Indians declare war (TAC)

[HarryHotspur]

I have only played the TAC mode for a week or two now, and even though I love it, there are certain things I do find a bit weird. Not sure if it's meant to be this way, or if it's some kind of bug.

Currently playing with England, on the second easiest difficulty (while trying to learn the new things) but I seem to have run into a problem with the indians declaring war on me quite a lot. On the vanilla version I could have lots of angry indians around without them declaring on me, now though they even declare when there is +2 green (years of peace) and they are pleased with me! The Cherokee and the Maya have both done it while being pleased with me during the last couple of days. Is this normal or a bug?? I keep sending missionaries to settlements to avoid too many "your way of life is threatening to ours" but no matter what I do, they declare on me sooner or later, at least until I can get Pocahontas. Not happend after she is in congress. I also buy their land, so they can't blame me for stealing their land either....

 

[Windfoot]

First read
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=496551

Are you playing with George Washington or William Penn? I'm assuming you're playing with George Washington if you're having problems. William Penn has the trait "explorers" which makes peace with the natives alot easier.

Some things to consider:
1. If you expand too quickly into land the indians own you make them really mad (even if you buy the land)
2. Don't be weak! At the very beginning of the game it's ok to have little to no defenses. However, in the middle of the game and later in the game you need to appear strong. If you're weak the natives and other European players will attack...turn those returning scouts into dragoons/cuirassers
3. Trade goods with the natives.
4. Pay them tribute if you have bad relations and can't handle them attacking you.
5. As you've done...add missions.

my 2cp,
Windfoot

 

[HarryHotspur]

I'm actually playing with William Penn, which only makes it more weird. I have seen other european nations have up to 8 and 9 red relations with indians, and yet they are not being attacked. Last night I was even attacked when I had just got Pocahontas, and had 10 green and 1 red with the Cherokees. It just doesn't make sense. I had at the point of being attacked 14 cities, two of which I took from the french, but neither of those were in Cherokee lands. And I don't really consider myself weak either, as I have at least one cannon garrison in each city, as well as a few Musketeers. And 5 or 6 scouts. None of the cities I have are on Cherokee lands, and I haven't traded with any of their worst enemies. I also give them free trade goods as gifts every now and then to make them happy, but it still wont help. It's just feels weird to me...

 

[raystuttgart]

It's just feels weird to me...

The TAC team decided to have Natives (and Europeans) with their own "character".
Meaning, the balancing has been made to also have Natives that are not very predictable.

Thus you might also have war declared even if you are not completely weak and have good relations.
(If you are weak and don't have good relations, wars are simply much more likely.)

 

[Windfoot]

Hi,

14 cities and only a few musketeers? That is weak. I also usually keep only one cannon garrison in each city but I compensate by have a large mobile army. Scouts are very weak and don't really count as an "army". I turn all my returning scouts into dragoons/cuirassers. Also, building fortifications in the cities helps.

In my opinion you're spreading out way too fast and too much. Even on harder difficulties I win with only 8 or so cities. I think it's much more important to progress your city rather than make more of them. The more you have the more you have to defend. One fully developed city produces more than 3-4 barely developed cities.

Native anger is tricky. To them all white men are the same. So if you take over a French city you get the threat generated from that city...i.e. if the French stole the land for that city, when you take the city over it's like you stole the land (note: if you destroy the city you don't get the native threat). Also, when you attacked the French what was the French's relationship with the natives? If you attack a good friend of the natives they can attack you even if you have really good relations with those natives (i.e. they like the French better than you and you forced them to pick sides when you attacked the French)

Managing the threat with the natives can be complex but it's one of the more enjoyable aspects of TAC.

Happy hunting,
Windfoot