for the first time, gain 20 Science and Production in your Holy City, scaling gradually based on the number of Cities following your Religion (bonus caps at 25 Cities). [unlocks Holy Council]"
Note: for the scaling part, the code has a comment which reads "scaler = +(X^2)% where X is the number of cities following the religion"
I understand this to mean that when you have all 25 Cities, you will get 145 yields, up from 20.
Some numbers would be:
5 cities---25
10 cities--40
15 cities--65
20 cities--100
Proposal: It now will read "When a City adopts your Religion for the first time, gain 5 Science and Production in your Holy City for every City following your Religion (max 10 Cities), scaling with era. [unlocks Holy Council]"
Discussion: I have beef with this belief. I took it last game and it gave me next to nothing for my missionary output. The belief is very all-or-nothing. If you get 25 cities and convert the world, you get nice yields. If you keep converting a city here and there the whole game you get barely anything. What is more the lack of era scaling means the yields are mostly worthless later in the game, which is not true for other founding beliefs. Compare, for example, Ceremonial Burial, which gives 10 faith/culture upon GP birth for every city (up to 25) and scales with era.
The change attempts to retain as much of the current feel of the belief---converting other cities for instant yields---as possible while making it less "swingy". By having a 10 city max scaling, converting your own cities right after founding doesn't supercharge you. When you have 10 cities you get 50 yields, around the same as before. Then, when Medieval hits and you get the first era scaling, you are up to the 20 city bonus. This has the effect of preventing runaway yields in the classical when you found quick next to non-religious civs. The continued era scaling hits 25 cities in the Renaissance, then continues to keep the belief relevant (but not crazy) as the game progresses.
Happy to have a discussion about numbers.
Complex Proposal: DLL + Database Changes, hokath will assist with database changes
Note: for the scaling part, the code has a comment which reads "scaler = +(X^2)% where X is the number of cities following the religion"
I understand this to mean that when you have all 25 Cities, you will get 145 yields, up from 20.
Some numbers would be:
5 cities---25
10 cities--40
15 cities--65
20 cities--100
Proposal: It now will read "When a City adopts your Religion for the first time, gain 5 Science and Production in your Holy City for every City following your Religion (max 10 Cities), scaling with era. [unlocks Holy Council]"
Discussion: I have beef with this belief. I took it last game and it gave me next to nothing for my missionary output. The belief is very all-or-nothing. If you get 25 cities and convert the world, you get nice yields. If you keep converting a city here and there the whole game you get barely anything. What is more the lack of era scaling means the yields are mostly worthless later in the game, which is not true for other founding beliefs. Compare, for example, Ceremonial Burial, which gives 10 faith/culture upon GP birth for every city (up to 25) and scales with era.
The change attempts to retain as much of the current feel of the belief---converting other cities for instant yields---as possible while making it less "swingy". By having a 10 city max scaling, converting your own cities right after founding doesn't supercharge you. When you have 10 cities you get 50 yields, around the same as before. Then, when Medieval hits and you get the first era scaling, you are up to the 20 city bonus. This has the effect of preventing runaway yields in the classical when you found quick next to non-religious civs. The continued era scaling hits 25 cities in the Renaissance, then continues to keep the belief relevant (but not crazy) as the game progresses.
Happy to have a discussion about numbers.
Complex Proposal: DLL + Database Changes, hokath will assist with database changes
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per city seems low, even with era scaling.
Fightin' talk
I thought we were friends.
